 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: BethGraham
Date: 2021-04-12 00:12
https://youtu.be/sMtcYBL_dVE
I'm wondering what you think of Lowenstern's conclusions. Agree? Disagree? Anything to add? (I assume that what he says about the bass clarinet reeds more or less applies to Bb.)
I'm currently taking a month or so to play exclusively on my synthetic Legere Signature, which I'm liking pretty well, and am looking forward to trying out the European Cut next. Would love to hear any an all recent experiences with synthetic reeds.
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Author: tucker ★2017
Date: 2021-04-12 06:58
I have tried all the brands in the video except the D'Addario synthetics. Personally I didn't like any of them except Légère reeds, and I'm still not 100% sold on them even though I almost exclusively use them.
I'm sorry he didn't include the Légère tenor sax studio cut reed. I've found the TS studio cut reeds work best for me. Do they play as well as a great cane read? No--- BUT--- they are basically maintenance free. I got tired of working on cane reads to get them to play like I like.
The base clarinet European cut worked the best as far as base clarinet reeds go, but at this point, I'll stick to the TS studio cut.
Now that I know you can sand the Alta reeds, I'll pull it out and see what I can do with it.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2021-04-12 08:12
Two points of disagreement right off the top.
1. Though I appreciate Mr. Lowenstern's reason to use plastic being environmental. As a clarinetist I'd have to say the number one reason is CONSTANCY. Once you have the strength you need (and that takes some weeks to establish, NOT just a few minutes on a short solo), you pick up the reed and KNOW that it will sound the way it did yesterday. It's that reliable.
2. Mr. Lowenstern ends with a comment about how expensive it is to use plastic. Hmmm. Well when I was using cane I bought 10 to 12 boxes a year and would literally go through them in the course of rehearsals and performances (and I think that is a pretty conservative result). Once you have your trusty plastic reeds rotating four over the course of six months (the Legere and D'Addario listed life expectancy) you still come out having invested less on plastic. However, I am finding that the Legere could last a year or more particularly with rotation. That would make them much cheaper than cane.
I trust Michael Lowenstern knows what strength of reed he like to play (although the video seems to indicate that at least with the Forestone that was a BIG problem during the trial) but it seemed to me that he was playing Legeres that were too strong for him. Again, finding the right strength requires playing on one that seem to be working fine for a week or so to see if it hold strength for you (and they do become a bit weaker in a week's time).
So I find that though, cane will sound a bit better in a side by side, the difference has become small enough to make synthetic reeds a viable option for any rehearsal or performance scenario. Their benefits are constancy, durability over time, imperviousness to changes in humidity (lack thereof is a BIGGY), and constancy of strength and quality from reed to reed (the next one you buy will be pretty much like the last one you bought).
I had been a cane guy for about forty two years. The last five have convinced me to never go back.
...................Paul Aviles
Post Edited (2021-04-13 06:05)
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Author: Hugues Fardao
Date: 2021-04-12 10:40
(tucker) : << I'm sorry he didn't include the Légère tenor sax studio cut reed. >>
I'm not a Bass clarinet player but I play Alto clarinet with a Légère Alto Sax Studio cut reed, they are sturdy, last very long, and work better than cane for me. Légère Sax reeds on alto or bass clarinet worth a try.
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Author: BethGraham
Date: 2021-04-12 17:57
I think one of your earlier posts was what convinced me to give synthetic another try, Paul. (I'd tried Legere Classic previously -- blech!)
I wasn't sure that the environmental argument was the strongest, either.
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Author: Ohmgraphics@hotmail.com
Date: 2021-04-13 16:01
I have been a longtime reader of posts, but have never before posted. I see Paul, you write a lot of comments. But your comments are usually one of two things: dismissing people who do not agree with you, or praising those who do. And you seem to really dislike some very good musicians.
In Germany we have a phrase that begins "diejenigen, die in Glashäusern leben..." If you wish to throw stones, you should post your own videos so we can see how well your playing backs up your opinions. I personally would like to hear your cane vs synthetic sound.
