 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Nzb2018
Date: 2016-07-24 01:13
So recently I found out the name for the kind of tonguing I have been using, anchor tonguing. I have been working on tip to tip tonguing for the past week but there are some problems that I have encountered. More often than not there is an undertone in the upper clarion, specifically G to C. And none of my altissimo notes above high D are able to tongue and most often jump up the register (altissimo E to A, etc.). My private teacher is busy right now and I don't start lessons back until next month. Does anyone have tips or tricks to help me out?
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2016-07-24 03:14
Making a fundamental change to something you have done previously takes patient practice.
I wonder if in trying the new tounging you might be letting your embouchure slacken slightly.
You may also have to experiment with exactly what part of the "tip" of tounge and exactly how near the exact tip of the reed you are using.
It is quite normal not to use the exact tip of tongue on the exact tip of the reed, in fact it is probably rare.
Try using the broader part of the tip just underneath the tip of reed for instance.
In the end you have to find what works best for YOU.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2016-07-24 03:29
I'm curious to know if you're trying to change because you were told anchor tonguing is "wrong" or because it's causing problems of its own that you can't solve without changing your basic approach.
Karl
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2016-07-24 05:27
Anchor tonguing is one of those things that was fairly common at one time, but is now considered by many to be incorrect. In Keith Stein's The Art of Clarinet Playing, he discusses the topic in great detail, and considers it to be a correct tonguing option for what he calls the "long tongue" problem.
I once knew someone who picked up anchor tonguing on his own. It felt more natural for him, but he couldn't tongue with any speed and he developed the habit of moving his jaw every time he tongued. A switch to the more conventional tip-to-tip fixed a lot of his tonguing issues.
Karl is right. Are you switching because you were told anchor tonguing is wrong, or because it's creating problems? If you're getting good results with it, I see no absolutely need to switch.
If there is a need to change, consider Norman's advice. Because tongues differ from person to person, the advice given to someone may have to be adapted slightly for someone else. Because teachers can't see what's going on inside a mouth, it's sometimes difficult to figure out exactly what's going wrong when students have tonguing issues.
Norman had an interesting thought when he mentioned the possibility of the embouchure slackening. Using a mirror, see if your embouchure changes when you start tonguing. If it does, try making a few adjustments--perhaps pulling your lips back just a little, or perhaps going more toward the "Q" or aardvark approach. You could also try playing double lip. I'm not sure why, but that little switch does help fix some tonguing issues.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2016-07-24 05:31
Well, Larry Combs would be in the minority on this one as he tongued and taught tip to tip (the very tip of each).
I am re-visiting issues I have always had with double tonguing and I am finding that doing S-L-O-W Baermann scales (circa 40 beats per minute) as "slur two, tongue two" are REALLY beneficial. The first go around exposed a LOT of extraneous noise and goop, but within the next practice sessions I have been able to substantially improve. Perhaps a similar approach can help the single tonguing issue.
Also, remember, ANY scoopy sounds are caused by to little air and you need to push more air when (if) this is occurring.
...................Paul Aviles
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Author: Nzb2018
Date: 2016-07-24 08:37
Not because it's wrong, but because I'm having problems tonguing up to speed and my tone was suffering.
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Author: gwie
Date: 2016-07-25 10:34
I've had three students in the past ten years who came to me with anchor tonguing (with the contact of the reed near the middle of the tongue) and while I would not have changed anything at all had they worked fine, in all three cases while their articulation in fast passages sounded just fine to them close up, farther away in any venue sounded like mush. Video recording in a few different spaces allowed them to compare the results, and prompted them to try learning a different way to articulate. Not to say that they should never anchor tongue...two of them had absolutely beautiful, clean, attacks and those worked for slow movements wonderfully.
A colleague of mine didn't change things until she headed off to graduate school...and in confessing to her new teacher that she could not make heads or tails of the Mendelssohn Scherzo, played it once for him and he knew instantly (!). Changing her from anchor tongue to tip tongue made it possible for her to reach a reasonable tempo in that particular excerpt.
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Author: Jarmo Hyvakko
Date: 2016-08-02 17:25
I have been anchor tonguing for whole of my life, anchor tonguing meaning that the tip of my tongue is touching my lower lip whole the time and i am beating the reed very near the tip of the reed with a spot somewhere backwards from the tip of my tongue, without even knowing the name of the technique. I am able to play 16th notes in over 140 tempo, at least for a short while. I would say that there just are 3 different main techniques out there. 1: tip to tip, 2: anchor tonque and 3: old Italian, beating the reed through your lower lip. The key question is, in which version your toungue is most relaxed and how can you adjust the attack-quality the best, because in the woodwind section the clarinet is the bridge-builder between the oboe-razor and flute-fluff.
