 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: DD
Date: 2018-12-29 09:01
Has anyone tried or is using Vandoren BD5 mouthpiece? What do you think about it? I am currently playing M30 and is pleased with it, but am curious to know about BD5
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2018-12-29 13:26
Read past posts. A lot of people use this mouthpiece. And a lot of people have them refaced because they are too open.
The tip opening is around 1.13mm's and I've seen them as open as 1.20. Quality control sucks. Tables are not flat. The rails are often uneven. You have have to play 10 or more to find one that works. If the tables are not flat you may have a really hard time find reeds that play. Maybe 1 out of 20 reeds will pass for concert playing.
They also Make a BD5 442 that tunes higher instead of 440.
They aren't too bad if you have them refaced and the table squared. There are better mouthpieces on the market. You have to find someone that knows how to make the table flat and it can take a gifted refacer an hour or 2 to do this. Using 10,000 grit sandpaper is often needed to get this flat and square.
Buy something else to keep sane!
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2018-12-29 13:33)
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Author: DD
Date: 2018-12-29 19:55
Thanks Bob for the great advice. What other mouthpieces do you recommend ?
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2018-12-29 23:36
10,000 grit is hard to find and I use it too as the final stage in polishing the table, yet removing any remaining flaws. For those interested you can get higher grit sandpaper from Germany; such as 3000 to 10,000.
I like the Selmer Concept mouthpieces, but some minor adjustments are needed.
Same with the Yamaha Custom mouthpieces, which are too open at 1.22 or so, once they faced down to maybe 1.10 or less they are pretty amazing.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2018-12-29 23:39)
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Author: fernie121
Date: 2018-12-29 23:52
I use a BD5 refaced by Bernardo and I like it a lot. It was just too tiring to play before. I use it mainly for classical stuff. I actually really like the M30 for pop and jazz, and find it works well with synthetic reeds.
If I am playing something that requires lots of glissandos and multiphonics, I play a B40.
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Author: donald
Date: 2018-12-30 09:10
I'm no fan of the BD5, and I'm certain that you are correct- YOU (fernie121) like the refaced version better than the BD5 (I probably would too). The OP of course might very well be perfectly happy with the BD5 (especially if they currently play an M30) as are a number of very fine professional players I've heard and worked with (including Principal players in 2 fine international orchestras that I played 2nd to, and one European colleague who won a trial in a major orchestra playing on a BD5.
I can't play a B40 for more than about 2 minutes before my embouchure gets tired, but one of the players who sound I really admire uses factory B40s (actually now I think about it, 2 players who I really admire). That's how it goes with mouthpieces- "one person's junk is another person's treasure". I suppose I could get the B40 refaced so it suited me better, but it would make more sense to find a mouthpiece that suited me better and buy that.
I would say that if the OP already plays an M30 they would find the BD5 to be in a similar "ball park" but with a slightly different voicing. The basic core sound is less bright/ringy than the M30- but because there's also more "body" built into the tone you have a bit more leeway to brighten up the sound with your air-stream before it starts to get edgy. So, because the mouthpiece has been designed to be "a bit on the dark side", you actually have a bit more flexibility. The M30 is a brighter blank, and has a slightly different curve which requires less embouchure pressure (in my experience) than the BD5. The advantage of this is that your "starting point" is a brighter sound (yay) but you're having to work to make the "body" of the sound.
Where 10,000 grit paper is concerned, it has a cut that is the equivalent to the surface on the back side of the sheet of 600 - which is why many refacers use THAT for a final polish. There are also grades of printing paper (yep, just paper, no sand stuck to it) that have a similar cut when used for polishing and/or finishing the curve, and are a LOT cheaper than 10,000 grit.
Post Edited (2018-12-30 12:57)
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Author: DD
Date: 2018-12-30 20:10
Thanks all for the valuable inputs. I guess I'll just have to try it out myself to tell for sure. And I agree with Donald that the sound that M30 produced is bright and has a 'ping' to it. Would like to try something with more depth and warmth, and BD5 seems to be a good candidate, but if refacing is required, then I might need to send it to Bob! From where I live (Hong Kong) I am not sure if there's any expert capable and willing to do this job.
