 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: clarinetmc
Date: 2016-11-23 03:18
Hi All:
I'm going to be trying some Backun MoBa clarinets in a few weeks and I was wondering what mouthpiece MoBa Clarinet users are playing on. I currently float between a Hawkins (R and G models) and a Vandoren B40 Lyre (13 Series). I realize these mouthpieces are very different from one another. I have been playing Buffet R13 clarinets for about 15 years, and am curious if anyone has any experience using a Vandoren mouthpiece on their MoBa clarinet. The B40 Lyre seems to be the mouthpiece that is the most comfortable for me, and helps me create the sound(s) that I like on the clarinet. I have tried many mouthpieces out there, and have narrowed it down to the Hawkins models and the Vandoren B40 Lyre, and am dreading another mouthpiece search. I'm assuming the M Series Vandoren models will not work great on the Backun MoBa clarinet (as they are designed for the R13), but am assuming the B Series Vandorens work on the MoBa. My main concern is intonation. The B40 Lyre edges out the Hawkins for me on my R13s, as it is easier to play in tune. Perhaps the Zinner-based Hawkins will work better on the MoBa Clarinet? Any thoughts and input is GREATLY appreciated!!! Thanks!!
Post Edited (2016-11-23 03:18)
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2016-11-24 18:53
Sadly no one can answer this. The Backuns are very dark lacking a a good ring to the sound based on what my ears hear. So it it up to you.
Are you playing these in a symphony or more for small chamber groups, quintets, those sort of performances? This is the new school of thought. Plastic reeds with dark Zinner mouthpieces and dark sounding clarinets, which a lot of players love, others totally can't stand. So judging what is best can really only be figured out by you and what you and your fellow players hear. Bring with yo a tuner. I have a very good ear, but the sounds can spread and the tuner may even have trouble funding the "Core," to the pitch and it will bounce around a bit. So you have to ask yourself if it is the mouthpiece, the horn, or both, and be VERY prepared to walk away.
That great German sound is still very special and it hasn't changed hardly at all in many years, but the French sound American sound is all over the map. The past 25 years have confused some of the very best players with sound.
So what are you looking for? An expensive instrument that is dark, very hard to hear in a large size orchestra, hard to tell if you are sometimes in tune, or something in the middle? Richard is a very good instructor.
I think Richard plays on plastic reeds and uses Zinner blanks, so added with the Backun Mobo horns you may not be heard. As for Vandoren M series mouthpieces remember that in general they tune to 440. When testing the Mobo's make sure you can tune from 440 to 442, because the newer flutes and oboes are brighter and sharper in the upper registers. The dead sounding clarinets won't have a chance.
Many will disagree, because if the price of the Backun's is so high, they MUST be that perfect clarinet. Right? I can't play them. I can't get get that big sound and that ringing in a hall. I can afford ant horn made on the planet but they don't work for me.
I also don't like the newer Buffets. I'm looking for that sound. I will never play a Buffet again unless they fix the bores. Players shouldn't have to adapt the companies should give the players the right tools to us. Most pro's use the same mouthpieces, now we are seeing the pros changing mouthpieces to play different pieces. Why? Because the horns and the mouthpieces are wrong.
So be very careful, barrow them and play them for a week or so, I'd try to play them for a few weeks, before paying out any money. Same with the assorted mouthpieces. I started messing around with mouthpieces because I didn't like the sound I was getting and I'm happier now, we are always trying to get better. Are you buying the $29,000 set?
PLEASE keep us posted.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: clarinetmc
Date: 2016-11-24 19:31
Thanks to both of you for your comments. I'm currently searching for new instruments because the intonation of my R13s is pretty difficult (and these are especially in-tune R13s). I recently borrowed a set of new Selmer Privileges, and the intonation was instantly better. I'm also considering a set of these. My main gripe about the Buffet is the intonation and the hold to the sound. They do have a beautiful brilliance though, which is why I always seem to go back to this model when I search for new horns.
Recently Backun Musical adjusted their prices, and a MoBa clarinet is comparable to a Buffet Tosca or Divine in terms of price. I have tried friends' MoBas in the past and find them to have a very special sound and intonation is fantastic. I am most curious about the intonation of my mouthpiece on a MoBa clarinet...so I guess it will be something that I will have to find out on my own when I try them. I've spent many years trying mouthpieces and always seem to bounce between the Hawkins and the B40 Lyre. My prediction is that the Hawkins will work better on the Backun MoBa and the B40 Lyre will work better for me on the Buffet. Nothing will be perfect, I understand that!
