 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: wkleung
Date: 2017-01-31 12:26
I listened some clips of Cahuzac's playing and was hugely impressed with the liquidity of his tone.
Does anyone know what instrument(s) and mouthpiece(s) did he use?
p.s. I know very well the tone has more to do with the player than the equipment. However, with my experience on oboe and bassoon, using the same brand and model of an instrument almost always bring me closer to the sound of a certain artist.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2017-01-31 17:06
I agree. His playing was beautiful.
Not sure of clarinet, but I think his MP was the Vandoren 2RV ... which is very much like the current 5RV.
Tom
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2017-01-31 17:43
Philippe Cuper, principal clarinet in the Paris Opera Orchestra today, owns one of Cahuzac's personal instruments. I believe Cuper said that Cahuzac played on more than one mouthpiece in his very long career but that the Vandoren 2RV facing on the "Diamond Perfecta" model was one he used for many years. Cahuzac definitely played with a double-lip embouchure.
Post Edited (2017-01-31 17:45)
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2017-02-01 04:53
My guess based on recordings would be more of a close tip than open tip mouthpiece, and probably a reed more on the "light" side for that mouthpiece.
It certainly does not sound like a heavy reed (doesn't sound like he's one of those folks that tries to force a size 4.5 - 5 on every mouthpiece to make it 'darker')
And a clarinet made of love.
Alexi
I'm still debating when I can work on the Cantilene, I just want to make sure it's at a time of life where I can devote enough time to it to do it justice! What a BEAUTIFUL sound and song!
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2017-02-01 05:35
The late Yona Ettlinger was a student of Louis Cahuzac. I studied with Yona Ettlinger and he told me that when he knew him, Louis Cahuzac was using a Selmer mouthpiece. I don't recall which model he said it was and not even sure if he knew. Yona Ettlinger himself also played on a (refaced) Selmer mouthpiece.
To my ear, Yona Ettlinger sounded and played very much in the Louis Cahuzac tradition. Of course, that's a rather shaky statement on my part since I never heard Mr. Cahuzac play live, only on scratchy old recordings.
Yona Ettlinger played single lip and told me that Louis Cahuzac played double lip. I tried Yona Ettlinger's mouthpiece and reed setup a number of times and it was always a revelation. I think I still try, so many decades later, to play with a similar setup -- that's how much I liked it. Not sure how I would describe the setup but the word that comes to mind is "flexible." Yona Ettlinger's own explanation of the sound he was going for with his setup was "lifted." He never talked in terms of "dark" and "bright." Think about that.
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-01 11:09
Any information that you can give us about Yona Ettlinger will be precious! Thank you and we are awaiting more.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-01 14:12
Dear Seabreeze,
About four years ago, Philippe Cuper gave a talk on Cahuzac at the Vandoren headquarters here in Paris. At the time, he was trying to persuade Cahuzac's heirs to sell him his instrument. They wanted a fortune for it, as their mistaken belief was that it would be somewhat like selling Menuhin's Stradivarius or Stern's Guarneri. Do you know if he was actually able acquire that clarinet? I haven't seen him for a while.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2017-02-01 17:24
I could say a lot more about Yona Ettlinger but the best way to learn about him is to listen to him play.
He recorded both the Brahms and the Mozart quintets, the former for L'Oiseau Lyre, if I recall, and the latter for RCA. Both should still be available, if not on the original label then reissued on another label. He also recorded the Brahms sonatas and the trio -- live performances. He performed with the Tel Aviv String Quartet. His pianist was Pnina Saltzman.
The quintet recordings are out of this world and not only because of Yona Ettlinger. In fact, he would have been disappointed if someone had told him how great HE sounded on those recordings.
The ensemble playing is what really brings these performances home -- five musicians, one musical mind. I attended rehearsals in London for the Mozart recording and I can tell you that these five players, who had performed the piece together hundreds of times over the years, worked like fiends on creating what Yona described as a "unified conception." You can hear that clearly in the final result.
Yona Ettlinger was a person with an exceptional musical intellect who also happened to play the clarinet very well. That's why many of us who knew him and were fortunate enough to study with him regard him as in a class by himself.
Two people of note, both exceptionally fine musicians and first-class clarinet players (not to mention real gentlemen), who studied with Yona Ettlinger are Eli Eban and James Campbell. Today, they teach with Howard Klug at Indiana University in Bloomington.