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Author: donald
Date: 2018-12-30 23:50
"if refacing is required" it's not required, it's just an option if you want to buy a mouthpiece with a facing you don't like.
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Author: DD
Date: 2018-12-31 04:37
I mentioned "if refacing is required " because Bob mentioned about the poor QC and the wide ranging tip opening of BD5
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2018-12-31 12:50
Clarifications -
I am not pushing my mouthpieces here. The person posting is surely a Vandoren fan and my mouthpieces don't play anything close to those.
Second the 10,000 grit sandpaper DOES remove particles and helps adjust the rails before the curve starts. So the rails need to be flat just like the table. Often wet it works best. I also use 5000 and 7000 grit before I polish the mouthpieces and make them look new. See the table may be flat but a section of the rails are flat too, just before the facing curve starts. Remember unlike a lot of mouthpiece makers that buy mouthpieces from other sources UI make my own molds.
So I use parallel pars and lasers to check the flatness, I bet very few if any refacers use this amazing technique.
Lastly the person above playing on the Vandoren said he was tired after 2 minutes of playing. I think the mouthpiece needs serious work. My fees are low because clarinet playing should be fun. People flipping burgers at Burger King and other fast food joints make more than me. I have plenty of money. I'm against people charging $21,000 for a set of horns yet Yamaha charges about $5550 for a set of horns. People say they aren't any good, but I did a summer solo tour taking me to the Kennedy Center, the Smithsonian, Severance Hall in Cleveland and the huge Orchestra Hall in Chicago. Every concert was a standing ovation. So there's not a thing wrong with Yamaha's. I used the CFVR's. Sponsored by Yamaha.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2018-12-31 16:42
OP is after opinions on this mouthpiece so here it is. I agree with Donald, this is an awful mouthpiece. Yet somehow I hear lots of people sound great on it. For me, it offers poor intonation, is too open, and offers no colour control or focus. Lots of very successful orchestral players in London are using it, so I must be missing something. Shrug.
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Author: gatto
Date: 2018-12-31 20:34
I am also using it (the 442 version). I like it very much and have no problems with it. Not "too open". (By the way, what do you all mean by it?) Good intonation, response and warm sound.
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Author: J. J.
Date: 2018-12-31 22:36
"People say they aren't any good, but I did a summer solo tour taking me to the Kennedy Center, the Smithsonian, Severance Hall in Cleveland and the huge Orchestra Hall in Chicago. Every concert was a standing ovation."
<Footage not found>
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2018-12-31 23:02
Mr. Bernardo,
Above you said "I am not pushing my mouthpieces here." It seems to me you are indeed pushing your mouthpieces and your services in refacing. Please refer to the forum rules which state: "No advertising of your work..."
Also, I do not care to read that "People flipping burgers at Burger King and other fast food joints make more than me. I have plenty of money." Please refrain from sharing information on your personal wealth; such an assertion is very self-aggrandizing and borders on being hubristic.
In addition, the topic under discussion is the VD BD5 mouthpiece. It appears that in your effort to further your own interests, you have gotten quite a bit off topic.
HRL
Post Edited (2018-12-31 23:29)
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Author: DD
Date: 2019-01-01 10:33
Hi everyone, I really appreciate all of your views and expertise in this discussion. And I am not fixated on VD mouthpieces and open to ideas. So I would say in all fairness I don't think Bob intends to promote his business or is being self-aggrandizing by giving some light-hearted remarks, and I appreciate his inputs. Finally happy new year to fellow members of this great bulletin !
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Author: donald
Date: 2019-01-01 11:55
Bob has made all these statements and claims so many times in previous posts that it has become impossible for many of us to interpret them any other way.
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Author: DD
Date: 2019-01-01 15:02
I ended up purchased 1. D'Addario Reserve X10, 2. BD5, and 3. Yamaha Custom 5cm. Will post an update after I have played them a little bit more.
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