 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: locke9342
Date: 2014-11-16 09:27
Everytime I see people asking for recommendations on the forums i see the typical answers: Buffet, Ridenour, Backun, Yamaha. Very seldom do people recommend selmers is there a reason for that?
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-11-16 16:59
I have a different reason. They have historically (for the most part) designed a clarinet that responds differently than the "Buffet model" of acoustic. The 10 series was an attempt to compete directly and perhaps even the "Recital" was as well.
The original "Privilege" had a sound the competed head to head with Buffet on their own terms. However, for whatever reason the newest generation of the "Privilege" goes back to the same old response characteristics. For me, it does not allow for a truly resonant sound under a mezzo forte and I do not find it to be competitive any longer.
Their horns are usually more consistent from horn to horn with more even intonation so it is a shame that they have decided to go down this path again.
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2014-11-16 22:13
When I was growing up in the 60s and early 70s, Buffet R13s were considered the clarinet to buy. At the same time, I knew several people who owned Selmers (Series 9 or 10 models) and were very happy with them. Our area had both Buffet and Selmer dealers.
For some reason, Selmer Paris clarinets are not easy to find here in southeastern Michigan anymore. It appears that they are available from a very limited number of dealers across the United States. I recall reading on the Kessler Music site a while back that Selmer didn't want their instruments to be sold online, but it's possible that this policy has changed.
Perhaps it's a business decision. The French company knows there's a limited market for professional clarinets in the U.S., and most local music stores no longer stock them. Perhaps they don't think it's worth the money trying to battle Buffet, Yamaha, and now Backun for a greater share of the North American market.
Selmer knows it is "the name"--for good reason--in the saxophone world, and it's very important to them to maintain that image. My guess is that that's where they're putting most of their advertising dollars. The French company (not to be confused with Conn-Selmer) once manufactured a variety of brass instruments, but they no longer do so.
Buffet also manufactures saxophones, oboes, English horns, and bassoons. They're supposed to be decent instruments (every now and then I'll come across one of their saxophones, and they're nice), but none of these other Buffet woodwinds has made much of an impact in North America. I haven't seen much of an effort from Buffet to promote these instruments here, probably for the same reason that Selmer doesn't more actively promote their clarinets in this market.
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Author: pewd
Date: 2014-11-16 22:53
> not easy to find
Yes,exactly.
My local music store has about 20 r13s, a few Yamahas, and that is about it.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: locke9342
Date: 2014-11-17 01:40
Well even if they don't spend much on advertising anymore they must still have good instruments. I mean ridenour apparently doesn't spend on advertisement either and yet almost every recommendation post has a mention of them.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2014-11-17 02:09
I sure didn't love Selmer......
In 1988, I sent back a pair of 10G's that were handpicked, cause I didn't like em.
Was 25 yrs old, certainly old enough to know for myself what I liked in a Clarinet, and what I didn't.
Teacher wasn't happy about that choice whatsoever.
Possibly/probably cause his name was on it.
:)
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2014-11-17 08:32
>Well even if they don't spend much on advertising anymore they must still have good instruments. I mean ridenour apparently doesn't spend on advertisement either and yet almost every recommendation post has a mention of them.
You made a good point. I don't have a good answer, but I think Tom Ridenour is successful because he makes excellent products at very reasonable prices. There is nobody else out there who is doing what he's doing. None of the major players in the industry are currently making pro quality hard rubber clarinets.
It would be interesting to know the market share (pro level instruments) of each of the major manufacturers. According to Lisa Canning, Buffet has 87% of the market in the United States. http://www.lisasclarinetshop.com/site/epage/73462_800.htm
A look at the Buffet web site shows a long and impressive list of Buffet artists in the U.S. and worldwide.
Another impressive list can be found at the Backun site. Yamaha's list isn't as long, but there are still a number of Yamaha artists. At the Henri Selmer Paris site, for some reason, there aren't too many clarinet artists shown.
I really can't explain what's going on. Selmer makes excellent instruments, and I wish them well. It would be interesting to know what their clarinet marketing strategy is. Is the company hoping to regain the market share it once had, or is satisfied to remain a minor player?
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Author: Clarineteer
Date: 2014-11-17 10:45
I know a major player here in the USA that was a longtime Buffet performing artist who not that long ago switched to become a Selmer performing artist after the latest version of their top of the line clarinets were introduced.