Jarmo Hyvakko, Principal Clarinet, Tampere Philharmonic, Finland
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2016-08-02 18:06
Jarmo Hyvakko wrote:
> because in the
> woodwind section the clarinet is the bridge-builder between the
> oboe-razor and flute-fluff.
>
I like this, except that some of the flutists I play with have tones I would not describe as "fluff." 
Karl
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2016-08-02 21:22
Jarmo Hyvakko said:
>I have been anchor tonguing for whole of my life, anchor tonguing meaning that the tip of my tongue is touching my lower lip whole the time and I am beating the reed very near the tip of the reed with a spot somewhere backwards from the tip of my tongue, without even knowing the name of the technique.
This goes to show that the technique does work well for some people, and if it does work, there's no reason to change.
When most people think of anchor tonguing, they think of the tip of the tongue resting against the bottom teeth. In Keith Stein's lengthy discussion of anchor tonguing in The Art of Clarinet Playing, several variations of the technique are mentioned, including placing the tongue on the gum just below the lower teeth or placing it on the inside membrane of the lower lip. He discusses another method that I've never seen discussed elsewhere, but perhaps it was widely practiced at one time: it involves "placement of the underside of the tongue tip on the lower lip membrane and gliding it roller-fashion back and forth into the angle where the reed and lip meet." (p. 25)
David Pino (a very devoted Stein student) has a short discussion of anchor tonguing in his The Clarinet and Clarinet Playing. He doesn't exactly advocate it, but he admits it works well for some clarinet players with long tongues.
Many years ago I studied at summer camp with Larry Maxey (who also studied with Stein). Maxey mentioned it in a discussion with several of us. I had never heard of it before and he didn't suggest that anyone try it, but he did mention it as an acceptable method for those who felt most comfortable doing it that
way.
Nicholas, by now you've probably tried a number of things. If traditional tonguing still isn't working for you, take a look at Keith Stein's book for his many anchor tonguing suggestions. I'd also suggest taking a look at Roger McKinney's tonguing article (not anchor tonguing) and his suggested "n" or "nu" tongue syllable:
https://www.tcnj.edu/~mckinney/tonguing.htm
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Author: Jarmo Hyvakko
Date: 2016-08-03 14:13
Thank You Clarinetguy for interesting remarks! Actually, what happens at least in my version of anchor tonguing is, that the tongue touches the reed somewhere in the n-area, which is slightly behind the t-area, d-area being the tip of the tongue.
I think teachers shouldn't be too strict in teaching which part of the tongue touches which part of the reed. Our bodies are in many cases much more clever to solve many problems than our brains. Just imagine if we were taught to walk verbally! For example, originally i was taught the double lip embouchure, articulation happening through the lower lip. Then came another teacher teaching that the upper teeth should touch directly the mouthpiece and the tongue should beat directly the reed. Period. My body found the easiest way to do it.
Jarmo Hyvakko, Principal Clarinet, Tampere Philharmonic, Finland
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Author: Zacharywest158
Date: 2016-08-04 17:27
Disclaimer: what I'm about to tell you has worked for me, but may not for you.
I myself am an anchor tounger. I suffered with similar issues involving crappy tone, slow tounging, etc. This was very frustrating, made only worse by the "prejudice" against this way of tounging.
What has worked for me is to realize that anchor tounging is often associated with a lower tounge position. By focusing on raising the back of my tounge and exploring different voicings, I have been able to improve upon many of the issues that I have been suffering from without relearning how to articulate.
This may be something to consider. The issues you are experiencing may be more issues caused by poor voicing/bitinqg, rather than where you happen to articulate.
Just a thought.
Best of luck on your journey!
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Author: donald
Date: 2016-08-05 12:31
I have a few comments to add, but no time just now... I will take a minute to make one observation...
It has been mentioned that the size of the tongue has an influence on which part of the tongue you can comfortably use to articulate at speed- I certainly agree with this, but there is another factor that comes into play...
The angle that the mouthpiece enters the mouth- if you experiment with changing this angle you will find that if the mouthpiece enters the mouth closer to 90 degrees, then the tip of the mouthpiece is further IN the mouth- altering the tongue position needed to articulate on the tip of the reed.
If the mouthpiece is at a steeper angle, then the tip of the reed is "further away" (closer to the teeth) and articulating on the tip of the reed can be achieved with the tongue in a more natural relaxed position....
I'm in a bit of a rush so could have worded this better, but if you experiment I'm sure you'll appreciate the difference I describe. This factor would have a considerable influence on anchor tonguing vrs tip to tip (it certainly does in my case)/
More later
dn
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