 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: PoorCollegeOrc
Date: 2017-05-03 07:36
I'm in the process of looking for a professional clarinet and I really like the way Backun's cocobolo wood looks (especially with those gold keys 👌). Problem is that reviews (from what I've seen) are virtually nonexistent and the few that I've found have been skewed in favor of the R13 (is anyone surprised). Has anyone played the Protege? How well does it blend in with other clarinet brands? I remember reading in a thread that it doesn't blend well ensemble wise but I'm not sure how true that statement was.
The R13 is known as the (professional) clarinet standard. How do Selmer and Yamaha compare? Does either brand have a close R13 counterpart?
What are your thoughts on buying a clarinet online? It obviously comes with risks but you can't deny the accessibility it offers. Is it better when dealing with such expensive equipment to go to a store personally?
Finally, does anyone know any shops that sale clarinets in the Los Angeles area? I know RDG is a good place but I believe they only deal in Buffets.
Thanks a lot for your time and input.
Via WW&BW and Backun websites:
------Backun Protege - $2,900
----------Buffet R13 - $3,400
-----Yamaha YCL-CRSV - $3,100
Selmer Paris Recital - $5,800
"A squeak is a clarinetist's soul crying out for help."
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Author: Wes
Date: 2017-05-03 09:26
There were some recordings of clarinets on the Backun site.
You may consider looking at Howarth's in London and Matthew's Musiek in the Netherlands for price information. I've had good luck with both. Have you looked at Baxter and Northrup on Ventura Blvd? And how about Sam Ash stores?
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Author: gwie
Date: 2017-05-03 13:26
You can call the Yamaha Los Angeles Atelier (actually located in Buena Park) and schedule an appointment to try out and select an instrument there. Then, you get in touch with an authorized Yamaha dealer and pay for the instrument. Maybe twenty years ago, Yamaha was not there yet, but today their product is exceptional. I prefer the CSVR over new R-13's, and they can be found in the $2600-$2800 range. Also, note that you should be comparing it to the R-13 with silver-plated keys (on WWBW for $3793), as the CSVR also has silver-plated keys.
For Backun instruments in the US, try Kessler and Sons in Las Vegas. You pay up front for the instrument, but there is a 3-day trial period and you only pay for shipping if you decide not to keep the instrument. The Protege and the Model Q/Model F are excellent instruments, and the folks who actually own and play them don't seem to have any of these so-called "blending" issues. There are professional orchestras in the US where each member of the clarinet section plays on radically different equipment yet has not problem playing together!
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2017-05-03 14:06
I bought my Backun Alpha at Kessler & Sons in Las Vegas and it was an exceptional experience. Dave Kessler happened to be in the store when I dropped in, and had multiple touchpiece adjustments made to the instrument while I play tested it there. Dave's a real straight shooter and won't sell you what you don't need.
While you could buy a Backun online form Kessler's, Vegas is within fairly easy reach of LA. Wouldn't you rather invest a day's time, and come home with a perfectly set up new clarinet?
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2017-05-03 15:51
The Buffet has a minimum selling price. Dealers are not allowed to sell for less (or they break their dealer agreement). Yamaha has a minimum advertised price (MAP). Dealers can sell for what they want but can't advertise the price if it's too low.
A long way of saying that you may be able to get a Yamaha for less than you mentioned.
Steve Ocone
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Author: TomS
Date: 2017-05-03 17:33
I vote for the Yamaha CSVR ... only downside, IMHO, is not available in something other than wood ... I play in some bad situations ... ergo I've been using an R13 greenline, which seems to be very good (to my surprise!). I suspect the wood Buffets have a lot more variations ...
I'll probably get a CSVR, anyway ... played one a number of times and they are amazing. Yamaha's fit and finish is well beyond Buffet's ...
Selmer Signature, I have heard, is a contender for top wooden instrument.
If you are not insecure and can thumb (or blow) your nose at the Buffet Mafia, the Ridenour Lyrique Libertas is a world class performer ... and it's not made of wood!
Last two clarinets on my bucket list are CSVR and Ridenour Lyrique 576BC ... then I can die content ... bury me with my clarinets.