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Author: efsf081
Date: 2014-11-17 10:49
IMO, Buffet, Leblanc, Yamaha have similar design. Their tone may be different but the playing feel of them are quiet similar. You can change between them easily.
I play R13 at college and now I play Leblanc. I just tried Yamaha csgIII a few days ago and loved it very very much. It is the most wonderful instrument I have ever tried. Then I tried Selmer, it has nice tone, quick response, but the resistance is too big and I can’t get use to it at that time. Now, I still think Selmer could be a great instrument if I change my setup.
The problem is, if one day I don’t like my Leblanc anymore, I can change to Yamaha CSGIII easily. There is no reason I change my setup for the Selmer clarinet.
It may affect the music store trend to sell Buffet, Yamaha more than the selmer.
Post Edited (2014-11-17 10:59)
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Author: rtmyth
Date: 2014-11-17 18:25
My 1947 new Selmer was excellent in all respects.
richard smith
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2014-11-17 19:48
Back when I sold instruments, I tried to extol the virtues of larger bore instruments and different sounds, among them vintage Selmers.
Now that I don't sell instruments, I'm glad my arguments fell (mostly) on deaf ears. The price of vintage Selmers has stayed low--and that means I've been able to buy more of them.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: TomS
Date: 2014-11-17 23:03
Yeah, back in 1970, the Selmer Series 10 was my dream clarinet. No one played Buffets in HS back in those days, in Central Arkansas ...
But, I have a friend (Bob) that was traveling woodwind professor for several smaller colleges in Arkansas. One school spent big bucks on several pro Selmer instruments (Signature??) and sent them all back due to intonation issues. My friend said they all played on the flat side ...! Of course, Bob was an R13 artist, so perhaps they WERE flat in respect to his Buffet and accommodating equipment setup and personal playing habits? Maybe just needed a little time to adjust ...
I wouldn't mind trying out some pro Selmers ... I have several old US made student line Selmer instruments that are not without some redeeming features, mostly in their nice sound ...
Tom
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Author: TomS
Date: 2014-11-17 23:08
For a while, I think the Selmer pro clarinets went through a "finishing school" when they hit our shores ... I was thinking that Ralph Morgan (of MP fame) was involved in the final tweaks and adjustments, before they were sold.
Tom
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Author: Dileep Gangolli
Date: 2014-11-18 01:34
OK listen up.
There are many good pro clarinetists playing on SELMER.
Levy (Milwaukee), Ruszinek (Pitts), Williamson (Chicago).
The whole intention of the Series 10G was to replicate the pre-WWII Buffet before Robert Carre designed the R13 with the polycylindrical bore that was narrow but more focused in tone.
DRG
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Author: windplr
Date: 2014-11-18 03:32
And yet the Selmer bass clarinet seems to get much more love than any other make, though admitedely that is just my perception.
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Author: BartHx
Date: 2014-11-18 04:58
Maybe there are too many people like me who are not helping Selmer sales. My primary player is a Series 9 and my backup is a Centered Tone. I love both of them. I do all my own repairs and adjustments and, since I don't use them to make my living, have no plans to replace either of them. If there are too many people like me who are not in the market for a new instrument because they like what they have and expect it to last as long as they need it, there won't be much market. In response to the resistance comment above, I cured that problem with a Portnoy BP02 mouthpiece. It made a really big difference. I tried the BP02 because it was the one suggested by my brother's teacher for his Centered Tone in the 60s.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2014-11-18 07:39
I love my Selmer Bass clarinet and Signature Bb.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
Post Edited (2014-11-18 07:40)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-11-19 02:28
OH YES, the bass clarinet is by far the better horn !!!!!
So sorry, I always think soprano when we have these discussions and forget all about the bass.
..............Paul Aviles
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Author: ariel3
Date: 2014-11-20 20:38
I love my Selmer Series 10 Mazzeo A and B-Flat clarinets !
Gene Hall
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2014-11-20 22:19
Experience and set-up do make a difference in clarinet choices. In my arsenal is my trusty 1969 Buffet R13, that I now use primarily for chamber music or smaller ensemble work. My workhorse is a 1972 Selmer Series 10, and in symphony use gets paired with my 1976 Selmer Series 10-G "A" horn. Also on the pegs are my Buffet E-flat, a Ridenour C and my Yamaha Bass. For jazz and musicals, the nod goes to my 1950's Selmer Centered Tone.
