 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: bob gardner
Date: 2001-06-03 15:21
As a new older player I know that I'm working off of desire to play this horn that we call a clarinet. I was wondering if this is true with other players in the 50 plus group.
I hope that those of you who have talent (a gift from God) that you use it and go on to great heights. For the rest of us. It trying to do the best we can with what we got.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bill
Date: 2001-06-03 15:59
I agree. I think I have a strong desire, not talent, and an addiction to the "feeling" I get playing the clarinet. I've learned a lot due to a lack of talent for music and other things, and I'm not sure I'd want to exhange the experience for talent.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: jerry
Date: 2001-06-03 16:22
Bob, you certainly know where I am in this group. As I stated before, how can I become so attached this licorice stick when I can't even play it? Even to the point of really missing it while it is in the shop for a few days. And, although I cannot give it the attention it needs (for me to become successful), I sacrifice a few other necessary things around here in order to learn to play (I think my wife is going to divorce me after 44 years -- not really). But, I am neglecting other things -- what the hey!
I feel I'm getting a lot closer on learning to count (maybe).
~ jerry
Still in Clarinet Boot Camp
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ginny
Date: 2001-06-03 17:39
At one time I interviewed a large number of classical guitarists on their 'inner' music game.
I never got around to finishing my article.
These were a mix of performers at a large classical guitar festival.
I recall most felt they had a talent for hard work and I suspect that they would have been
at the top on any field they went into.
One of the best students I had during my hack guitar teaching years was
a 62 yo beginner. He practiced not less than two hours every day. He had a talent for
hard careful work. He paid attention to the lesson too.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bob Arney
Date: 2001-06-03 17:58
Well Guy's, lets face it. We have the desire, we have some talent, and most of us old geezers have learned to fake it on ocassion. BUT what I think we don't still have (after reading Mark's entry and article) is the "fire in the belly" and the FOCUS that keeps these younger folks going. Maybe we had it one day, but now most of us are just willing to play in the local community bands/church and our own enjoyment. I know I am. As a matter of fact I just "won" a Conn Bass on eBay that Dave S... is going to turn into a beautiful horn for me. And then, who knows. I am really looking forward to it. Might even get my "chop"s back if the Lord tarries long enough. In that hope, I also ordered up "The Ultimate Jazz Fake Book Bb edition" and intend to really have go at the good old stuff.So hang in guys.
Bob A
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: mw
Date: 2001-06-03 18:50
[speaking as to myself & not willing to "box" anybody else in ....]
the BRAIN & the commands it issues & reacts to don't seem to work as well for older folks as it does for younger folk. AGAIN, IMO, there is nothing we can really do about that in the long run (not unless one's brain works very differently. [of course, its not the brain alone, I know that]
That said, the older we get the MORE we need to follow a learning REGIMEN or we are doomed to very limited growth in the future.
THUS, older folks needs to follow a learning REGIMEN ... or they will end up repeating the same tasks over & over ... with no substantive "playing growth".
OF course, for those who are coming back and KNEW everything before ... the situation is different than for someone who is starting to learn at a later age. We also have the other category of "I knew something before and now I am adding ot it ..." (e.g. they knew something before)
Best,
mw
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bob Curtis
Date: 2001-06-03 18:53
HI Gang:
You may be off the beaten track with this tallent and desire thing. I personally feel the you need to get a game plan first and set some goals. Just what do you want to do with this clarinet thing? Become a professional and play with a symphony? Sit first chair in the Austin Symphinic Band? Teach private lessons? Be a band director? Or maybe just have fun and enjoy the instrument?
This could be the deciding factor as to what you really accomplish in studying the clarinet. I have played the instrument since i was 10, taught the instrument for over 50 years, taught band for 37years, and so on. I INTENDED (Planned) early in life to make music a CAREER. But at the same time, I also recognized that my fingers were not the fastest in the world and that I could not meet the first chair qualifications in the New York Symphony challenge. I chose rather to teach band and clarinet. I don't have to prove anything to any one, I do have a burning desire to pass my knowledge on to others and that is what I do.
Yes, I enjoy playing and I do it for sheer pleasure now. I have studied with some fine teachers, not necessarily those who were most well known, but those who could pass their information on to me, and me on to to my students. This is what my plan was and I have (and still am) trying to accomplish this. It can be done, but not perhaps at the speed which you desire to do it. I am 71 and still learning more every day of my life. You will probably do the same every day of your life also. Take it one step at a time, and then move on to the next challenge.
Good luck, and DON'T EVER GIVE UP!!!
Bob Curtis
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Kim
Date: 2001-06-03 21:10
You guys have both the talent and the desire to play. Talent doesn't necessarily mean being the "best." Sometimes it's a matter of doing it that matters. Most people can't even play the clarinet, or any instrument, but you guys can. Compared to them, you are more talented than they'll ever be!