FYI, Yona Ettlinger was principal clarinet with the Israel Philharmonic for a number of years. He then left to concentrate on chamber music and teaching. When he died of a heart attack in his mid fifties around 1985 (I don't remember the exact year), he was teaching at the Guildhall School of Music in London.
Paul Globus
Montreal, Canada
Post Edited (2017-02-01 17:35)
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-01 19:14
Thank you for the information, Paul. The first violinist of the Tel Aviv Quartet-Toub, I think his name was-once said that they had played the Mozart and Brahms Clarinet Quintets with a number of clarinetists, but none could hold a candle to Ettlinger. Playing with him was a unique experience. Sergiu Celibidache also had a very, very high opinion of him: he conducted him often with the Israel Philharmonic. I heard a recording of Ettlinger and Celibidache doing the Mozart Concerto, but it might have been a radio broadcast. It seems to me he lived here in France for a while. Philippe Cuper might have taken a few lessons from him.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2017-02-01 19:25
He maintained apartments in both Paris and London. I stayed with him in both.
I believe that the respect that Yona Ettlinger commanded from his colleagues and others was based on his musical insight, not solely on his clarinet-playing ability. He was an extremely intelligent person, which came through in every note he played.
I'm not implying that Yona Ettlinger was not a master of his instrument. He was. But his strong suit was his brain. It was always 100 percent engaged. He always knew what he was doing and, more to the point, why. He played the clarinet, it didn't play him.
Regards,
Paul Globus
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-01 19:30
Did he at all write musical commentary? Thoughts on music; on clarinet playing or on the works he played after giving so much profound thought to them. It would be wonderful, if it exists, if this writing were made available.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2017-02-01 19:40
He wrote the notes for the Mozart Quintet recording. I was there while he was drafting it and and he sent me the final version before it was printed.
I remember how he described Mozart and the delicate balance in Mozart's music between exuberance and melancholy. He wrote that Mozart was a composer who "laughed with one eye and cried with the other."
He also explained how there was a connection between how each movement in the Quintet begins and Freemasonry (Mozart and Anton Stadler were Masons).
Don't know about how much else exists of his writing.
Paul Globus
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Author: Wes
Date: 2017-02-01 23:24
Harry Gee studied in France in the late 1940s and then had a teaching, playing, and editing career in the USA. While I have no recent information on him, he could perhaps comment on the equipment used by Cahuzac. I bought a 5RV mouthpiece from him at that time when we played in the U of M orchestra.
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2017-02-02 00:20
Ruben,
Philippe Cuper. on the second page of his written notes to Cahuzac's 10 Etudes et Petit Piece de Dechiffrage for Clarinette (published by International Music Diffusion in 2012) says "Cahuzac's tone was exceptional, he played double lips [sic]embouchure with Vandoren mouthpiece and reeds. As his professor Rose before him, Cahuzac used a Buffet-Crampon clarinet (Klose system). I am now the happy owner of this clarinet." So I suppose the family must have reached some sort of agreement with him to buy the instrument.
Unlike the mythic status that surrounds the use of Chedeville mouthpieces by Ralph McLane and Harold Wright, I know of no fanfare among clarinetists concerning Cahuzac's equipment. In fact Guy Dangain, who studied with Cahuzac, said the famous double lip player was always concerned to extract the last bit of depth and resonance from the mouthpiece and clarinet and that it was evident he was working diligently to get the sound, which came from him and not the equipment. Having a Vandoren Diamond Perfecta or a Selmer mouthpiece with Cahuzac's facing won't give anybody Cahuzac's sound or Ettlinger's sound either. There have been thousands of players who used very similar equipment and didn't sound a thing like either Cahuzac or Ettlinger.
Post Edited (2017-02-02 04:19)
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Author: wkleung
Date: 2017-02-07 21:18
I have found the answer to one of my own questions: I just came across an old newsletter from Vandoren, which states that Cahuzac played on a 5RV.
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2017-02-08 01:40
Yes, the 5RV and the 2RV were the same facing though they were labelled differently. It was called 2RV in France for a long time and then the name was changed to 5RV. Same tip opening, same length.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2017-02-10 08:02
Quote:
I have found the answer to one of my own questions: I just came across an old newsletter from Vandoren, which states that Cahuzac played on a 5RV.