Ken Jarczyk, Woodwind Guy.
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
Post Edited (2014-11-20 22:21)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-11-22 17:14
Oh my GOD !!!!
You can get a Yamaha bass clarinet to work?!!?
You must be amazing. What is your hourly teaching rate?
...........Paul Aviles
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2014-11-22 18:51
Ha, Paul!
Sorry, I didn't know that the Yamaha should have problems. I've been enjoying wailing on this Bass for quite some time, oblivious to your expectations.
You don't need to be so snide, either.
Ken Jarczyk, Woodwind Guy (who apparently doesn't know how NOT to play a Yamaha Bass).
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2014-11-22 20:38
Ken,
You are not alone in liking the Yamaha bass clarinet. In the Louisiana Philharmonic of New Orleans, for instance, Yahama (both bass and CSG soprano) have been John Reeks' choice as well.
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Author: Ed
Date: 2014-11-23 02:22
The Selmers I have tried have been excellent. IF I was in the market for instruments I would consider them.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-11-23 03:11
Yes, sorry I typed as I laughed......always a bad sign.
But I DID mean more that you do have some idea of resistance on the bass that gives you a better match here. I HATE the Yamaha bass that I have borrowed with such a passion that I cannot nearly express in words the loathing I have for this horn. I have been fine with the Privilege and the Prestige (both fine horns) as well as some "less than top quality" horns. But this particularly Yamaha has me running the other direction. I own and play CSGs so it is not a Japanese prejudice. Just the bass.
Also the keys want to bend out of adjustment faster than the Buffet or Selmer. I am always re-adjusting before a performance......not good!
I just tried the Uebel Boehm system bass today and found it mostly a lovely horn. The resonance was nice, intonation very good and the quality of construction all get high marks. I did need to immediately use the "half hole" going into the altissimo which I generally don't need to do EXCEPT for the dreaded Yamaha. So I was a little disappointed here. Also the RH paddle keys are quite thin and close together, so I believe there'd be a little getting use to the feel of the horn. But the low notes came out with no hesitation and the extended keys for the LH, RH and thumb were rock solid (unlike the Yamaha).
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: Wes
Date: 2014-11-24 00:35
The most beautiful clarinet sound that I recall ever hearing came from the Selmer clarinets of the late Walter Thalin of the Minneapolis Symphony in the 1940s.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-11-24 01:36
The Boston Symphony Orchestra clarinet section was an all Selmer affair when Gino Cioffi was principal - no doubt it was before and after that era too.
I would have gone with a new Selmer bass back in 2000 but I went with the Buffet due to the keywork being much better balanced - the Selmer bass has some pretty short leverages which make the RH pinky keys very heavy, especially the RH low D key. Even backing off the spring tensions to the point where the keys flap about under their own weight doesn't help. The Selmer bass has the sound, but the Buffet has the nicer keywork - if only there was a bass that had both those maker's qualities built into the one instrument.
I've had new Selmer clarinets in the past, but I do prefer the old CTs over anything they make - not saying they don't make good clarinets now, but they don't make anything like the CT or Series 9 anymore. It's all small bore clarinets to compete with Buffet.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: locke9342
Date: 2014-11-24 01:45
So much love for selmer yet no one recommends them on the forums anymore?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-11-24 02:30
What's the point if everyone's blindly buying Buffets?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: claaaaaarinet!!!!
Date: 2014-11-27 10:06
Wes,
I happen to own Thalin's Selmers. Two sets, actually. Your comment is a motivation to me to put them back in working order and give them a try.
Dan
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Author: Jamnik
Date: 2014-11-30 10:23
First time poster here so don't beat me up too bad! My daughter plays on a Selmer 9 (large bore not the * model) and a newer Recital. The sound to me is like no other. She tried the Signature and it did sound great, just not like the Recital. She also has some older Leblanc Symphonie Model, Symphonie, Classic, and Classic II horns. Her marching horn is the Ridenour 576 which does very well for her also. I am lucky to live within driving distance of Tom Ridenour. He is certainly a plethora of knowledge and a very devoted people person. It is unfortunate that Buffet casts such a large shadow over other professional lines of clarinets to include Selmer. Unfortunately some believe that if it isn't a Buffet, it isn't a real clarinet. Let's quit the popularity contest and take an objective look at the many great manufacturers of professional clarinets and the models they produce! We all prefer a different "sound". I for one don't want to be force fed what that sound should be. Remember that the audience or listener hears a different sound than the player!
