 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-18 20:24
The Alpha is “mint” 2020 for $475 + $25 shipping. The Ridenour 576bc would be new from Ridenour ($960 without mouthpiece, but including two barrels. I already have a Vandoren BD5 mouthpiece.).
I’m a near-retirement guy who plays lots of instruments (piano, mandolin, banjo, fiddle, cello and clarinet). I’ve added a 1970’s Vito into my practice rotation and just sold some photo lighting gear ($1000) to fund an upgrade clarinet.
I do want a non-wood clarinet for potential use outdoors (and less worries about maintenance). I see lots of suggestions to upgrade the Alpha with a Backun barrel and bell. More cost, but with low starting price for this Alpha, not a huge deal. I’m concerned that adding wooden pieces would reduce the benefit of non-wood?
So, thoughts on which way you’d go? Alpha or 576? If 576, worth buying the “pro” Ridenour mouthpiece?
Thanks for any words of wisdom!
Doug Brock
Kansas City
Post Edited (2021-07-18 20:33)
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Author: farabout
Date: 2021-07-19 02:33
Definitely Ridenour: it plays GR8 and you won't need any add-ons whatsoever.
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-19 03:28
farabout wrote:
> Definitely Ridenour: it plays GR8 and you won't need any
> add-ons whatsoever.
Thanks for the input! Any thoughts about the Ridenour mouthpiece vs my BD5? The Ridenour mouthpiece is cheaper when buying the clarinet.
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: BethGraham
Date: 2021-07-19 03:30
I've heard really good things about the Alpha. My nephew in California has one and likes it a lot. I'm hoping that when he stops playing clarinet I can buy it from him!
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Author: vintschevski
Date: 2021-07-19 03:35
I've just spent an hour comparing the Ridenour 576BC and the Backun Alpha clarinets which I have in my collection, using a Vandoren BD5 (13) mouthpiece and a few Vandoren V12 3 reeds and a few Rue Lepic 3.5s.
Before I started, I had thought that the Ridenour would be my preference because it was my memory that its tone had more depth and colour than the Alpha, but I was rather surprised at how small a voice the Ridenour has in comparison: the Alpha looks and sounds like it has a larger bore and projects more powerfully (for volume and clarity) - for outdoor use (without amplification) the Alpha that I own would be better than the 576BC that I own with this mouthpiece.
I sat for a fair while in front of a tuner to compare the two and found little difference - the Alpha was just marginally more consistent in tuning and also in tone up and down the range, but I stress that there was little practical difference between the two in these respects.
I play outdoors a lot, without amplification, often competing to be heard clearly with trumpets and saxophones. I normally play a Buffet RC or an R13 with a Krass V1 mouthpiece and Vandoren 4.5 or 5 reeds and I find that works well for me to achieve the projection that I want outdoors. If I were to choose between the Ridenour and the Alpha for such outdoor use, it would (based on my hour's comparing) definitely be the Alpha with superior projection and clarity.
But I know other people will have other views, that always happens.
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-19 03:41
vintschevski wrote:
> I've just spent an hour comparing the Ridenour 576BC and the
> Backun Alpha clarinets…
Nice! Thank you so much for your input!
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: vintschevski
Date: 2021-07-19 04:31
You're welcome. Since my previous post I've been spending some time with my usual mouthpiece+reed setup on the Ridenour and the Backun, and a choice between the two is less obvious, so I'd be reluctant to generalise overmuch about a perceived superiority of one over the other. Perhaps the Backun responds better to the BD5 mouthpiece, which to me has a rather covered sort of sound which the Ridenour accentuates - which is why I felt it had a "small voice" in comparison with the Backun.
Overall I think you would be happy with either clarinet, but there's a considerable difference in price between the specific clarinets you are considering, so I'd probably go with the Backun Alpha and enjoy having some extra cash to spend on other mouthpieces and reeds, but no doubt you know how that trying out of "other mouthpieces and reeds" can go on and on........
I remember being hugely impressed by a Vito V40 plastic clarinet - you could probably pick up one in good playing condition for less than the Alpha, so maybe that's a further possibility.
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-19 05:15
Thanks! Yes, the cost difference in this case is significant. Other reviews seem to say both are excellent values at the regular prices, so the much lower price for the Alpha is very tempting. I’ve also seen recommendations to buy both, so I guess that could eventually happen.