Tom
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Author: Geronimo
Date: 2017-05-03 17:48
As far as the Protege, I can't really recommend it. I went to a local music store and compared the Protege to a Yamaha 650 and came out liking the 650 better. I felt it was more in tune and a little better in response. The backun key work felt better though. Looking at the price, I can't see myself purchasing a Protege.
As far as the R13 being the professional standard, I think we should update that phrase. I made a longer post in a recent thread but long story short, the R13 Prestige is more inline with the quality and workmanship you would expect. Regular R13s are no longer Buffets top priority.
Looking at comparable options from Selmer and Yamaha, both are fantastic options. Yamaha's CSVR plays on par with my R13 Prestige and is about half the cost. They really are fantastic instruments and every CSVR I have tried has been well set up and fairly consistent. Yamaha's CSG II and SEAM (not available yet) would also be worth looking into.
With Selmer, the Presence model is a nice "half way point" between Selmer and buffet. Since it is close in price with the R13 it is definitely worth checking out. If you are able to spend more money for your upgrade, check out the Signature, Recital, and the Privilege. Many of my colleges use the Signature (same instrument you will find used by the principal CSO clarinetist) but my personal favorite is the Recital.
Regarding online purchases, I wouldn't do it. You don't know what you are going to be sent or what condition it will arrive in after shipping. On top of that you won't be able to try-before-you-buy to get the best possible instrument for yourself. You would be amazed how inconsistent clarinets can be, even in the same make/model. If your intention is to get a professional instrument that will last for your career, it would be worth the time to go find a way to try instruments in store and take them home on a trial. Play them for your teacher, use them in rehearsal to get a sense of them, play in a large room and not just in a practice room for yourself.
Feel free to ask any questions
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Author: ClarinetRobt
Date: 2017-05-03 20:01
Does even Corporate Buffet consider the R13 the gold standard? Flipping through any catalog shows Buffet making "better" or "more Pro-level" instruments for the last several decades. It might behoove Buffet to state the R13 as an entry level Pro or Advance-Intermediate instrument. (They'll surely disagree.)
I like Geronimo's point. Comparing the a standard R13 to the CSVR isn't an 'apples to apples' comparison. Also, didn't Buffet start making a retro R13?
~Robt L Schwebel
Mthpc: Behn Vintage
Lig: Ishimori, Behn Delrin
Reed: Legere French Cut 3.75/4, Behn Brio 4
Horns: Uebel Superior (Bb,A), Ridenour Lyrique, Buffet R13 (Eb)
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Author: SarahC
Date: 2017-05-04 16:10
i like the yamaha...
but because of wanting resin, i use the libertas. which is very nice to play too.
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Author: MisterB
Date: 2017-05-04 19:12
I am currently using a Selmer 220 with the gold keys. I really like it but I'm considering buying a new horn. I like the gold keys because my fingers slide easier on them. Other than Backun, who make clarinets with gold keys? Thanks
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Author: Geronimo
Date: 2017-05-04 19:58
MisterB wrote:
> I am currently using a Selmer 220 with the gold keys. I really
> like it but I'm considering buying a new horn. I like the gold
> keys because my fingers slide easier on them. Other than
> Backun, who make clarinets with gold keys? Thanks
Yamaha's CSG and new updated CSG offer a Hamilton gold option. However if you want gold (or anything else), an experienced instrument technician can have your keys replated in whatever metal you want. Usually the price is cost of overhaul + the cost of the metal because the entire instrument will need to be taken apart, plated, and setup with all new materials.
So any instrument can have gold keys if you want to pay for it.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2017-05-06 00:46
I wish a busy teacher in our area would recommend a Backun model like the F or Q ... then the local music store would stock them and I could check them out ... last Protege they had was defective ... looked great, but apparently damaged, the bore looked like it was carved with a chainsaw ... I think someone gouged it trying to remove a stuck swab or something ... I didn't see it last trip, so I guess they sent it back as I suggested. I have played the Alpha and Beta and they are very nice. Glad that we have a manufacturer in our "back yard" that makes such good stuff.
Tom
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