Jamnik
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2014-11-30 18:26
Jamnik -
Your daughter is blessed to have parents who know clarinets, as well as living close to Tom Ridenour. I take it from your statements that you are a player.
Your daughter has a nice collection of horns! The Selmer 9 is a sweet horn, and the Recital is a very good horn. I'm not surprised that the Signature didn't bowl her over - as you said, the Signature sounds great, it is a wonderful horn, but it also is an acquired taste. Until someone really learns how to play the Signature, probably with a new mouthpiece that relieves the high resistance built into the Signature, one never really finds the full spectrum of dynamics that the horn can give.
Keep her playing! Nice to have read your posting.
Ken Jarczyk, Woodwind Guy.
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Author: Jamnik
Date: 2014-11-30 19:59
Ken,
She primarily plays a Richard Hawkins mp. Her second choice is the Clark Fobes San Francisco. She is still split between the V12 3.5 and Rue Lepic 3.5+ reeds. Another Recital player recommended the Theo Wanne Gaia mp but I have yet to locate one for her to trial test. As with any equipment, sound recordings never do complete justice compared to live sound and stage acoustics. I was surprised the Recital had such a huge dynamic range. The Signature did as well but she strongly preferred the Recital after playing each for an hour. Her first instrument was an older Normandy 4 probably early 70's so I think she does prefer a horn with a bit of resistance.
Jamnik
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2014-12-01 01:51
Selmers seem to respond well to the Clark W Fobes San Francisco CF+ mouthpieces. They are made to play well with reeds in the Vandoren V-12 or Rue-56 3-1/2 strength range. Sounds to me like you're doing things right!
Ken Jarczyk, Woodwind Guy.
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Author: katiemules1
Date: 2014-12-04 21:23
Buffet clarinets are my preffered brand. They resonate wonderfully and can really improve control of sound. It has been very cooperative in changing mouthpieces and reeds as well.
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Author: Jamnik
Date: 2014-12-04 22:11
We all have a different opinion on what a great clarinet sound is. Many factors affect this. I am not sure but from recordings of Milan Rericha, I suspect that he uses a barrel drilled for a microphone pickup unless he breathes extra heavy while playing with a bell mic. Either way, in my opinion, the sound produced by his RZ clarinet is what I believe to be the perfect clarinet sound and whatever his recording and mic system setup is, it works! Furthermore he can produce a widely different sound from almost flute like to the 50's era ragtime in the same piece performance. The Selmer 9 and Recital to me are the closest to this "sound" that I have heard. Others may completely dislike this sound. Everyone's different.
Jamnik
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-12-04 22:31
I've never liked the blandness of Buffet R13s - they're nice, but that's just about it. Selmers have more character.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-12-05 01:21
Chris,
That's an interesting characterization that I don't believe one on this side of the Pond would make. Say what you want about the R13 (and I've said a lot myself), but there are many points throughout its range where there is exceptional resonance and "character."
............Paul Aviles
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Author: Hugues Fardao
Date: 2021-11-29 01:53
A few words about what I feel here in France about this question.
I went last October to a clarinet day (Jacques Lancelot Challenge) in Rouen (France) and there were Buffet and Selmer stands. I was there to test the new Selmer Muse. I play Selmer myself and love their clarinets.
The story I wanted to tell, is that when students from the Rouen Conservatory went out of the concert hall for a little rest between two master-classes, they all gone right to the Buffet-Crampon stand, without even a look to the Selmer clarinets. We were few to be there testing Selmer instruments, and only adults. Teen students and pupils were hypnotized by Buffet.
Here in France, Buffet-Crampon is still recommanded and played in conservatories and music shools. But it is not an obligation I think, and there is a real interest for Selmer here, some of our best french clarinet players are Selmer artists : Philippe Berrod, Guy Dangain, Michel Portal, Louis Sclavis...
