 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Chris Chaloner
Date: 2006-09-18 19:12
I assume "plateau" means holes covered as in a flute?
I have a friend (an excellent amateur player) currently playing an R13 but because of some problems with feeling in the fingertips may need a model with covered holes.
Any recommendations as to makes? Search results seemed not particularly recent...
Chris
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-09-18 20:13
I only know of the Vito and Noblet covered hole clarinets, though the Noblet would be better in terms of tone than the Vito.
And the Leblanc LL covered hole clarinets - though these aren't made anymore. The Noblet keywork isn't as good (refined) as the Leblanc.
Though it is possible to have an R13 converted to covered holes, but it will be expensive.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2006-09-18 21:02
For the purposes of most players, the Noblet horn will be just fine. For the purposes of amateurs, the Vito horn would serve as well.
(Incidentally, the Noblet was created (like the former Leblanc horns before) for the finger coverage issue. The Vito exists to enable those marching band directors who like to have all of their players gloved.)
I would advise against going the convert a regular clarinet route. Too many issues there to resolve, from the key creation to the adjustment of the tone hole chimneys. Stick with the two named above.
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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Author: Erdinet
Date: 2006-09-19 01:38
Check out Michael Manning's custom instruments. When I was at his shop he had some sort of plateau clarinet in there that he designed. Its not on his web site just yet, but I do know that it exists. A Google search should turn up his site quite easily. His prices while not cheap, are not out of this world. Check him out....
Adam
"There is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over."
-Frank Zappa
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Author: Malcolm Martland
Date: 2006-09-19 09:21
I've been playing plateau clarinets for about 2 years now - also because of some loss of finger tip sensation - and they have certainly kept me playing and eliminated some - but not all - of the frustration of dud notes.
Plateau clarinets do allow you to be less accurate with you fingers - but that in itself may become a problem. When I get the chance I like to practice on a normal clarinet and then migrate to the plateau when the fingers begin to miss the target. I use the plateau for band performances though - and even then some notes fail. I have found going the other way is not good - playing pateau Bb and migrating to an A open key is doomed to failure for me.
I was lucky enough to buy an excellent Malerne plateau from a retiring professional sax-clarinet doubler. I also bought an old Noblet 50 plateau but this is not as good tonally or technically (although my tech. loves it) and the keys are almost too smooth to feel. I've stuck cut-up mouthpiece patch rubber on some - that helps positioning. Visual confirmation of finger placing also helps at the beginning of each piece or after long rests.
There are occasionally a few really old plateau instruments that I have seen on the aution place that we try not to name, I've seen a metal Pedlar, a wooden Armand and I bought a Lucien Bassi - still to be restored. I've also noticed a few german system plateau - but usually quite expensive.
I'm still looking for a plateau A.
Malcolm
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Author: Malcolm Martland
Date: 2006-09-19 09:35
Another option which was suggested to me - and so far resisted - is an alto clarinet - nearly all are plateau and most good makers produce them. The same goes for bass.
Alto repertoire is the main problem for me but they should be OK for band work - although we already have several Eb sax players in ours.
Malcolm
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-09-19 10:05
I worked on a lovely old Jaques Albert plateaux clarinet, and playing it didn't feel all that alien as I play sax, oboe and cor anyway - if anything I felt the covered action (once it was set up as it was a mess) was more positive than open holes - the fingerplates were either open or closed, whereas with open holes your fingers have to be smart.
I remember Pete Worrell did a covered hole conversion on a Howarth clarinet for Mark Hollis of Talk Talk fame, though he later had it converted back to open holes! But he didn't take any photos of it for his site.
http://freespace.virgin.net/pete.worrell/services.htm
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2006-09-19 10:08)
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2006-09-19 15:01
A colleague, a great tenor man, lost some facility in his fingers after a stroke, but prefers to quit playing the clarinet rather than switch to a plateau instrument.
I had a young woman who was really, really fast on her alto sax, but couldn't bear to deal with the necessary finger placement accuracy required for the clarinet. After months of frustration, we gave up EVER getting her to double. SAD --we didn't know we could have gottenher a plateau instrument.
I've seen a few top quality closed-hole clarinets at auction, but many are pre-polycylincrical bore designs; so may be more challenging to polay in tune than the R13.
Bob Phillips
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Author: Chris Chaloner
Date: 2006-09-19 20:30
Sounds like "Keep an eye open for a good secondhand Leblanc LL or Malerne, and otherwise go for the Noblet".
Thanks for the advice.