Good luck and have fun,
Kim
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: bob gardner
Date: 2001-06-03 21:23
Mark: the first line reads "God gives talent; Work transform talent in genius."
I agree--
what gets me are the people that are given the talent and do nothing with it.
So for some of us I guess it means "hard work will get us a little further down the road" also we get to enjoy all of the hard work and effort.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Kim
Date: 2001-06-04 02:37
I agree with the hard work part--I am college music major. Yet I am not the best in my section. I still would beat every one of them in how hard I work! Personally, I think that's all I need. 
Good luck,
Kim
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2001-06-04 03:03
To thing we have talents(music talent first,clarinet playing talent second) would
make lot of things far easier. IMHO.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Jim
Date: 2001-06-04 04:02
Of course this is a philosophical type question that goes much further...
talent vs. desire
nature vs nurture
genetics vs environment
inspiration vs perspiration (credit to T. Edison)
(salvation by) grace vs works
(The last just to end a hierarchy, no intent to start a theological discussion.)
The formula for success seems to lie somewhere in the middle of each pair of opposites. Surely, more effort overcomes less talent many times!
But, talent can sometimes make it happen I guess. 30 years ago I had a roommate at Glassboro State, (Rowan U. today) a trombone major. The "bone" prof was one of the toughest in the dept. (I had him for theory!) Bob left the horn in his locker all week, getting it out 15 minutes before his lesson each week. He never earned less than an "A" in 8 semesters with this tough professor. Bob graduated with honors and joined one of "the" military bands. Sadly I lost contact with him at that point. Do I suggest not practicing??? Of course not... but... One person at least was able to do it. Strange but true!
I've been blessed with a number of abilities and interests... music, teaching, graphic design, stained glass artistry, carpentry/ cabinetmaking, mechanics and others. Yet, I sometimes wonder if there are other things for which I might have talent, but haven't yet discovered, and at 50 may never. I guess I'm grateful for all that I can do and have done!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: bob gardner
Date: 2001-06-04 14:12
I'm just glad that i have the desire to do differant things. I have friends that have little or no desire to step out and try something new. Sad but true.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Azzacca
Date: 2001-06-04 14:51
This is a difficult question. I remember the first time I played clarinet, and for the first year, I was completely unable to play anything with the register key (anything higher than Bb anyway). After 5th grade, I practiced all summer and became very good at playing any note I wanted. And because I had become so good, my teacher made me 1st chair 2nd clarinet (he wanted one of the best in that seat). As time passed I was frequently near the top of the clarinet line. However, in 10th grade I started to hate playing and never got above 4th chair 2nd clarinet. By my junior year, I wanted to quit; my teacher figured this out and offered me the Eb clarinet that he had just gotten for the band. I was in love with playing again. And I became pretty good at it again.
In any case; this sort of shows, to me anyway, that desire and talent go hand in hand. Doesn't matter how good you are, if you don't want to play, you won't do very much. If you really want to play, you can learn the skills to improve your ability.
Anyway, that's IMHO
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ginny
Date: 2001-06-04 16:30
I will weigh in on the nature v. nuture debate.
I understand there is an increasing amount of evidence about our genetic driven selves.
Strange but true, my ex-husband's insistence that it was ALL genes and child rearing
practices made no difference was a root cause of the marriage's death.
We do not know, yet. So let's say I assume it is all enviroment and I am wrong. All I've
lost is hard work and (in my personal case) the kids turn out as they would have anyway.
No harm done, at least to the kids.
Let us say I assume its all genetically determined, and I don't try to do a good job
AND I am WRONG, enviroment is important. I've really messed up.
I actually believe its nuture acting on nature, in some unknown degree.
So those who have the most desire and a talent for hard work, develop the most
of their own ability. If you believe its all talent and that you have but little...you
will defeat yourself. Excess genetic beliefs are a form of fatalism, a depressing
point of view.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Stefano
Date: 2001-06-04 17:19
To put it simply:
if you are not a professional - and that is to say that you do not earn a living upon playing the clarinet - the most important thing is desire, and enjoyment. I have seen people wearing an incredible smile while playing an unbearable tune.
If you are a professional, desire comes second. Even if you do not enjoy, the show must go on and you need to pay the rent. In these cases you generally have a desire, but you must be able to go on and compete also when you do not feel like it. Hard work is necessary as well as talent.
Going back to the original question about what is true for amateur players in the 50 plus group (or 40 minus group), I believe "desire" is the key.