A musician I discuss with on a french clarinet forum said to me that when he was a teen in the '60s, his clarinet teacher wanted him to buy a Selmer (I think it was the Series 9*), it was the model they wanted at this time in his music school. Ulysse Delecluse in the Paris Conservatory played Selmer and suggested Selmer clarinets. In Caen Conservatory nowadays, I saw one pupil with a Selmer Présence, the children in their first year are Yamaha 250/255 players, and the other students play Buffet. It depends, historically, on the famous teacher who is in charge, of wich sound is wanted. Some teachers said a good clarinet is a good clarinet whatever the brand, some not. I discussed last month with a clarinetist and band director, a real Buffet-Crampon addict and lover, who told me my Selmer clarinets are fine.
I believe in the U.S. Selmer refers to jazz and Buffet-Crampon to classical music. In France it's not always... but often.
And if you look at the second hand online shops for private sellers in France, there are twice as many Buffet clarinets than Selmer clarinets for sale. No doubt Buffet-Crampon is far ahead, despite of Selmer is well known as a french brand in France.
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Author: super20dan
Date: 2021-11-29 02:08
here in usa -its still very much buffet in the schools and proffesional settings. i my self am still a diehard selmer and leblanc fan despite owning an r13.
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Author: Tom H
Date: 2021-11-29 02:20
Being a life-long Buffet guy, I always felt that Selmers had a much different "feel" with the pinky keys. I do practice daily on my student model Selmer, reason being I couldn't pass up buying a new one for $165 CAD tax included. It's good enough to practice on and save my Buffet for concerts.
The Most Advanced Clarinet Book--
tomheimer.ampbk.com/ Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001315, Musicnotes product no. MB0000649.
Boreal Ballad for unaccompanied clarinet-Sheet Music Plus item A0.1001314.
Musicnotes product no. MNO287475
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Author: Bill
Date: 2021-11-29 02:21
Selmer made in-tune and perfect instruments in the 1930s/1940s. Yet, for all their build superiority, they lacked the artistic qualities of the less-in-tune, gorgeous Buffets of that era.
Bill Fogle
Ellsworth, Maine
(formerly Washington, DC)
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Author: SunnyDaze
Date: 2021-11-29 11:36
When I went to the shop to buy my good clarinet, I had no idea about brands, and just knew what I wanted my new clarinet to sound like and feel like in my hands.
I tried 5 clarinets at around £2500 price, including Selmer, Yamaha and Buffet.
I discounted the Selmer immediately because the ergonomics was all wrong for my hands. The keys were just not in the right place for my fingers.
The Buffet keys were better positioned, but the Yamaha was the one that really sounded great and had the good ergonomics for me.
I was really surprised because my prejudice walking into the shop had been an assumption that the Yamaha instruments would be like a school recorder. On actually trying them out, I found that for me the Yamaha models were head and shoulders above the others. The Yamaha that sounded and played best was also £700 cheaper than all the others I tried.
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2021-11-29 20:36
Just a reminder:
The instrument doesn't make the music, the instrumentalist does. So in the end it really matters very little whether you play a Buffet, a Selmer, a Yamaha or some other brand. You will sound like you.
Paul Globus
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Author: hans
Date: 2021-11-30 11:35
Re: "....in the end it really matters very little whether you play a Buffet, a Selmer, a Yamaha or some other brand. You will sound like you." - IMO that is not entirely correct; i.e., the style may be the same but the sound quality may not be.
For example, Artie Shaw said that he switched from a Selmer, which he used with his big band, to a Buffet for his Gramercy small group, saying that the Selmer produced the greater volume that he needed with the big band. Listening to those recordings, I detect a significant difference in tone quality.
Hans
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2021-11-30 19:32
Hi hans. I agree. The sound qualities associated with an individual's air support and tonal control will carry over from one brand of clarinet to another, but there can also be timbral changes that are easily noticeable. For example, when Ricardo Morales switched from Backun to Uebel instruments, he still sounded like Ricardo, yet his sound was noticeably different. Of course, he changed other things - mouthpiece, reeds etc. - at the same time, but his doing so could easily reinforce the point rather than weaken it. To my ears, Morales (an ever questing student of clarinet sound) sounded terrific with both brands.
