 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2022-10-10 07:05
Attachment: C clamp holder view 1.jpg (139k)
Attachment: C clamp holder view 2.jpg (293k)
Attachment: C clamp holder view 3.jpg (355k)
Attachment: C clamp holder view 4.jpg (359k)
Attachment: C clamp holder view 5.jpg (381k)
In another thread entitled "How do you define facing length?", JTJC stated the following when holding the mpc and the Brand glass measuring gauge in the left hand: "Even holding it in exactly the same place against the mouthpiece as you go through all the feeler gauges and record the readings really hurts your thumb. If you slip even a little you have to start all over."
A short while later, the idea of using a C clamp came to my mind and I mentioned it in a later response. Of course, the top and bottom of the clamping sections would have to have either rubber, vinyl, or some kind of soft plastic to protect the mpc and the glass gauge. Also, the bottom would have to have some kind of a "V" shape to hold the mpc securely.
Well, I looked at numerous C clamps on Amazon, found what looked ideal to me, ordered it, it arrived today, I tried it out and.......it worked fabulous for me!
And, it's cheap....only $10.99!
When secured in place, the mpc and the Brand glass gauge will absolutely NOT MOVE!
Since the mpc is not perfectly cylindrical, it sits at a slant. When tightening the clamp onto the glass gauge, the round top portion MOVES in a circular direction as well as a tilting direction. This C clamp absolutely holds the mpc and the glass gauge totally SOLID.
If the zero alignment is slightly off or if the gauge is not properly centered, merely loosen the clamp, slide the glass into the proper position and retighten it.
I remember an old TV commercial ad which ended with: "Try it...You'll like it!"
If you try this, I feel confident that you will absolutely "LOVE IT!"
Here's where to order it:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B018RLY6B2?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details
Post Edited (2022-10-10 10:13)
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2022-10-10 13:30
Hi Dan,
Great idea and a far simpler solution than the one I was thinking of. I must try that.
Only thing that worries me is if the pressure point on the glass measure from the cramp sits directly over the slight hollow in the lay, which many mouthpieces have, that is just after the end of the window. A little too much pressure and the glass might crack.
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Author: JohnP
Date: 2022-10-10 15:34
I had this made years ago. I got the idea from Mike Meyerowitz who was the principal clarinet of the BBC Concert Orchestra and who refaced and made mouthpieces, some from Babbitt blanks but also some from rod ebonite.
His gauge was better than mine in that the sides were chamfered, with mine there is a possibilty of parallax error depending on the viewing angle. The hole is for a screw which holds a hook which goes over the top of the gauge so it can be lined up with the tip of the mouthpiece.
The lines on this are spaced at 1/20th inch apart which is the way Mike measured with feeler gauges in imperial measurements.
The gauge is simply held on to the mouthpiece with a standard ligature.
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Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2022-10-10 21:28
Hi JTJC,
I really don't think you would have any worry about breaking the glass gauge because the round portion is hollow in the middle. So it's not one solid round piece of metal pushing against the glass plate, but, rather, a circle of pressure pressing against the gauge. I find the shiny, flexible plastic used to be quite amazing. If you just place the mpc into the "V" bottom and then try to move it...it simply won't move. You have to pick it up ever so slightly to reposition it.
As to the amount of pressure that I use...I screw down the round rubber section until it touches the gauge with a light amount of pressure. Then I check for side motion of the gauge at the tip. If it moves, I simply apply a small amount of more pressure and continue to do so until the glass gauge stops moving. I don't apply any more pressure than that.
As to gauges, the JJBabbitt is 4/32" or 1/8" thick while the Theo Wanne is slightly thicker at 5/32".
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Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2022-10-11 03:12
Attachment: Inside Pressure Clamp 1.jpg (338k)
Attachment: Inside Pressure Clamp 2.jpg (290k)
Attachment: Inside Pressure Clamp 3.jpg (239k)
I decided to have a closer look at what was under the "pressure clamp" because I didn't know if it was a thick or thin pressure circle.
When I took the black plastic cap off, (see photo 1), I was glad to see that it was not thin but fairly thick. I measured 1/8" thickness of the metal making the circle which measured 15/16" across.
I wondered about the metal protruding out in the middle so I stacked up some feeler gauges against it. (See photo 2) While pushing the circular section against the upper portion of the clamp, I swiped a feeler gauge across it to see if it would hit it. It did not. I couldn't measure it accurately, however, it looked like a 1/16" gap between the feeler gauge and the center metal section.
As I was putting it back together, I noticed a nice rounded edge on the outside of the circular pressure ring. (See photo 3) I also ran my finger over the inner edge of the metal circle and it was definitely "smooth", i.e., I felt no inner sharp edge.
I like it. Now, I'm going to start using it to make measurements.
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Author: donald
Date: 2022-10-11 07:55
This looks like it will help get accurate measurements, and I confess that - yes, I've experienced pain and cramp in my thumb from holding the glass plate.
However, it's a bit impractical to use for the actual refacing process, where you are making numerous slight adjustments, but then having to check against measurements etc
The "back and forth" between adjusting and measuring would be quite irritating. Otherwise a splendid idea.
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Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2022-10-11 10:43
donald,
Impractical vs reliability...That for me makes for an interesting discussion.
While practicing refacing, I noticed something very interesting yet very infuriating. I found it rather difficult to apply the exact same pressure during the back and forth routine. For example, whenever my thumb pressure was slightly off balance to the right, I got a different gauge reading from when the pressure was evenly placed across the glass gauge. And, I could easily get yet another slightly different gauge reading when my thumb pressure was just a little too hard favoring the left side of my thumb. For me, that was far more than just a bit frustrating.
When properly centered in the C clamp, pressure is always evenly applied across the glass gauge which, IMHO, will always give the same, highly accurate gauge reading.
Yeah, I've been down that road more than a few times.
Speaking strictly for myself, the extra seconds it would take to properly "center" the mpc/gauge setup would be worth it because I can always rely upon the gauge reading to be highly accurate. And, only one measurement would be required.
IMO, this setup would eliminate the advice so often given of needing to take 4 to 6 readings to "make sure" of an accurate gauge reading due to differing thumb pressure placement intensities upon the glass gauge surface.
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Author: Mojo
Date: 2022-10-11 17:39
If your table is a bit convex, readings will be sensitive to thumb pressure and location. It will also be tiring as you try to apply more thumb force to combat this.
I have seen the C-clamp idea before. But the one you found looks really good for the application. I have seen rubber bands, hair ties and Velcro strips used to hold the glass gauge against the table.
If I feel the glass gauge rocking, I lower the high spot with sand paper.
MojoMP.com
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
MojoMouthpieceWork@yahoo.com
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Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2022-10-11 20:21
Mojo,
Good point!
That's why I always check the table flatness first by using the same straight edge used by Brad Behn.
I use what I call a dual axis method. First, in alignment with the mpc table and then I go across the table. This way if there is any slight concavity or convexity in the table, I'll see it.
I'm just a hobbyist, however, I don't do any measuring until I'm convinced the table is perfectly flat first.
Thanks for the C clamp compliment! I appreciate it very much coming from a Pro like yourself!
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