You may be more talented playing golf or chess.... but if you are eager playing that tube there is nothing that is going to stop you...... notwithstanding your talent.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2001-06-04 18:16
I just returned from playing at a Christian Arts Festival in Chicago, and one of the speakers reminded me of a very powerful motivator in my life. In the movie Chariots of Fire, the main character (in a true story) was a missionary whose sister didn't approve of his running. She felt it interfered with his "true calling." He replied, "God made me to run. When I run, I feel His pleasure." No one can explain that feeling, but when it happens--you know it and it doesn't matter what anyone thinks or says--you'll do everything in your power to experience it as often as possible. If you get that when you play your clarinet, then you should play your clarinet and hone your skills as much as possible--regardless of your age or education or financial situation. How can we define the pleasure of music? We cannot.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bob Arney
Date: 2001-06-04 20:58
Stefano said:(in part)....." "I have seen people wearing an incredible smile while playing an unbearable tune....."
So THAT'S what's wrong with my emboucher.
Bob A
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bob Curtis
Date: 2001-06-05 01:13
Again, gang, please DON'T forget the enjoyment we feel every time we play and accomplish something which we have not done before or in a long time!! To me, being retired and NOT have to prove anything anymore, that is the best part. I play for the sheer enjoyment of playing. I teach for the sheer enjoyment of teaching. It thrills me immensely when one of my students all of a sudden "sees the light" with a particular passage or fingering situation. It excites me when one comes to me and says that I did something which helped them understand how it works! That is the reward -- just seeing the look on their faces and knowing that I helped a little bit in their quest for knowledge. Now, THAT is sheer delight!
God gave me theTALENT, I have exercised the DESIRE to further the knowledge and experience of others.
Bob Curtis
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: willie
Date: 2001-06-05 01:36
I sit in two community bands among folks of all ages and abilities. Most of the older folks are the most eager to improve, but are mainly the happiest just to be playing and enjoying their horns, the comraderie(sp), and the music. While on the other hand, a few of the younger ones will sit and complain "its too easy, its too hard, If I can't play that run by next week I'm selling this thing" and so on. Its whats in your heart and what makes you happy. I know I myself that I will never be good enough to play in a symphony or a top grade swing band. Too much dammage to the fingers over the years, but after having a 4-way bypass 3 yrs ago, I'm just happy as pig in a mud puddle just to be alive and still honking on my clarinet.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2001-06-05 15:04
I play with professionals of high level abilities in an international orchestra once a year and with amateurs in a community band once a week. Although it is a "rush" to be with the musicians from around the world and challenged by the music we play--it's wonderful to be with a group of "olders" in my community band who don't care if I hit a wrong note in a concert. It frees me to get better and better on my instrument. The community loves us and we get to do some great gigs.
On Memorial Day, we were asked to play at the unveiling of a statue on the court house lawn. One of our members blew taps in his full Navy attire--complete with a chest full of medals from WWII. He played perfectly and beautifully and gave us all chills. As The Battle Hymn of the Republic was played a B-1 bomber from our local Dyess, AFB gave a low fly-by. I was sitting on the front row of the band and caught sight of it as it peaked from the clouds and flew toward us. It was awesome to see and hear and feel.
Our community band doesn't have the status of the international orchestra--but it has something that is wonderful in and of itself--dedication, honesty and acceptance. It's a kick.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Meri
Date: 2001-06-06 00:12
For me, it's a combination of talent (5%, at the most), desire (5%) and work ethic (90%). I'm not sure about the nature vs. nurture debate, since most of my family is indifferent, ignorant, or even against someone doing music, (only one of my cousins supported me, and he is a talented painter, photographer, and engineer--and outside of that, he enjoys playing golf and rugby) and the only person doing music professionally in my family is a distant relative on my mom's side.
The desire provides the motivation for doing something. The work ethic provides the means of developing the skill as much as possible. The talent is the icing on the cake, between a technically good, but uninspired performance, and a technically good, but inspired performance.
On the other hand, one is still left with the question on the development of musicality. For some people, this comes naturally. Others need quite a bit of instruction in it.
Meri
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: jerry
Date: 2001-06-06 00:52
Real fine story Brenda................been there done that (not as a band member but as honor guard). Makes the hair on the back of my neck come to attention. But, like the old man in the York peppermint commercial says, "...well if I just get a sensation...."
BTW Brenda, I worked at Dyess AFB (as a civilian contractor) back in '59.
Ain't this fun................thanks Mark.
~ jerry
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: jenna
Date: 2001-06-06 01:46
a couple (mostly irrelevant) thoughts..
Go Rowan U! Although I'm a Rutgers girl myself, Rowan is close to home and it's home to a bunch of my friends.
And, military bands are awesome. Great experiences in playing, and growing as a person. The diversity among people and skill levels make it fun. It's laid back, and everyone has fun. We're competeing Saturday in Wildwood, NJ -- I can't wait. If we win, this is our third year sweeping the awards.
Wish me luck!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
