 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-12-09 21:31
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HN-WHITE-Silver-King-Metal-Bb-Clarinet/254778907420?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
I just bought one on impulse (see link) which arrived this morning and I've since completely stripped it down.
I'm not sure if it has a solid silver bell or is plated brass - it does 'ring' when I flick it (giving a clear interval of B6 and F#7) instead of giving a dull thud like solid silver flute headjoints. The bell is double walled as is the barrel. And it doesn't say 'HN White' on the bell as others do - I'm not sure if it's been replated.
As all the pads were shot, it was stuffy as anything once I got below C, but it will be getting a total overhaul with cork and leather pads - the large pad cups still have their screw in resos and those pads were installed flute-style without any shellac.
Did I pay over the odds for it? It cost £495 (+ £9 postage). I have seen others for around three times the price, but had all the HN White info on the bell. I am familiar with King Super 20, Zephyr and Cleveland saxes and the construction of this clarinet is definitely classic King with the comma-shaped sheet metal spring catches.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2020-12-10 01:39)
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Author: MichaelW
Date: 2020-12-09 21:54
Attachment: Silver King 2.jpg (151k)
I just offered a Silver King in quite good fashion, on the German auction site, but, till now, without response, for 880 Euros.
This is the model with fixed bell from 1928, N°109529. It is in good shape, overhauled with new pads. It has the solid silver bell, marked with a £ sign, and gold washed interior. As far as I know a double walled bell might not be solid silber.
Post Edited (2020-12-09 22:01)
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Author: ebonite
Date: 2020-12-09 21:55
From the picture it looks like it has a 1010-style linkage instead of a crow's foot. Is that right?
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Author: jim lande
Date: 2020-12-10 11:39
Congrats on what should be a fun instrument to play. At least some of the earlier clarinets had a solid silver bell. However, I just looked at a catalog page from 1940 which describes the new "Thermo" bell with the redesigned double wall bottom edge. It claims this greatly enhances sound. I'm certain that is bogus. The page also touts how the whole instrument is "lined" with solid silver. I don't know what that means but I'm guessing it is just a heavy plating. But unlike earlier catalogs, I don't see any mention of solid silver bell. I'm pretty sure the Kings were silver plated over brass but it always is possible that part of the body is German Silver (i.e. mostly nickel). The lack of crows foot was standard for Silver Kings.
From the pix, looks like you have the Articulated C#/G# and the extra banana trill key. From the catalog, that was standard equipment. But I have seen some without that -- and perhaps those were the ones marked US or USQMC, etc -- sold for less to the military.
Looks like you got one in excellent condition. I have not tracked prices on eBay for several years. Ten and twenty years ago some slipped through for under $200 US, although sometimes missing the barrel or with some damage.
Yes, odd that it has the Silver King engraving and not the rest that they typically put on. Maybe it slipped through or possibly it was a special order. I don't think it casts any shade on the value of what likely will be a superb playing horn when you are finished.
If you do Facebook, join the Metal Clarinet Awareness Group and post pix and better still a clip of you playing it.
PS my 39 King Zephyr is built like a tank and is super. I mostly play a modern tenor that sounds similar but is a little better in tune.
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Author: Djudy
Date: 2020-12-10 14:05
I have a great 257xxx "U.S." , it's LOUD ! The bell is not silver without the £ stamp but they are much more fragile and are often badly bunged. They are great horns when cleaned up and set and with a compatible mp. The 'NP' on mine probably means 'normal pitch', as it plays at 440 not 442. The removable barril is double walled.
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Author: ruben
Date: 2020-12-10 18:10
Jim: what would putting a solid-silver bell on a wooden, grenadilla clarinet do to it? Have you tried this?
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Djudy
Date: 2020-12-10 18:20
This is a Silver King 196xxx with a sterling silver bell (stamped £) and a lacquered finish or gold wash. Very nice comfortable player, pretty even , better for Mozart than for swing.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-12-10 21:31
I've since had to rebuild the barrel as the inner tube had a dry solder joint. Then I found the outer tube wasn't straight either so that took some doing to true it all up so both inner and outer tubes are concentric and also the inner one is flush with the bottom of the socket.
The good thing being the inside diameter of the inner tube is the same as the outer diameter of your regular household copper pipe as well as one of my dent bars so I could mount them in my lathe chuck and slowly turn it whilst soldering to be sure everything ended up straight.
The bell looks like it had the H.N. White info removed as there's some distortion and pitting around where that would've been as well as some very feint signs of the company info. Maybe it was dented and the repair damaged the engraving and it was all removed before being replated. Maybe that was done at the factory - who knows?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2020-12-14 19:22)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-12-14 17:34
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I've finished overhauling mine - see attached photos. Excuse the poor quality as my camera decided it didn't want to focus on the subject.
I'll bevel the speaker key pad soon. I also noticed the Bb trill key flat spring screw took a chunk out of the side F# key pad, so I'll have to bevel the edge of that one as well.
All the screws on this clarinet are mild steel which I tempered blue apart from one - the side Eb/Bb key rod screw which is nickel silver.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2020-12-14 17:46)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-12-14 17:36
Attachment: P2030002.JPG (665k)
And another blurry one. Maybe my camera doesn't like the contrast between the bright silver and deep purple velvet.
I replaced the three original adjusting screws which are the same as flat spring screws with the much larger Marigaux adjusting screws (M2x0.4 thread and a 2.7mm diameter head) as I had plenty of old ones that I reshaped and tempered the heads and tips on.
And it's hardly the crime of the century as Marigaux made instruments for King anyway.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2020-12-14 19:24)
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The Clarinet Pages
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