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 legeres again
Author: rgoldem 
Date:   2019-07-16 21:24

Do legeres get softer by using them intensively as it happens with cane reeds?



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 Re: legeres again
Author: shmuelyosef 
Date:   2019-07-16 22:49

That has not been my experience. They do seem to 'loosen up' in the first 10-20 minutes of playing but then they are stable until you damage them or they develop a small split at the tip (after 1-2 years in the rotation). The clarinet reeds (for me) seem to be lasting forever...the baritone sax reeds last about a year in a rotation of 2-3 reeds (I play bari in a big band...loud and often). Seems to be a function of size.

The best thing about them (other than the consistency) is that they never "hard fail". I have had cane reeds fail suddenly in awkward settings, but the Legere reeds give you warning; they continue to be playable with a small split (1-2 mm).

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 Re: legeres again
Author: kdk 2017
Date:   2019-07-16 23:30

I haven't found that to be true. But I have found that they soften after about an hour of playing and then recover after being put away until the next day. So, I have to plan on at least two reeds to get through a 2.5 hr rehearsal or a concert.

Karl

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 Re: legeres again
Author: Paul Aviles 
Date:   2019-07-17 00:27

Interesting that our experiences vary quite a bit. My experience is that the strength loosens over the course of three days or so but seems to level out at that point. I do rotate five reeds and that may help allow the reed to "spring back" (which has been my intent with the purposeful rotation). I hypothesize that players with longer lays and firmer embouchures may experience more strength loss over time (body heat and pressure are just the things that would cause plastic to take on a new shape).





..............Paul Aviles



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 Re: legeres again
Author: Tony F 
Date:   2019-07-17 02:58

I've found that they soften slightly after half an hour or so, but return to the original condition by the following day. I also find that over a more extended period of time, perhaps 6 months or more they soften by around half a unit (3 to 2.5) and that this is permanent. After this they stabilize at that level. Eventually they gradually lose their tone and sound a bit dead, but that is much later.

Tony F.

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 Re: legeres again
Author: jeeves 
Date:   2019-07-17 05:31

I find that they lose about 1/4-1/2 strength over time (within a couple months if I'm rotating between a few reeds). I wonder if it has something to do with the way I store them; I just use the plastic holders that Vandoren reeds come in (have a bunch of old ones lying around), and perhaps over time sliding them in and out removes a non-trivial amount of material.

Legere reeds are made of polypropylene, and according to wikipedia, PP can develop cracks and crazing overtime: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polypropylene#Degradation.

Perhaps someone with a microscope could compare new and worn out Legeres to see if there is any obvious cracking/crazing.

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 Re: legeres again
Author: Mojo 
Date:   2019-07-17 16:29

I was pondering the physics of the softening. It is due to several sources: reversible and irreversible. Temperature is probably one but would happen (warm up) in a few minutes I think, not an hour. Minute cracking over time would be irreversible wear. I have not seen that in my Legeres but I am just looking by eye. I used to see a lot of cracking in Bari plastic reeds years ago when I was playing them on sax.

MojoMP.com
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
MojoMouthpieceWork@yahoo.com

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 Re: legeres again
Author: SunnyDaze 
Date:   2019-07-17 17:18

Hi,

re:http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=475548&t=475548

If you think it is minute cracking then I could spot that with my microscope. Maybe you could keep one of those reeds until it is completely unusable and then post it to me, and I could take photos of it close up to see if there are cracks?

Sunny

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 Re: legeres again
Author: jeeves 
Date:   2019-07-17 17:34

I can send you one of my worn-out Legeres; it's not completely unusable, but it has definitely weakened considerably over time. If you send me your address, I can mail it out to you this weekend. My email should be visible on my profile page.