And off to the store I go to buy a 5RV to sound like Cahuzac!.....
j/k ...... I already have one ......
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-10 19:58
Sfalexi; Yet Cahuzac hadn't that reedy, nasal tone one associates with French clarinet playing of that period (Lancelot, Delecluse and others), practically all of whom played Vandoren 5RV mouthpieces. I attribute his roundness of tone to his use of double-lip embouchure. Needless to say, there are bound to be other factors, the principal one being personality and originality.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: wkleung
Date: 2017-02-10 20:01
Did other French clarinettists of the past play single-lipped?
I wonder if there is a recording of Mimart somewhere.
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-10 20:09
Dear Leung,
Paradoxically, none of Cahuzac's students played with double-lip embouchure, nor do the students of his students; the most notable being Philppe Cuper. Philippe is a student of Gilbert Voisin, a Cahuzac student. Cahuzac's contemporaries, to my knowledge, did not play double-lip,so he seems to be somewhat of a maverick in this respect. I don't think Bonade, most of whose career unfolded in the US, played double-lip (Bonade was Swiss born, but of French descent). Why Cahuzac is the exception, I don't know. On the other hand, Italians played double-lip until quite recently-until the late sixties, I would say.
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2017-02-10 20:30
My original teachers were Italian and they did indeed play double lip. That goes back to the late 1950's. I learned that way too and still play double-lip to this day. But I can also play single-lip, as could my teachers. And I think I sound exactly the same no matter which embouchure I employ.
My point? Good embouchure mechanics are good embouchure mechanics. It matters not whether your top teeth touch the mouthpiece.
For some people (like me), it's more comfortable to play double lip. But anything I can do playing double lip, I can do playing single lip. I just find the former more comfortable -- for me. It's all about a person's lips and teeth and facial muscles. I have no doubt that for Mr. Cahuzac it was a comfort issue as well.
It seems to me it is unwise to ascribe someone's playing ability to an embouchure choice, which is just one small factor in the whole business of playing the clarinet well.
Paul Globus
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-10 21:42
I totally agree, which is why I hastened to add that there exist other factors. Music-making is a many-layered onion. I too can play double or single-lip. Double-lip is more than just an element of comfort for me, though. It's part of my playing identity-albeit only a small part. I feel it gives me access to more subtle shades of color and intonation. I can make minute, unconscious embouchure adjustments I don't feel I can make with single-lip. I'm certainly not dogmatic about it nor think its the only way to salvation. Karl Leister and Harold Wright used single- lip and didn't do so badly!
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: ruben
Date: 2017-02-10 21:46
Paul, PS: I had an adult student once that was from Montreal. He also had had Italian teachers and learned double-lip. Were the clarinet teachers in Montreal Italian in the fifties or is this just a coincidence?
rubengreenbergparisfrance@gmail.com
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2017-02-10 22:30
Probably not a coincidence.
My teachers were Raffaelle Masella and Emilio Iacurto. I subsequently studied with Yona Ettlinger and took lessons with others, including Larry Combs.
Messers Masella and Iacurto were both principals in the Montreal Symphony Orchestra (though not at the same time as Emilio Iacurto was a generation younger). Incidentally, Ralph Masella was the oldest brother of at least six professional players who also held positions in the orchestra (oboe, bassoon, French horn, violin ... it was a real dynasty). I'm pretty sure that Michelle Gingras, who most everyone knows, was also a student of Masella in Montreal (many years after me, however).
The Italian tradition in Montreal goes back even before Masella, when Guiseppi Moretti was principal in Montreal. Not sure if Masella studied with Moretti but I recall that he did study in Paris, possibly at the Conservatoire.
Both Masella and Iacurto were monster players -- near perfect command of the instrument and a (now almost extinct) lyrical approach to music-making on the clarinet. I never played professionally beside Ralph Masella but I did play for years beside Emilio Iacurto. It was a gift and a privilege that I will be eternally grateful for.
Paul
Post Edited (2017-02-10 22:31)
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Author: Paul Globus
Date: 2017-02-10 22:45
Sorry, I didn't answer your question. Yes, the clarinet / saxophone / general professional music scene in Montreal included quite a few Italians from the 20's right through to the 70's, I would say.
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