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: donald
Date: 2021-07-19 06:06
I'd say the Ridenour, except that hard rubber MAY go green when exposed to UV light playing outside... just a thought (based on experience with mouthpieces, not with hard rubber clarinets)
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-19 06:12
donald wrote:
> I'd say the Ridenour, except that hard rubber MAY go green when
> exposed to UV light playing outside... just a thought (based on
> experience with mouthpieces, not with hard rubber clarinets)
Green? Interesting.
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: donald
Date: 2021-07-19 12:46
Well, kbb music in Auckland had a ridenour hard rubber clarinet in the window for a year (not exposed to direct sunlight at any time of day) and it went green. They had stocked a couple on my recommendation... The UV damaged one got sold to one of my students at a discount - it was black on the side facing inside, and green on the side that faced outside... I had forgotten ab this when I made the first post.
I also have a very green looking backun mouthpiece that was played outside for a couple of afternoon sessions.... IT WAS black once...
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-20 00:48
Thanks for all the nice input. In the end, I wanted BOTH!
I ordered the Backun Alpha for now. The combination of price, condition, and seller was just too tempting. Looking forward to trying it out on Thursday.
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: Tom Ridenour
Date: 2021-07-20 02:23
Regarding the issue of hard rubber turning green or fading; we answered a questions about this on Facebook recently and I wanted to address the issue here since it seems to be a concern for some players.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/Clarinetist/posts/4054522641313097/?comment_id=4055144937917534¬if_id=1626179103976509&ref=notif¬if_t=group_comment_mention
"For all practical purposes sunlight is a non issue. Over the last 15-16 yers we've had maybe 10 or 12 players mention (contacted us) that their clarinet faded. In most cases it was caused by years of use in band camp. Either way it's not even a real problem. It's the dye, rubber is white and dyed black for cosmetic reasons, leaching out of the material. In the off chance it does happen the solution is too stain it back with USMC leather dye. Over the past 15 years I've walked a dozen or so players, sometimes the parents of young players, who've contacted us about a fading clarinet, through the process of doing this and every time the clarinet comes out looking new. Takes maybe an hour to do and then just let it sit overnight.
Coloration, fading, isn't an issue with our clarinets."
This has effected a very tiny percentage of clarinets that we've sold over the last 15 years. Compared to the herculean efforts, which can include spending a good bit of money on after market cases and other devices to help control humidity, that players routinely make to account for the inherent instability of wood this seems like a very minor maintenance issue.
Ted Ridenour
Ridenour Clarinet Products
Ridenour Clarinet Products,
rclarinetproducts.com
sales@ridenourclarinetproducts.com
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-20 03:04
Tom Ridenour wrote:
> Regarding the issue of hard rubber turning green or fading; we
> answered a questions about this on Facebook recently and I
> wanted to address the issue here since it seems to be a concern
> for some players.
>
>
> https://www.facebook.com/groups/Clarinetist/posts/4054522641313097/?comment_id=4055144937917534¬if_id=1626179103976509&ref=notif¬if_t=group_comment_mention
>
> "For all practical purposes sunlight is a non issue. Over the
> last 15-16 yers we've had maybe 10 or 12 players mention
> (contacted us) that their clarinet faded. In most cases it was
> caused by years of use in band camp. Either way it's not even a
> real problem. It's the dye, rubber is white and dyed black for
> cosmetic reasons, leaching out of the material. In the off
> chance it does happen the solution is too stain it back with
> USMC leather dye. Over the past 15 years I've walked a dozen or
> so players, sometimes the parents of young players, who've
> contacted us about a fading clarinet, through the process of
> doing this and every time the clarinet comes out looking new.
> Takes maybe an hour to do and then just let it sit overnight.
> Coloration, fading, isn't an issue with our clarinets."
>
> This has effected a very tiny percentage of clarinets that
> we've sold over the last 15 years. Compared to the herculean
> efforts, which can include spending a good bit of money on
> after market cases and other devices to help control humidity,
> that players routinely make to account for the inherent
> instability of wood this seems like a very minor maintenance
> issue.
>
> Ted Ridenour
> Ridenour Clarinet Products
>
Thank you for the info. A Ridenour 576 or Libertas clarinet is next on my wish list!
Doug Brock
Kansas City
Post Edited (2021-07-20 03:08)
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Author: LFabian
Date: 2021-07-21 18:07
I’ve been using armor all with UV protection on my alpha. looks fine after 4 years in direct sunlight. Hasn’t faded. I suggest as an upgrade is a synthetic-type tuning barrel ($99-150) to improve your sound. A Reserve X10 is excellent with it.
