 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Luisebv
Date: 2018-01-16 01:03
I'm thinking about changing my actual horn. I would like to know if you could recommend any clarinet in which its tuning is highlighted, it can be any brand. not just buffet.
Thanks a lot!
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Author: GenEric
Date: 2018-01-16 02:51
There is no one brand or model of clarinet where tuning is highlighted. Go to your music store and see which clarinet tunes best to you and your mouthpiece.
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Author: zhangray4
Date: 2018-01-16 07:20
Buffet might be the one brand you maybe should be aware of if you really want to be in tune. Notice how I said "be aware" and not "completely avoid." That's because unless you try a whole bunch of them, chances are your R13 will not be worth the money compared to other options like Yamaha CSVR, the Selmers, etc. My R13 (which I bought a year and a half ago when I was an ignorant clarinetist), was extremely sharp in the throats and flat on most of the chalmeau notes, even when tuning to A=440. But it is possible to get a in-tune Buffet. My old clarinet (the newer E11 France) my teacher hand selected is still better in intonation compared to my R13, although it doesn't give as good of a sound.
-- Ray Zhang
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Author: Carmelo
Date: 2018-01-16 08:43
Ridenour 576BC, tuning is amazing combined with a great mouthpiece reed setup.
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Author: ClarinetRobt
Date: 2018-01-16 09:42
I too have found Ridenour’s offerings much better than average concerning intonation. I have a Lyrique.
Recently, my new Uebel Superiors have been, well, superior in the tuning department. Ironically, playing soli sections with a litany of Buffets in the section have forced me to adjust to them. Such is the life in clarinet world.
~Robt L Schwebel
Mthpc: Behn Vintage
Lig: Ishimori, Behn Delrin
Reed: Legere French Cut 3.75/4, Behn Brio 4
Horns: Uebel Superior (Bb,A), Ridenour Lyrique, Buffet R13 (Eb)
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Author: nellsonic
Date: 2018-01-16 09:50
Ridenour Libertas and Yamaha CSVR both play in tune very well, just be aware that it may not seem that way at first if you are used to having to "muscle" your current instrument. Sometimes it takes a few days of focused work to learn how to relax and let the instrument be easy with pitch.
Anders
Post Edited (2018-01-17 14:01)
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Author: Kalashnikirby
Date: 2018-01-16 12:57
Ray, have you already tried a different mouthpiece? Usually, the Buffets I get my hands on are pretty well in tune, but there are other reasons why I wouldn't recommend one.
I've too been very impressed with Yamaha lately, maybe they're the only manufacturer to produce consistent horns and one could, theoratically speaking, even order one online without too many worries.
Practically, I recently tried a german system student model and wondered why it played so well (that is to say, it sounded nicer than some other examplars from these series) - turns out it was chosen with a teacher among at least 10 other instruments in a big music store.
Anyways, their Boehm horns are great.
Luisebv, what is your current instrument? Why do you feel it needs an upgrade? Personally, the only bigger manufacturers that I still care about are Yamaha and Uebel, as you can expect better price/performance ratios from them - yet, as a recent experience taught me, it'll be necessary to take a trip to GB, where dawkes and some others have an actual stock of Boehm clarinets to chose from. So don't buy a horn without comparing it to others of the same model - or at least price range.
That being said, it's impressive how there's been not a single "black sheep" among the Yamaha's I've had in my hands or heard of.
Best regards
Christian
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2018-01-17 06:50
Right out of the box and play a concert that night, without fear, the Yamaha CSVR. Once in awhile one may need to be adjusted, but this is unusual. Great horns. They may have been toys in the past, they are BEASTS now.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2018-01-17 07:03
Seems like everyone I tell to try one and they own Buffets, not just the R13's but even the upper models like the Tosca switch.
They are worth trying before buying a Buffet.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: Luisebv
Date: 2018-01-17 19:25
Thanks a lot for their coments guys!
Christian, My current setup is a buffet E11 with moba barrel and bell of cocobolo and Vandonren BD5 -13. I always have a little bit trouble with tune specially in high register, but i have learned to correct and compensate that issues. Now i have a Rindenour lyrique in A, btw i am really impress how well tune it is, better than other R13s that i have tested.
Now my E11, is turn me to much free blowing (maybe because im practicing in A) thats why iam thinking that its time to get a new horn, but the only think that i dont like on Rindenour horn is that aren`t too resonant for my taste (maybe by the hard rubber) even using my backun bell and barrel.
thats why i am asking the question on what model has good tunning that can be comparable with the Rindenour.
I know that buffet improve their tunning some years ago with the tosca, and then passed to the tradition clarinet feature, and don´t know how well it is. I tested some R13s and RCs and i see a little bit of variarion on each horn and in each one. thats why i am a little bit curious on compare with the tradition.
by the other hand the CSVR like it by his cutting edge sound, too much direct and focus. but on the models that I tested is like the Backun tunning concept, has little variations but the narrow way.
The only brand that i didn´t find on store stock are the Uebels, I heard that that have great deep sound (specially the superior) thats why iam curious to test, but they seem that is only on order.
Another great resonant horn that i tested was the unknown brand Ripamonti, the Ripa model, but was the only one that played without tuner (because time, btw was the horn of the teacher Paolo Beltramini)
Bob, i would like the CSVR, but to me their key work is a lot different (to much lowered the key height, espcially in the right pinky keys) I talk to some repairman that can be fix that, but their price is nonsense.
