 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-03-28 23:54
I know the technical/mechanical differences between the Buffet E13 and R13 (talking new instruments here), but how do they both compare to one another playing wise?
If you had to choose between them based on their playing characteristics, which one would you choose and why?
Take into account the cost of both (new instruments, not used) and which one has more bang for buck as opposed to simply keeping up with the Joneses.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: ClaV
Date: 2016-03-29 00:32
Was a choice between E13 and R13 more relevant, when R13 was one and only top instrument from Buffet?
If opposed to keeping up with Joneses - neither would be my choice.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-03-29 01:19
Maybe I wasn't being specific enough when I mentioned just those two particular models.
If so, then how can I make myself any clearer?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kj2008
Date: 2016-03-29 03:17
I am not sure I am qualified to put my 2 cents here. I am an amateur and just moved into so called intermediate level (again would like believe so) and the clarinet is just for my hobby and pastime.
I've looked & researched on both R13 and E13 for some time, and I ended up buying E13. It was the best bang for the money to me ($3,363 vs. $2,320, and I don't know why the price almost $1,000 more here in U.S. than in Europe).
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Author: jthole
Date: 2017-06-20 16:41
kj2008 wrote:
> I've looked & researched on both R13 and E13 for some time, and
> I ended up buying E13. It was the best bang for the money to
> me ($3,363 vs. $2,320, and I don't know why the price almost
> $1,000 more here in U.S. than in Europe).
Having seen (thanks to Google) the USA prices for the Buffet E13, I am flabbergasted as well. $2940 for an E13 sounds like madness.
Doesn't Buffet want to sell the E13 in the USA, and do they make the price artificially high for that reason?
Over here, the ex-VAT price for the E13 would be $1460 in US$.
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Author: dorjepismo ★2017
Date: 2017-06-20 17:12
Jthole,
Antitrust enforcement never made it as far as top-line musical instruments. It's been that way since I started playing in the '60s. We're the last to get new models, some just aren't available, and the prices are a lot higher--sort of like prescription drugs. There's an arcane system where, if you know where to go and say the right person sent you, the price drops substantially, but I believe there are distributer rules against advertising prices below set levels, so competition is artificially limited. It's sort of like gangster movies set in Chicago. It probably also has to do with the volume of sales. They can only make a limited number of the best instruments, and can adequately cover Europe and Japan a lot easier than the U.S.
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Author: GLHopkins
Date: 2017-07-03 01:49
I've had many NEW E13 and R13 clarinets come across my bench for setup before going to a customer. There have been many E13 clarinets that have played as well or better than the R13 clarinets we've had in stock. I certainly wouldn't let the opinion of others influence my purchase if an exceptional E13 was available and was the best Buffet clarinet available. After all, you will be the one playing it. I've owned both models as well. The best Buffet clarinet I currently own is a 1971 E13.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2017-07-03 17:47
Back in about 1981, when I locally purchased an E&S E13, I was told by a big clarinet dealer in NY that the only difference between an R13 and E13 was bore polishing (!!!). Seemed odd to me ... But at the time, there was only about $275 difference in retail price ... When I got a chance to play an R13, they were somewhat dissimilar ...
Tom
Post Edited (2017-07-04 17:22)
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Author: jthole
Date: 2017-07-03 22:01
TomS wrote:
> But at the time, their was only about $275 difference in
> retail price ... When I got a chance to play an R13, they were
> somewhat dissimilar ...
>
I think there was a lot more mis-information in the pre-internet times, even among professionals ... after all, Buffet Crampon seems to be a bit secretive about the difference between the models (e.g. E13 and C12).
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Author: TomS
Date: 2017-07-04 17:34
Ditto ... much confusion with Buffet. I surmised that the E&S E13 was a way for Buffet to sell their "B" stock or stuff that didn't turn out as well as planned ... at some stage of production, they decided if the clarinet was an E13 or R13 and stamped the logo accordingly and performed the final fit and finish to match the semi-pro or pro status ... This dealer in NY was certain they had the same design, same wood, etc ... just a departure at some point in manufacturing for two different models ...
Now, the current E13? Who really knows for sure?
I suspect Buffet may be as confused about their history as we are ...
Remember the difference in clock speeds on the Intel 80286 processors? ... not made to different specs ... just tested and sorted ... the ones with "edge problems" were delegated as 12 MHz chips and the better ones were specified as 16 MHz ...
Tom
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Author: jthole
Date: 2017-07-04 17:52
TomS wrote:
>
> Now, the current E13? Who really knows for sure?
>
Buffet Crampon claim that the current E13 is based on the BC20 bore. I must admit that the BC20s I have played (a few) sounded and felt different to me than the E13 (but I only played two of those).
Ultimately only one thing counts; how well it plays :-)
(and I have not found anything yet that I like *really* better than my 1972 BC Continentale)
Post Edited (2017-07-04 17:54)
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Author: dmasz91
Date: 2017-10-27 06:48
I'm in the same boat. Just upgraded to an e13 limite thinking it would feel the exact same as the r13 I tried out in the store. I ran into one problem though, often when I go to play the lowest notes, it comes out as a high note. I am testing it with my student level mouthpiece, but I used the same mouthpiece to test out the r13 in the local music store and that problem didn't happen to me with that r13 model. I would say if you have the money, just go for the r13 to avoid any potential issues with settling for less.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2017-10-27 18:07
You have a leak, probably a pad ... that is why the lower notes are trying to come out as a high note ... easily fixed.
Tom
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Author: NoradBob
Date: 2018-06-14 14:00
I realize this is an old post, but I didn't see a good answer to your question. The E13 is tuned to 442, the R13 is tuned to 440. So location is one difference. Another is type of organization; i.e., concert band, orchestra or other ensemble. Concert bands with lots of brass instruments tend to tune higher than orchestras. Finally, historical references might be factored in. Buffet R13s that didn't make the grade for whatever reason were given Evette Schaeffer K serial numbers with a "special" designation of Master Model, Modele Buffet Crampon and, lastly, a designation with a serial number beginning with the letter E. This would seem to be a natural evolution, getting a model number rather than a serial number designation.
RJH
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Author: sax panther
Date: 2018-06-14 17:06
interesting - I didn't know they were tuned to different pitches. I did used to have an E13 and always ended up having to pull out quite a bit, so that would explain why I always used to be sharp!
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Author: Kalashnikirby
Date: 2018-06-17 19:58
I was under the impression the E13 had the same (similar?) bore as the RC. These instruments certainly differ from the R13 in their tonal concept, while I felt like a very fine pre-update E13 sounded like much like my RC.
Both come with 65mm barrels, so I'm not sure whether the R13 is inherently made for A=440hz, since that one mm difference could translate to a 2hz difference.
With the recent changes to the R13, RC and E13, most apparent through the new adjustment screws, their exterior is identical at first glance. On the homepage, it says the E13 inherited the RC's bell, which is its "sister clarinet", whatever that means, but its bore is supposed to be derived from the BC20. Buffet is secretive as about ever on what their bores actually look like.
Best regards,
Vhristian
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Author: jthole
Date: 2018-06-25 23:20
FWIW (and in Dutch): http://www.mrosaxofoons.nl/nl/content/buffet-crampon-klarinet-verschil-tussen-rc-en-e13
Not about the differences between the E13 and R13, but between one E13 and one RC clarinet. Shame he didn't measure the barrels and bells as well though.
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Author: tkillian
Date: 2018-08-10 19:31
Related ?
I have a Buffet (made in Germany)
Serial # 641151
Searching serial numbers on the internet it is either a 1960 R13 or a 1980s E13
How can I tell the difference (its was given to me by a relative)
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