 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: alanporter
Date: 2017-01-22 22:55
I note that in the Haynes Clarinet Manual by Stephen Howard he recommends using 75W90 gear oil for lubricating the keys. This is a much heavier oil than most of the oils advertised as "key oil".
I would be most interested to learn what the experts on this Board think about this.
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2017-01-22 23:27
This is one point on which I disagree with Steve on his otherwise very admirable book.
A heavy oil, e.g. grade 30/40 mptor oil is absolutely fine for lubricating pivot or point screws.
However for the long rods I believe something much lighter is required, and for many years past I have used the Doctor's products.
The longer the rod the more important this is, i.e. some of the old B&H professional clarinets had long rods for everything, including the LH F/C key.
For the amateur afficianado then in simple terms any oil is better than none, and a good standby is the old 3 in 1 or any similar cycle or sewing machine type oil.
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Author: ldrs
Date: 2017-01-22 23:32
I'm not an expert but probably he is exagerating. I use high-speed mechanisms oil or multi-purpose oil and they are not like fat or grease.
siulldrs@icloud.com
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2017-01-23 03:15
I'm not familiar with gear oil, but this sounds fairly thick. It would probably work if it was used during assembly, but I can't imagine applying it without removing the screw or rod.
Steve Ocone
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2017-01-23 13:24
SAE 75W gear oil doesn't seem to be so thick. First, make sure you are not checking motor/crankshaft oil instead. It is confusing but SAE specs for both are different i.e. same number is drastically different viscosity. Motor oil is much thicker than gear oil of the same SAE weight spec.
This is why I prefer to use the ISO scale. Here is a good chart https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/visc.jpg
I actually don't use oils with a weight specs for instruments so I am not sure what what they are exactly. I just tried many and found what I liked most. For every use I prefer to use the thickest oil that is not too thick for the purpose, since that would be the quietest and best to stay where it should, without affecting the movement.
You can see in the chart that 75W gear oil is actually some of the thinnest gear oil. There is a pretty big range inside that 75W so I guess it varies. The thinnest oil I use is almost like water and I only use it for some flute hinges and occasionally other instruments. IMO it is too thin even for excellent fitting clarinet hinge tubes. If I remember Type 1 from Doctor's Products is about this viscosity but I don't like it because of its smell.
For most clarinet hinge tubes (i.e. rod screws) I like an oil that I consider medium viscosity. For example Alisyn Heavy Duty (the name implies it is very thick but it's not). I think it's around ISO 68 which according to the chart is about the same as SAE 80W gear oil. This is still relatively thin for gear oil. Only in some cases I use thinner oil.
For hinge rods (i.e. pivot screws) I use very thick oil (maybe around ISO 460) or sometimes grease. There is a much smaller contact area so wear and noise are more likely. This isn't good for hinge tubes because of the larger contact area where you might feel the drag with oil that is too thick.
So... 75W gear oil sounds like a good general viscosity but is too broad of a range to say whether it fits a specific case. Luckily it is not that critical anyway.
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Author: Matt74
Date: 2017-01-23 21:51
At the Red Wing BIR priogram they use 5w-20 synthetic motor oil.
Something similar is 3-in-1 "motor oil" with the blue and white label (SAE-20). I think it used to be called "electric motor oil". It's thicker than the "all purpose oil". I don't know if it evaporates, though. Most places have it.
"Key oil" sold at music stores is too thin. It will run out and evaporate, and doesn't provide much lubrication. You want something with a little substance in there to provide a cushion between the parts, to stay put, and keep dirt out.
You really want a good needle dropper bottle, but you can use a drop on a toothpick.
- Matthew Simington
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2017-01-24 08:36
This is something that is kind of a sore subject for me. People in general don't take very good care of their horns and have them serviced once or twice a year or even bother to put a few drops of oil on the joints. So older horns have a lot of play in the keys, between the screws and the rods. In some cases they are actually frozen. You have to be really careful not to strip the heads of the screws. What a pain and what extreme carelessness to a beautiful instrument. Teflon works wonders when keys and posts have a lot of play. Some people might bend the posts to achieve a tighter fit. PLEASE DON'T!
For me it depends on the condition of the horns regarding what I will use for oil. In most cases the lighter the better, but if the horn hasn't been serviced and there is a lot of play you are kind of stuck using something synthetic heavy weigh. I prefer this type of oil because it won't gum up after a few years. Lucas is a pretty good all around product that will last a lifetime. It won't sludge up or varnish with age, so the keys won't wear out and get that metal on metal contact; hopefully if the horns are serviced.
It's sad to see horns fall in this bad of disarray.
I have a pretty fast car, pretty much a race car, and the engine oil is zero - 20 weight. It's like water! My point here is if you take care of your horns finer, lighter, oil is surely better. I wouldn't use this light of a weight. The spring action will always feel great, compared to using gear oil, which is like the thickness of butter.
By the way, I often put oil on the springs because they can rust over a period of time, then get weak.
Put a tiny drop of oil on the keys every 2 months or so and in 10 years the horn will still feel great.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2017-01-27 09:42)
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Author: TomA ★2017
Date: 2017-01-25 08:21
Hmmm...everyone here thinks oil is the right lube for key rods. But maybe not...
I learned years ago from a Schreiber tech in Germany to use a light grease instead. I have done this on my Schreiber-built E11 ever since, with flawless results. Also on other non-Schreiber clarinets
Tom Ridenour seems to agree with this approach: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTdWrRH2MGI
I'm a little surprised that no one has mentioned this.
Tom
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2017-01-25 17:47
I use mostly a very light synthetic grease that doesn't compromise key movement.
Steve Ocone
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