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Author: Kalashnikirby
Date: 2018-01-17 19:57
The E11 is, to be honest, neither well-tuned nor the nicest sounding horn, but On the other hand, once saw one that was even better than a C-12. In this price range, Buffets might perhaps vary a lot.
The CSG III is worth trying too, which as Yamaha themselves state is supposed to sound more "german" (and that is what the G in the name stands for), however I felt that the keywork is something you need to get used to.
It would be the easiest compromise for you to buy the Lyrique Libertas , which is supposed to be better than the standard model in every way, plus the ergonomics should be the same, so I suggest you give that one a try. Even when you're going to buy another clarinet in a few years, a hard rubber instrument can always be handy for rougher playing conditions.
Pretty sure the Tradition isn't any better or worse than the rest of the Buffets. It sounds differently, but that's not worth the extra 700~ bucks vs. the RC/R13.
Funny thing about my Amati A-clarinet: I felt like the performance had been degrading a huge deal within just a few years with rather little use, but it turned out the cheap pads on her just fell apart real quick. After experimenting with pad hights and the register key (besides having drilled a hole in the bell), I'm actually starting to get an instrument with decent intonation and ergonomics - but the initial setup was very poor. I'd probably go to far by recommending DIY, but it's safe say that a proper setup is both seldomly found on NEW horns and that it pays giving yours to a repairman - there should be some that don't ask ridiculous prices, right? Only Uebel's Superior had a really impresive setup out-of-the-box and with the pros here inspiring me to use other silencing materials, swedging pliers etc., even my RC is slowly turning into a horn with great ergonomics.
But then again, we have a music student in our orchestra that doesn't give a *** about her horn, with the cork on her Bb/D# RH key long gone (smashing it against the wood of the clarinet body, 'cus it's a german system one!!!) - this level of negligence drives me completely nuts, but she's still sounding and playing well. Maybe she doesn't care because the piano is her first instrument, who knows...
Bottom line: With some horns, you might just end up giving them to a repairman, even when bought new, but then they should at least set them up to your exact demands.
Post Edited (2018-01-17 20:07)
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2018-01-17 20:20
Luisebv - "Key work lowered on the CSVR." Yes you are right. I did adjust the height of some keys, but not the right hand pinky. You will get the feel of it in a few minutes. Not days. Good observation. The keys in general are just a shade low sometimes, but nothing that really bothers me. I moved the keys on the pinky left hand! To match the Buffet's I was using.
The CSVR's tune really well and the evenness of every note is superior. The only complaints I've heard about are the throat tones and I've been sending people to the main man in NYC to adjust this. He also makes barrels. Last time I talked with him, which must be close to 4 months now, he was working on Robert Marcellus's horns. So he does work on non Yamaha horns too. He reminds me of Hans Moennig, but nice! And young! Hans was a super nice man to me, but he had a temper and it did scare me. This guy in NYC is simply a true gentleman.
If you are in fear of Yamaha's being set up incorrectly email me and I'll get you his number and he will pick out a horn for you and send it to a store of your choice. Then you simply buy it at that store. He will of course make sure it is perfect. But remember I only had to play about 3 Bb horns and 2 A clarinets. They were that good. I did do a barrel swap on the A clarinet, looking for a warmer sound.
I tend to do my own work on my horns, such as cork pads on the upper register. But you don't need cork pads. These horns seal so well. I went with cork because of the feel only. To me the leather pads seal for about 20 seconds, but have a sponge feel. 99.999 of the players probably could care less and the leather pads are just fine.
The CSVR "A" clarinets are the best I've ever played. The reason has to do with the resistance. It feels like your Bb. Also the upper register is not tubby like the Buffet's. So playing a high F you don't have that fear of hitting an A, which I've always had on Buffet's. You can hit the F with power and no fear.
If you need some help trying out a horn email me. I'll set you up with the Yamaha trial program. Or I think I can. No promises.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: TomS
Date: 2018-01-18 01:50
Ridenour 576BC has best performance/value ... for wooden clarinets the Yamaha CSVR (at 3X the price of the Ridenour) ... don't own the CSVR but played one on several extended occasions with tuner in front of me ... try current production R13/greenline and see what you think, I like mine ...
I just traded my Yamaha 650 clarinet for a new Yamaha 4-string bass and Hartke amp head and quad speaker cabinet ... so I'll need a new Yamaha CSVR clarinet soon to occupy an empty peg ...
Tom
Post Edited (2018-01-18 02:03)
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Author: FwLineberry
Date: 2018-01-18 05:35
Another satisfied Ridenour owner here. Both the Libertas and the C play remarkably well in tune.
My Backun Beta, likewise.
.
.
Backun Beta, Lyrique Libertas, Lyrique 570C
Ridenour RAmt36, Vandoren 15RV Lyre mouthpieces
Rovner Dark and Rovner Versa ligatures
Legere reeds
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Author: Luisebv
Date: 2018-01-18 08:50
Thanks for the coments Christian, i take the advice.
I have already tested The Rindenour 576BC, and is most likely to my 576A is very good in intonation but i want more resonance on the horn, particularly for those situations as a soloist. maybe i need to test the libertas to hear how much the core sound was improved. by the time i need to look a store that has it in stock.
But in the other hand, i would take note to Bob too, i would take a retest chance on the CSVR and CSG III. and if i found a good repairman to setup to me for a reasonable price.
too much clarinets to test, Ha!
Post Edited (2018-01-18 08:52)
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