Doing research online, it seems most people play the MoBa clarinets with the MoBa mouthpieces. I've tried these mouthpieces and think they are good, but they are way too out of tune for my Buffet clarinets. They played too sharp for me, but perhaps this has something to do with the difference in the bore of the mouthpiece and the Buffet? Maybe these mouthpieces will work for me on a MoBa clarinet.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2016-11-25 04:36
Not sure, but I heard the Divine is discontinued. Maybe there are just too many stinky Buffet clarinets out that all sound the same and don't really offer any advantages. Yeah for Buffet if they are dumping horns that show no special advantages.
Right now I do not know of anyone using a Hawkins nor a B40 on a Backun, but call up Richard. He is a nice warm guy to talk with. Send him an email too.
Again, I repeat, don't get stuck on pricing.
I had a rude of awakening not long ago and thought I knew alot about horns. I was in your very same situation. I tried an assortment of several horns from lots of countries and companies. I'm so happy with what I have now and if you had a blindfold on when testing all of these assortments of horns you'd never believe that my first choice was the Yamaha CSVR's and the second choice was the Yamaha;s German bore CSG, a straight bore. I'm not the first pro to play on them. The solo clarinetist with Toronto Sym is using it and of course John Bruce Yeh, with Chicago. I had to go to the plants to get one, because you can't fine too many in the stores. I would gladly pay $10,000 for each of the horns. Oh, I even played on some very nice Buffets from the 1960's.
Even after 2 months now I look forward to playing on them. It's that much fun. No they are not perfect, but in my opinion the Backuns are not either, nor are any instruments right now. None of the companies are listening to the great musicians of our time.
An option is to ask the plant sales people at Yamaha to have their specialist pick out a set. You will save around $5000 per horn compared to the Divines which may have been discontinued and $23,000 or so of savings of $23,000 or so for a set of Backuns. Sure there is a sound difference, but as I said above are you looking for that really dark sound or a warm sound that will fill the halls of places like the Chicago Symphony. The Yamaha CSG German bore may just meet what you want, but I don't know if you want a smaller bore or a large bore that may not ring in Severance Hall, one of my favorite halls I've ever played in.
I my opinion there is not a great horn on the market right now, but some that stand out are the Yamaha's, the Selmer Signatures, and the very heavy Recital horn. Yes the Backuns are very good too, but they for sure won't land you an orchestra position, because I feel they are too dark. I'd rather see you play on a reformed German warm sounding horn which will fill Severance Hall and ring the walls.
Just be careful with your money and have others hear you play before forking out so much money. I almost want to grab your arm and take you with me on the journey I just went through.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: JTS
Date: 2016-11-29 07:45
Hey There,
I recently switched to Mobas and they are working great for me. Actually they have more ring and focus for me that what I was coming from, so I was looking for a mouthpiece that was a bit beefier actually.
Also, I played a B40 lyre for a long time and then switched to a Hawkins G about two years ago and it has been great for me. He sent me a few G's to try and I found one that worked a bit better for me on the Mobas than the particular G I had been playing.
One word of caution I would give is that with any equipment, different folks will get different results, and it's important to remember it's all about the relationship you have been the equipment, your concept, and your ears. It's always a process of listening, evaluating, and adapting. That being said, I think either a Hawkins G or a B40 lyre would be fine for testing out the Mobas.
Good luck!
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Author: Ed
Date: 2016-11-29 19:07
Really the only way to tell is by trying and seeing if it works for you. Everyone is different. If you are looking at Backuns, why not ask Backun what he suggests? You might also look at his list of artists and find someone whose sound you admire and ask them for suggestions.
Bob makes some great points about ring and projection, much of which he explains in the recent thread about the new Yamaha clarinets. Be sure to try the instruments in a rehearsal and in a concert hall if that is where you will be playing them. Sometimes what sounds good in a small room or 5 feet away will not work in the larger settings.
The most important is to play what works for you and not what works for someone else.
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Author: clarinetmc
Date: 2016-11-30 04:05
Thanks so much for the replies JTS and Ed!
I was mainly asking so that I am prepared when trying the instruments. I have not seen anyone playing a Vandoren on a MoBa clarinet (I'm sure there are some out there), and wanted to see what people's experiences are with these instruments and which mouthpieces they use. I know for certain that no single mouthpiece works for everyone, and I have personally found that the B40 Lyre and Hawkins mouthpieces work for me.
I know the Hawkins mouthpieces will work (Richard Hawkins and Ben Lulich play Backun clarinets with Hawkins mouthpieces), but was curious if anyone has tried the Backun with a Vandoren mouthpiece. JTS, have you tried your MoBa with your B40 Lyre?
Thanks so much for your replies, everyone!
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2016-11-30 04:10
As a MoBa player I've never had a problem carrying the sound to the back of the hall.
I use a Hite ML41 on mine currently. My other mouthpiece that works really well on them is the D'Aarrio Reserve mouthpiece
Peter Cigleris
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