 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: N.Y.W
Date: 2018-05-05 15:10
It has excited me very much to learn in the few past months that martin fröst is collaborating with buffet crampon on the making of a new clarinet. However, they are only throwing hints. Does anyone know something beyond the fact of the partnership? A date of publication? Please share if you know any details, thank in advance!
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Author: N.Y.W
Date: 2018-05-05 15:16
It is also interesting to know about your opinion, are you curious and optimistic towards this new clarinet or you think it's another one of buffets gimmicks?
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Author: zhangray4
Date: 2018-05-05 19:40
I hope the new clarinet will be:
1. better built than most Buffets nowadays
2. somewhat affordable
That's what I hope for
-- Ray Zhang
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Author: GBK
Date: 2018-05-05 19:46
Buffet currently has 12 professional level clarinets (not counting the Greenline versions of the above), with the R13 now being relegated to the bottom of the list. Does one really think that another pro clarinet model will bring anything substantially different than what can be found among the dozen current models?
It sounds like Buffet is just trying to attach a big name player to increase sales, when in essence they should thin the herd and put more quality control into current production.
Remember when the R13 was the only pro model Buffet offered with the highest quality wood? Players of the 1950's -1970's did just fine with that.
And let's not forget the new pro models that Buffet introduced over the past 25 years which they then discontinued for lack of sales, acceptance or price point.
...GBK (whose Buffet clarinets are all from the 1960's and early 1970's)
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Author: Speculator Sam
Date: 2018-05-05 21:17
Ditto on GBK. I'm hoping this'd be like what our lord and savior Harry Spaarnay did for the bass clarinet and totally improve the design of the current bass clarinets Buffet made. Problem being, like GBK stated, Buffet has 13 pro. models already.
Doing a quick scan of Buffet's website, it seems the primary differences between the clarinets is that some of different material pads, some feature metal rings in the tenons, and key-work material (silver, nickel, gold, etc.). The only one that really stood out, to me, was the Legende that features 19 keys; unique in that it has a low f correction and a pinky low E key. A different bore concept apparently, and you could order one with rose gold or silver.
Assuming they make a Martin Fröst Signature model or another model based on his suggestions, what I can say is something I learned from the wonderful world of guitars that'll help establish the point I bring. There are many different models of guitars because they are all unique in the way that some guitars are manufactured with different wood bodies (maple, ash, poplar, sitka spruce, ebony sometimes, list goes on) and different neck woods that feel very different in the hands of the guitarist (rosewood, ebony, ash, maple sometimes). Even in electric guitars, these woods make a HUGE difference in the way it resonates vibration and how it gets transferred to the pickups. That's not including the different body shapes (dreadnought, jumbo, parlor; SG, Les Paul, Stratocaster, Telecaster).
What I'm saying is, if my knowledge is correct, is that in the world of soprano clarinets the bore diameter, the tone-woods and their quality (grenadilla, rosewood, cocobolo), tenons, and the key-work design (how many keys it has, the intonation correcting keys that including more tone holes which shapes the instrument differently) are the biggest factors in changing the instruments sound. Golden keys and the exact material of the pads don't make a timbral difference; I don't think bladder and leather pads sound different, but synthetic pads against organic pads tend to have an extremely small difference in my ears.
Unless Martin completely game-changes the key-work, the bore design, or invents/discovers a new species of tone wood appropriate for clarinet, then a new model in his name would be nothing but a cliche marketing ploy to sell instruments with his name on it. I love the world of bass clarinet. It's much simpler; every manufacturer says "You have two models to choose from! You could get the cheap one, or the expensive one!"
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2018-05-05 21:30
Another new model in an already huge lineup in an already over-saturated market.
Something has to give as it seems every maker with an already large lineup is trying to outdo themselves and not just the competition.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Klose ★2017
Date: 2018-05-05 21:34
Speculator Sam,
Tosca, Divine also have the same correction key but they only have a low F pinky correction key but not low E (low E is optional but still only one key for both low E and Low F).
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Author: Kalashnikirby
Date: 2018-05-05 21:36
Double ditto on the previous postings.
Really fascinating how Buffet steps up their marketing game in a fashion we've only known in branches like sports equipment.