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Author: HANGARDUDE
Date: 2021-12-09 20:19
Hans,
I think it's the most accurate and nuanced to say that it's a combo of both the player's skills and horn/setup that makes a real difference to the sound and ease of playing, and one must not over-emphasize either. Forcing someone to improve their skills and sound without taking into account that their clarinet/mpc/reeds aren't working for them would actually hurt their progress. While I've had my GAS phases, there were also times when I forced myself to play on clarinets/mpcs/reeds that clearly don't gel with how my physiology and approach just to 'stop focusing on gear', yet when I finally tried something else that worked for me I was like:"How didn't I know better?!"
Josh
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Author: HANGARDUDE
Date: 2021-12-09 20:24
Chris:
Apparently your opinion is shared by a number of British freelancers(I'm now based in London)! I personally like the Selmer Présence a lot as well as the Privilege, as they really have that 'bloom' and 'ping' that makes their sound more sonorous. However, I'd say some of the Buffets(especially RC/RC Prestiges, Vintages & Festivals) and Yamaha are good in their own ways, just that I prefer the feel and tone of the 2 Selmer models above.
Josh
Post Edited (2021-12-09 20:25)
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Author: davidjsc
Date: 2021-12-10 07:09
Do Selmers get such a negative rep because of the entry-level Selmer USA horns that many of us grew up on in the 1970s-1980s? When I was in elementary band in late 1970s, it was either Selmer or Buffet that local stores offered to us. Most kids (or rather, their parents paying for their horn) opted for Selmers.
I dunno, I have always opted for cheaper horns (because I am cheap) so Selmers have been fine for me. In terms of 'best' instruments I have, my Leblanc bass is probably the best, followed my my Buffet soprano, but I find I usually grab my Selmer alto and soprano the most often when I want to spontaneously bang out a couple tunes while I wait for the wife doing stuff, maybe because those were my first?
DSC
~~ Alto Clarinet; Bass Clarinet; B-flat and C Boehm Clarinets; Albert C Clarinet; Oboe ~~
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Author: Johan H Nilsson
Date: 2021-12-10 23:27
I think the Selmer pro Bb/A clarinet models are great in one respect: They are different.
Recital: Massive body with thick walls, thereby very 'dark' sounding.
Signature: Blowing resistance (1st edition a bit too much, 2nd edition better).
Privilege: Mainstream.
I know I can pass a blind test with recordings of each, because I did one.
I don't think I would with, say, a Buffet Tosca, RC, R13, Festival, Tradition, Vintage, BC20, S1.
The Buffet Elite was a true innovation, providing some real variation.
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Author: Hugues Fardao
Date: 2021-12-11 00:02
About the actual Selmer pro line :
Recital : exactly what Johan H Nilsson said.
Signature : I found it very resonant with medium frequencies boost.
Privilège : clarity and punch all in one.
Muse : very well balanced and slightly coloured.
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Author: EricBlack
Date: 2022-01-20 20:41
I have been working on this video for about the last month and half and it's finally finished! A trip to the Conn-Selmer factory in Elkhart, Indiana to do an overview and sound comparison of their entire professional lineup (Signature, Recital, Privilege, Presence and Muse.) I also did a quick test between the Standard and Evolution models. Hopefully this video serves as a good resource for anyone interested in potentially buying a Selmer instrument. Please let me know if you have any questions, I always have more thoughts about the equipment I try, but things unfortunately always need to be left on the editing room floor.
https://youtu.be/tdMnWn8hFWQ
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Author: Robert N.
Date: 2022-01-20 22:51
Eric, I am looking forward to watching your video. Thank you for taking the time to do it.
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Author: Hugues Fardao
Date: 2022-01-20 23:11
Eric, yous said in the video the Muse deserves "a special place in the line up", and I agree : this clarinet is so well balanced, colored but not too much, rich sound, punchy without being agressive, and easy to play. Even if I prefer the Privilège, I gladely say the Muse is a top instrument.
Thank you for this video.
Post Edited (2022-01-21 22:07)
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Author: Robert N.
Date: 2022-01-20 23:28
Any thoughts on comparing the Selmers to your Buffet Tosca, or other instruments?
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Author: EricBlack
Date: 2022-01-21 10:08
Thanks for the kind words Hugues!
