 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Musikat
Date: 2019-10-10 05:50
Hi,
I will be playing Eb with an orchestra and have been loaned one for the month (a couple weeks to practice, two weeks of rehearsals (four days total) and a concert. Until now I have never played an Eb before.
While I am getting better every day and am figuring out the tuning pretty well, I am having a really hard time with altissimo F#. Unfortunately we are playing John Williams Cowboys and there are multiple fast toungued passages on that note. I have days where it works pretty well, but many others where it just grunts, or doesn't speak until the second or third repeated note.
Since it is not my instrument and I have no idea when, if ever, I will play an Eb again (I made it 50 years before I tried it!) I am not interested in trying new mouthpieces or barrels. I have to work with what I have.
The mouthpiece is a Vandoren B44 and I have tried blue box Vandoren 3.5 reeds, cut down Pilgerstorfer Exquisit 2s, and the Behn Aria 4s. Sometimes the cut-down reeds work better and sometimes the Eb reeds work, but it seems to change with the wind and I need to know when I pick it up in the middle of the piece it will speak.
I have also tried a number of alternate fingerings for that note. Right now fingering high G (thumb, octave oxx xxo plus Ab/Eb lever and the RH pinky) seems the most stable, but it isn't always. Is it just a matter of continuing to practice? Any tips?
BTW E is a little unstable, but I am doing pretty well with that note. I use the rh sliver key to get it in tune, since it is flat. Sometimes it jumps to a higher partial, though.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2019-10-10 10:25
H! I haven't played the Eb in a few years now, it got stolen, but at one point I was able to get around pretty well. I had an older horn, a Selmer, and the upper notes played different compared to Buffets, often fingerings were a shade different for G as you were referring to, So what horn are you playing on and model? There are some good Eb players that can help if we know which horn. Your mouthpiece is probably fine.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: GBK
Date: 2019-10-10 10:41
Try this altissimo F# fingering which should raise the pitch:
TR o x o (C#/G#key) / o o o (Ab/Eb key)
...GBK
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Author: rmk54
Date: 2019-10-10 17:24
This fingering might work better in this particular situation. It is a bit high in pitch and articulates easily:
TR X X 0 (bottom side key) / 0 0 0 (Ab/Eb key)
IOW an overblown B-flat5
The good news is that the E-flat part in the Cowboys is doubled by several instruments, so you can fake it if need be.
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Author: Ken Lagace
Date: 2019-10-10 17:55
If you have to find best fingerings for different mouthpiece, barrel, Bb clarinet combinations, you REALLY have to find those best fingerings on each Eb clarinet. The smaller dimensions make everything Eb more critical. No trouble getting uo to the A and Bb above that in tune with my fingerings on a refaced Bundy mouthpiece and my ancient Selmer, but it did take time and sweat to find them.
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Author: Ebclarinet1
Date: 2019-10-10 22:17
I agree with rmk54 on the F# fingering. It is the one I use on Till Eulenspiegel too to make the quick jump to the D.
I find that a good secure high E is to overblow G#. I sometimes add the C#/F# key to slightly flatten the note. That seems to work better with the piccolo in tutti passages.
Eefer guy
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Author: Musikat
Date: 2019-10-11 04:12
The clarinet is an older Selmer. I tried the suggested fingerings and rmk54's works but is harder to do in a fast passage. I did find that adding the first two fingers of the right hand without the side key works pretty well, at least today. LOL
So TR XX0 XX0 Ab/Eb. It is still slightly on the flat side but I think I can lip up. The problem is the lower and mid range run very sharp. I am using the longest of three barrels that were in the case to get the rest of the notes closer, in tune but the altissimo is of course naturally flat. This is the opposite of my R13, which runs sharp, even in the altissimo (although F# is always flat).
RMK, I had thought about that part being tutti. If all else fails I'll take the E and F# down an octave and play the rest as written. It is more of a personal challenge to get it right.
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Author: DougR
Date: 2019-10-11 15:58
Musikat, I'm right where you are (except without the time pressure). I acquired an old Bundy Eb and am having the same challenges you are. I combed the thread archives here and copied relevant comments into an email blank for my own use, which I will send you.
Your setup sounds fine. The top 2 tips I got from my teacher when I brought the Eb out for a lesson the first time were: take in more mouthpiece than you're maybe used to, and USE MORE AIR. it absolutely requires a firmer airstream than say a Bb clarinet.
There are some useful Youtube "how to play Eb" snippets; Jessica Phillips has several up that are worthwhile.
And here's a Youtube video for inspiration, perhaps:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qR21aOMtLp0
I'm actually getting to like the instrument, after a couple months hacking away at it. I do seem to have an automatic tendency to bite harder the higher up I go, and that's not good for the reed (it squashes it & changes its playing characteristics) and not effective for producing an altissimo sound either.
Good luck! Report back!
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Author: Reedman1908
Date: 2019-10-12 01:46
The Eb is difficult to sort out in such a short time. I play Eb in 2 wind ensembles, and the Eb gets a workout! Good luck to you! My experience with vandoren mouthpieces and reeds over the years has landed on their new Black Diamond mouthpiece with V12 #3 reeds. Read VD marketing and they mention that the BD is the new standard in Eb. Marketing hype perhaps but my experience supports the claim. I had my Eb overhauled by a pro who also plays. What an improvement especially in the high register. I double on Bb, and switching over in the middle of a piece and nailing it on Eb the first note is difficult. Playing Eb, like good scotch, is an acquired taste!
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Author: EbClarinet
Date: 2019-10-12 10:57
I'm an Eb Clarinet specialist. I've been playing since I was 28 and I'm 47 now. That particular F# is out of tune on most Eb Clarinets. Mine is almost 40 cents flat. If you choose to play it then use the fingering that works best but you're going to have to BITE to play up there in "tune." I don't know the song but if you have any thing higher than that then you're going to have to lip those notes down, which is NOT easy 2 do in rapid passages. You've already hit the nail on the head to play it down an octave.
I played The Nutcracker on Eb and I had an A to F slurred in a sixteenth note passage. There was NO way to blow through that so rapidly so I took that run down and octave. My junior high school band director played 1st flute (she's older and retired) had a super C on flute that she took down an octave.
In the college band I came out of, the 1st chair Bb Clarinet player told me the Eb clarinet player took a LOT down an octave to play in tune. How ever, that takes all the fun out of mastering the Eb. My best advice would be to play some long tones from the low E all the way to the altissimo G and play around with a tuner and see what you can do lip wise. Your reeds and mouth piece set up sounds fine.
Hope this helps!
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/mbtldsongministry/
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Author: Alexis
Date: 2019-10-12 11:15
Hi
I play Eb with some orchestras in London. Every instrument is different, but it sounds yours works some of time - to me this suggests you are doing something different each time you play, probably in response to the difficulty.
If you have time, experiment with playing the f sharp without articulation, and concentrate on the speed of air needed, and corresponding abdominal effort. If you can do that, then see if you can use the tongue to separate consecutive notes, while keeping same support.
Generally, a lighter tongue stroke is better and may almost be a breath attack to start. Try to hit the same part of the reed everytime. But really, it is an air speed and consistency issue in my opinion.
I’m not sure that I agree with instructions to bite - I think I try to focus from sides of my mouth a little more.
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