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-21 19:19
LFabian wrote:
> I’ve been using armor all with UV protection on my alpha.
> looks fine after 4 years in direct sunlight. Hasn’t faded. I
> suggest as an upgrade is a synthetic-type tuning barrel
> ($99-150) to improve your sound. A Reserve X10 is excellent
> with it.
Thanks!
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-21 23:41
DougBrock wrote:
> LFabian wrote:
> > I suggest as an upgrade is a synthetic-type tuning barrel
> > ($99-150) to improve your sound. A Reserve X10 is excellent
> > with it.
>
Who makes the Reserve X10 synthetic barrel? I’m finding a Reserve X10 mouthpiece, but not finding a barrel?
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: gwie
Date: 2021-07-22 08:14
I have a Backun Alpha for outdoor gigs I bought years ago, and it's been fantastic.
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Author: LFabian
Date: 2021-07-22 17:18
I am referring the x10 mouthpiece made by Daddario. The synthetic barrel is by Fobes/Behn/Rice/Ridenhouse.
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-22 17:23
LFabian wrote:
> I am referring the x10 mouthpiece made by Daddario. The
> synthetic barrel is by Fobes/Behn/Rice/Ridenhouse.
Thanks!
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-23 16:42
I got the Alpha yesterday and am pleased. I’ve never played anything other than this 40+ year old Vito I had picked up for free in the late 70’s (but I had it fully overhauled in April), so really didn’t know how big an improvement the Alpha or Ridenour might be. I guess I was surprised that, for me at least, there wasn’t a bigger playing difference from my Vito to the Alpha.
The Alpha has nice crisp fit and finish, reassuringly sturdy key work, and does seem to sound a bit better, but not actually sure I could tell a difference in a blind listening test.
I now have two data points on what a student clarinet can play and sound like. Now I can stop worrying about an upgrade and just keep practicing and enjoying clarinet.
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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Author: vintschevski
Date: 2021-07-24 17:17
Congratulations, Doug! Practice is certainly that most important thing now. I reckon, however, that you could probably indulge a bit in trying out mouthpieces. I'm not going to give any reasons for my "advice", I'm just going to put it out there for you: try a Vandoren M15 with a Vandoren V12 3.5 reed or maybe even a Mitchell Lurie 4.5 reed. I think either of those combinations could work well for you. Best wishes!!
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-24 19:31
vintschevski wrote:
> Congratulations, Doug! Practice is certainly that most
> important thing now. I reckon, however, that you could probably
> indulge a bit in trying out mouthpieces. I'm not going to give
> any reasons for my "advice", I'm just going to put it out there
> for you: try a Vandoren M15 with a Vandoren V12 3.5 reed or
> maybe even a Mitchell Lurie 4.5 reed. I think either of those
> combinations could work well for you. Best wishes!!
Thanks! Yes, I’ve been wondering if I should try another mouthpiece or two. Thanks for the recommendations! I was using Vandoren 3.0 (doubt I’m ready for a 3.5 or 4.5, unless those mouthpieces need heavier reeds), but I am trying Legere synthetics. I do prefer the cane sound, but I like not needing to cull through boxes to find good and bad reeds, and then worry about humidifying them. I didn’t love the Legere at first but I am liking it more after some playing time (and learning to not worry about wetting the Legere before playing, lol).
Doug Brock
Kansas City
Post Edited (2021-07-24 19:51)
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-24 19:46
> vintschevski wrote:
>
> Congratulations, Doug! Practice is certainly that most
> important thing now. I reckon, however, that you could
> probably
> I ndulge a bit in trying out mouthpieces. I'm not going to
> give
> any reasons for my "advice", I'm just going to put it out
> there
> for you: try a Vandoren M15 with a Vandoren V12 3.5 reed or
> maybe even a Mitchell Lurie 4.5 reed. I think either of those
> combinations could work well for you. Best wishes!!
I just read about the M15 and its ability to handle stiffer reeds. Interesting! (I ordered an M15. It will be fun to compare.)
Doug Brock
Kansas City
Post Edited (2021-07-24 19:50)
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Author: LFabian
Date: 2021-07-26 04:13
I went on tour with the Alpha, a rimless abs tuning barrel and Legere European reeds. Absolutely no maintenance needed.
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Author: DougBrock
Date: 2021-07-26 05:44
LFabian wrote:
> I went on tour with the Alpha, a rimless abs tuning barrel and
> Legere European reeds. Absolutely no maintenance needed.
Nice!
Doug Brock
Kansas City
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