Chris
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-09-19 21:01
Oh yeah, I just remembered an elderly retired doctor who used to play tenor for us (he had an old Selmer 'Adolphe' tenor) played a covered hole Malerne (though it was stamped 'Buisson') which was a nice old clarinet - and my first sax teacher had two of them, I wish I bought them at the time - one was a Couesnon and the other one had all pearl finger buttons, but I can't remember what make it was, though it may have been a Lucian Bassi or similar.
A case of coulda, woulda, shoulda!
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2006-09-20 14:16
I once subbed for a baritone sax player who had serious problems playing clarinet, as his right middle finger had been broken back in the old days of primitive medical care and had not been properly set. As a result of the injury, the last joint of the finger pointed off to the right at about a 20° angle, making it very hard to consistently cover the RH 2 tone hole. I suggested a plateau clarinet, which I understand he ordered, but he died before he could ever use it. Bummer...
I used to have an alto player who was never comfortable with the finger hole coverage issues on the clarinet when he first started doubling seriously. (Prior to that time, he was mostly a concert band guy, playing alto exclusively, and he was very sloppy with placement on that horn, probably due to his bassoon playing roots.) I explained the plateau option, pointing out that the coverage issue was made mostly irrelevant by going that route but that you lost part of the tonal quality.
He bought (new) a Noblet horn, and at first was quite satisfied with the result. However, as he put in more and more time on clarinet, he found that he could deal with the finger placement issues after all, and transitioned to an R-13 (natürlich) pretty quickly thereafter. He has passed the Noblet horn on to his daughter (who was a sax player who wanted to learn clarinet) , so it wasn't a total waste of money.
I had him use both horns on a gig once, and I found that I could not tell which was in use at a given time. But, it did make a difference to him, the player.
In short, for those just used to saxophonic style finger placement, the plateau horns would be a welcomed short term crutch, but unless you are cursed with serious physical problems (like the baritone player, or those mentioned with finger nerve sensation diminishment) it probably should be avoided.
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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Author: 3dog
Date: 2018-10-29 00:32
I purchase a new Hunter plateau back in May and been practicing almost every day and giged with her last week. No regrets in going plateau. I have calloused fingers from playing guitar and double on tenor and alto sax in a big band. I also bought a used Hunter alto and really liked the quality and sound of that horn prior to the purchase of the clarinet. I read a lot of anti Chinese instrument posts prior to purchase. No regrets so far.
http://mmrmagazine.com/new-products/band-instruments/6332-hunter-6403eb-plateau-key-bb-clarinet.html#disqus_thread
Post Edited (2018-10-29 00:38)
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Author: Roxann
Date: 2018-10-29 00:56
Lohff & Pfeiffer, clarinet technicians who come to Boise on a yearly basis, can take your existing clarinet and make covers for all the holes. I don't know the cost. They're out of Maryland.
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Author: 3dog
Date: 2018-10-29 01:23
Not sure, if I had a good clarinet I would go through that expense and risk. Most likely would reduce the resale value. I only paid about $240 for a brand new instrument so I wasn't risking much. There are limitations with a plateau in that you can't use your fingers to partially cover the holes along with your embouchure for portamento. I found you can do a sax like portamento which with a lot of practice you can get it to sound pretty good. The purist would probably turn their noses up at the idea but I am not so limited.
Post Edited (2018-10-29 01:30)
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2018-10-29 08:40
I bought a Vito plateau clarinet a few years ago when I had carpal tunnel syndrome and lost sensitivity in my fingers. It worked well for me and enabled me to continue playing. At first I found that I couldn't manage a good glissando or smear, but I found that it is possible but requires a different technique. The fingers are OK now but I'm hanging on to the Vito as arthritis is catching up with me now.
Tony F.
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Author: Lugubert
Date: 2018-10-30 02:20
I'm working on the precision of my RH ring finger. In the meantime, I use a metal plateau l'Orpheon, Paris, S/N 2733, for band playing. Works well enough for me and fellow players and our conductor, but my teacher insists that I work on my Leblanc Esprit.
Progressing on the still non always sufficiently cooperative finger, but at this time of the year in Sweden, there is really no alternative to the plateau for outdoor playing with mittens.
I have tried to find info on the Orpheon, but haven't come closer than probably 1891 to 1899. Any ideas?
An open, metal René Dumont is S/N 206018. Much more worn, but can it be dated? Guesses from generally knowledgeable people are that I could hope for the 1920's. Anybody out there who knows more?
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Author: Clarineteer
Date: 2018-10-30 04:23
Attachment: 004.JPG (311k)
The Silva Bet by H Bettoney made a superb Bb metal plateau clarinet but they are very rare. Nice photo of one.
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