--Carl
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2021-04-13 18:05
Ok perhaps you refer to my dismissive take on the EarSpasm offerings.
I'd like to address that.
Some years ago (and folks refer to it to this day) there was an EarSpasm post about ligatures. Speaking of being dismissive and just downright sophomoric, I even wrote Mr. Lowenstern directly about that. Of course his prevalent theme on YouTube is that sort of schtick. There are other offerings of his where he spoke about changing up where you emphasize the first note of running sixteenth note passages to make things smoother (de-program our rhythmic emphasis prejudices); or how to play the bass excerpts from Don Quixote; or "drunk mouthpiece trials" (schticky but informative) that were all quite good. So I mock him in jest.........sometimes.
But if you want me to praise things I DON'T like, you should try telling me how much you like it when I knock something (but I think there are far worse examples of "flamers" on the internet......here as well).
We have an expression here in the United states for those who make comments like yours. We call them provocateurs. Or is that an expression in France?
..................Paul Aviles
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Author: Ohmgraphics@hotmail.com
Date: 2021-04-13 20:09
.............Paul,
I merely mention that you have a lot to say, and never much to back it up. Make a better video with your opinions--or perhaps you would prefer to leave that to the "experts."
And yes, I am provoking you, specificaly because you spend a lot of your time provoking others.
I think you also have an expression in America that goes something like: "Put up or shut up."
--Carl
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Author: BethGraham
Date: 2021-04-13 20:16
I really don't want this thread to be closed down, so maybe you and Carl could take this side conversation elsewhere.
For the record, I suspect that you're not Earspasm's target audience, which is perfectly fine. I enjoy his irreverent ("sophomoric?") take on things: I find it helps me not to get my knickers in a knot about various aspects of trying to learn this maddening instrument.
Let's get back to the synthetic reed conversation!
Beth
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Author: BethGraham
Date: 2021-04-13 20:20
Please cut it out (to use another fine American English expression) or take it to a new thread. Like I just said to Paul, I don't want this thread to be locked due to off-topic bickering.
Beth
Edited to fix autocorrect.
Post Edited (2021-04-13 20:22)
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Author: earspasm
Date: 2021-04-13 21:12
Hi all, I heard about this thread from a friend just now, and wanted to step in.
Carl, I think you're trying to stick up for me. Much appreciated, but I have thick skin. I have heard (and now, read) Paul's takedowns of my work on YouTube from time to time, and it doesn't bother me. My audience is made up of all kinds — but not every kind, and not all the time.
I won't hijack the thread any more, but wanted to make sure everyone knows I'm cool with the disagreement of my style, substance, opinions, and all the rest.
If you'd like to start a thread asking about why I do what I do, feel free. I'm happy to explain the logic, and yes, research, behind my "shtick."
Mike Lowenstern
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2021-04-13 22:36
Thanks for that Micheal. As I said there are quite a few of your submissions that are really helpful and chock full of great information.
I would only add that there has been a tendency of late for feathers to get ruffled. I'm not sure what the cause is or what the best solution would be. Perhaps if we all think of this as and OPEN forum not just for participants but for those just coming in to read and take something from the conversation, we would be a bit more respectful of how things are digested by the greater community.
I try to stay civil for that reason, though I guess sometimes my mood allows for some combativeness to leak through. For that I apologize.
I further assume that we want to be welcoming to all who which to participate. And perhaps having some sort of prerequisite for that participation would be counterproductive.
Look, even a broken clock is right twice a day.
Oh yes, and try the Luyben ligature with plastic reeds........you won't regret it.
.....................Paul Aviles
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Author: BethGraham
Date: 2021-04-16 20:58
I'd be interested in hearing if adjusting the Alta reed improves it for you.
Frankly, a big attraction of synthetic reeds for me is that the differences among cane reeds are just more things for me to have to puzzle over while I'm a student, and using Legere makes it easier to concentrate on other aspects of my learning. If I can rely on the consistency of my reed from day to day, without having to futz around with it, then I can pay more attention to other things that affect my tone, such as embouchure and breath support.
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