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 Re: legeres again
Author: avins 
Date:   2019-07-19 23:53

Ive mentioned this in another thread, Just wondering if its just me who has problem in the high tones , from c ( above the stave) in staccato , with my legere euro cut and signature 3 1/4 and 3 1/2, which I quite easilly do up to high g with VD trad 3 and v12 3 ,
I was thinking that perhaps it has to do with the age of my reeds which I have since 2015 and the eauro from 2016. I didnt play much on these reeds as I stoped playing soon after buying them but maybe they tend to dry up , Im going to check, as mentioned here for any cracks . Anyway ,my question is wheather you find the upper register as "accessible" as with cane reeds
I use VD bd5 on R13 Buffet
I really hope to succeed with the legers because they are, other than those high tones, really just beautiful
Thanks for any feedbacks
Avins

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 Re: legeres again
Author: Paul Aviles 
Date:   2019-07-20 07:43

I think there are enough top players out there using Legere that demonstrate their ability to perform through the entire range of the horn.



I had answered in the earlier thread but I think I may have described things poorly. With cane we can "muscle" a reed that is too hard by bearing down on it and affectively making the aperture smaller, as if the mouthpiece had a smaller tip opening than it does. Cane being more forgiving (one of the things that cane does better than plastic) will then play fine under these conditions. The plastic reeds are dependent on more of the affective dimensions being in play. So when one bears down on a plastic reed it leaves you with the remainder that is now even harder (the tip is thicker on harder strengths), so you get the impression that it just "collapses" but it really just doesn't want to vibrate much at all.


Getting the right strength for the reed is so important. It is also important to know what the correct amount of embouchure support is. The good news is that when you get it, it turns out to be much less effort.





..............Paul Aviles



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 Re: legeres again
Author: avins 
Date:   2019-07-21 20:05

Thanks Paul , you must be right because I find that with the ordinary signature reeds , I get to those high tones easier , probably, as you say, because they are thinner , or at least the tips are thinner ,
I've ordered an m15 MP as I want to try out a narrower tip gap , once and for all, and I'm wondering how those higher notes would be then ...
Anyway , if that doesnt work I'd just continue with the Trad and V12 reeds , together with legers , more for practice probably
Avins



Post Edited (2019-07-21 20:08)

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 Re: legeres again
Author: Gary 
Date:   2019-07-23 01:57

I love Legere. My experience is that Signature Models are my choice (3.25 rather than 3.5 with VD V12 or Rue Lepic). Not sure how long they last but it's lengthy. The failure mode I have noticed is at the very tip of the reed. I have observed the very brief warm-up time and then no appreciable difference until in the future I notice the tip failure mode begin to evidence itself. Sometimes I have found that I can go back to the old ones but not often.. I also tried the European cut at the same strength I was using with the Signatures and found them to be much easier to blow with a strong tone but without the same tone control. Thinking I may try some higher number Europeans. I use a Hite D mouthpiece.

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 Re: legeres again
Author: Paul Aviles 
Date:   2019-07-23 04:27

Hey Gary,


Can you be more specific about "tip failure?" Is it a noticeable mushiness at the very tip or something else? I never really noticed much about the tip. It does seem that the Legeres start off being pretty flat (though there is some concavity even with the new ones straight out of the box) and then seem to take on a bit more curve down toward the mouthpiece (hence my belief that is really nothing more than the physicality of the whole embouchure and process of playing that just causes them to eventually close down more and more toward the mouthpiece).



.............Paul Aviles



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 Re: legeres again
Author: avins 
Date:   2019-07-28 16:09

I've finally received the M15 profile 88 and I am so happy I got it.
This MP works beautifully with the Legere Euro 3.5 , Unfortunately not so ideal with the VD trad 3 and 3.5 and V12's . I get a beautiful big clear sound and good high tones , well, I go quite easilly upto high G /

the Trad are very compatible with the BD5 , so my set up for now will be M15 for Legere and Trads and V12 for BD5 . I will get a sample of Legere 3.75 , and who knows , perhaps just play Legere exclusively .
Avins

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