And that’s a really good question Robert! I really wish I had taken the 5 minutes to record the Mendelssohn on my Buffet Tosca, just so I would have a direct reference point between my Tosca and the various Selmers. But it was a crazy day and it slipped my mind. The Tosca I play on is a relatively covered sounding instrument, perhaps as a result of that I really enjoyed the sound of the Signature. Without hearing the direct comparison it’s hard to be exactly sure where they differ, but I think that the overtones seem to get emphasized differently between the instruments. I find the Signature has a really powerful fundamental with an emphasized very high “ring” sounding in one of the upper partials. While the instrument of course produces the rest of the overtone spectrum, the contrast between the strength of that fundamental and the upper ring is very striking. (At least to my ears, in person. I think you lose some of that detail in the recording.) I feel I can get a similar quality of sound overall (maybe not quite as dark/covered) from my Tosca, but the “ring” is just different. (Not necessarily better or worse either way, just different.)
Sorry, I can’t answer the question that well, but maybe others can chime in with their experiences!
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Author: kerryklari
Date: 2022-01-21 13:54
Most of the comments in this thread refer to high end instruments, of which I know absolutely nothing. But, low end instruments are important too. When my son started clarinet at school, aged about 9, I was told (by the music teacher) to buy a Buffet - it was the "best instrument to start with". Right now, I have in my possession a fairly new student model Buffet Prodigy, and a fairly old student model Selmer CL301. Second hand, the Selmer is worth a fraction of what the Buffet is worth, yet in many practical ways - for a child learner - the Selmer is a much better instrument simply because it's built like the proverbial brick outhouse. It's also housed in a case that doesn't look especially cool but you could probably drop a concrete block on it without damaging the contents. As a complete non-expert, I actually also prefer the Selmer to play.
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Author: ISM
Date: 2022-01-21 19:48
My impression is that some of the older Selmer models, like the CT, Series 9, and Series 10, have a lot of fans and that some of the (very expensive) newer models do as well. But I rarely see mention of two of the middle models, the 10S and the 10S II. Indeed some time ago seabreeze posted the question of whether anyone knew in detail what the differences are between the 10S and the 10S II models, and as I recall there was not a single response. Also, I don’t see these come up for sale on eBay nearly as often as the other models. This makes me suspect that not many of them were made and sold.
Were the 10S and 10S II poorly received when they came out? If so, why? Were they out of step with the fashion at the time? Too expensive? Objectively not as good as competing products?
Imre
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Author: kdk
Date: 2022-01-21 20:18
kerryklari wrote:
> When my son started clarinet at
> school, aged about 9, I was told (by the music teacher) to buy
> a Buffet - it was the "best instrument to start with".
When a music teacher or a store salesperson tells a parent this, I wish more of the parents would follow up with one word: "Why?"
The person may have a million good reasons for why XXX brand is best, or he may just be repeating what he's heard.
Karl
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Author: kerryklari
Date: 2022-01-21 20:29
> I wish more of the parents would follow up with one word: "Why?"
That is a fair point, but I never got to meet the teacher so it wasn't a dialogue. The school sent a form letter home, there was a recommended instrument and a recommended supplier and, maybe it's a bit lazy, but it seemed easiest to follow the advice. I wouldn't have wanted to annoy the teacher! Unless buying 2nd hand, getting hold of anything apart from either a Buffet or a Yamaha would not have been all that easy anyway.
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Author: Hugues Fardao
Date: 2022-01-21 22:27
@ISM -> 10S and 10S II are appreciated in France.
10S II has a narrow bore compare to the 10S which have already a narrower bore than its predecessors.
When the 10SII was released, the 10S was rebadged as the Prologue (with a few changes, like insert tone holes).
I tested a 10S in A, once, great clarinet, really, and some 10S are Full Boehm.
The 10S is not so expensive now, it was a pro-level clarinet and still is an excellent instrument.
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Author: Djudy
Date: 2022-01-22 01:39
I recently noticed more Selmer 10 on the 'garage' sale sites here in France and assumed that it was due to demographics, with a disturbing push from Covid19, the original now elderly owners dying off and the families selling the instruments. If true, it would mean that those owners had liked their clarinets and stayed with them for the duration of their careers/amateur activities. Pure speculation but the ad descriptions suggest this is plausable.
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The Clarinet Pages
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