What I don't understand is: How would Fröst have any qualified experience in clarinet making, so that his thoughts would have a significant impact on the new model? Sure, working together with the pros is important to any manufacturer nowadays.
Once again, I'd like to compare this with the mountain biking world:
In downhill racing, pros punish equipment to such a extreme degree, that it might only last as long days. Now, these guys all have their own preferences, but there's always a dedicated mechanic for them to do the customising and service. Their input is importan for developing new gear, but only to a limited degree. New bikes are created by engineers, not riders, it's that simple.
So what draws Martin Fröst to creating his own clarinet? I'd argue that he actually plays an important role in that development - bet it ends up being a modification of a known bore concept and they'll advertise with his name.
Best regards,
Christian
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2018-05-05 22:39
Buffet cannily watches everything going on in the world of clarinet buying, clarinet making, and clarinet playing just as Vandoren does for mouthpieces. reeds, and accessories. Sometimes musical instruments carry the name of a famous artist simply to increase sales and other times an artist can offer significant input to the conception and development of a design. Ricardo Morales has always tinkered creatively with his own clarinets and no doubt had a lot to do with the design of the MoBa. Did Corrado Guiffredi have as much to do with the design of the carbon fiber with wood CG Backun clarinet? I don't know, but he must have had some input. If it's ok for Backun to have Morales and Guiffredi on its design/promotion team, why shouldn't it be just as well for Buffet to have Martin Frost on theirs? If we're going to be cynical about one, we ought to be cynical about them all. Or why not be cautiously hopeful about them all and try each on on its own merits when it comes out?
Frost does any number of things with the clarinet that are matched by very few other players in the world. He is certainly in a position to tell Buffet, "look, I don't see why such and such needs to be so hard to do on the clarinet and I have some ideas about how it could be made easier." Could he become a sort of Steve Jobs of clarinet manufacture, giving the design team the inspiration and new blood conception they need to make a better instrument? Ditto for Julian Bliss at Selmer. Or maybe it all will turn out to be advertising hype. We shall see.
Post Edited (2018-05-06 03:26)
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Author: Bennett ★2017
Date: 2018-05-05 23:48
Just curious. Does Fröst usually play Boehm? Maybe he's working on a German bore cl. for Buffet?
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Author: gatto
Date: 2018-05-06 00:21
No, Martin Fröst plays Boehm. Studying information from booklets of his CDs, he now plays mainly Buffet Festival and Tosca, and a Prestige bassett clarinet. In former times also RC Prestige and Chaddash. On a promotion video for his recent Messiaen CD it seems that he played a Backun.
The idea is not new. For instance, french clarinettist Paul Meyer was involved in developing the Divine.
By the way, where is the information from? Is there an internet link?
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2018-05-07 07:21
On the latest CD Frost may be using a Buffet with a barrel made by Aidoni of Helsingborg, Sweden. Frost certainly worked with Hakan Lundstrom of Aidoni for over a year to design new barrels for his Buffets, and that could be a first step toward making other significant changes to the Buffet designs.
Post Edited (2018-05-07 07:25)
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Author: gatto
Date: 2018-05-07 20:33
See this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYmBOCvxvHE
By 3:50 the clarinet is well visible. Yes, the barrel is an Aidoni. And the clarinet? It does not look like a usual Buffet. Observe the keywork at the right hand side. Doesn't it look more like a Backun?
Or, maybe, this is already some new Buffet prototype?
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Author: Klose ★2017
Date: 2018-05-07 21:00
https://bachtrack.com/interview-martin-frost-clarinet-bamberger-symphoniker-retrotopia-mozart-may-2018
He mentioned something about the collaboration here.
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2018-05-07 22:17
The right hand trill keys do have a curved Backun look but on the bottom joint I don't see either the Backun plate or the little crescent shaped metal pieces on the rod of the right hand F/C key that Backuns usually have (the name plate on the less expensive models and the crescents on the MoBa and the one-piece model). So maybe it's a Buffet prototype or even a Backun prototype. It would be nice to know which for sure. The wood appears to be unstained and contrasts with the darker wood of the barrel and bell. Could it be mopani wood?
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