 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2016-05-13 02:59
Best I can come up with (since I don't have a full boehm or an A clarinet available) is literally sticking the toe of my boot in the bell to severely flatten the B, and hitting the C# key to tremolo it. Similar to when sax players put the bell of their horn against their knee to play a low A.
It's background stuff anyway, but does anyone have some weird combination of keys that works better?
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2016-05-13 15:03
Alexi,
There may be more to your question than you initially realize and that is "how did this tremolo come about?" Is it an orchestra transcription? If so, that might explain why if you had an A clarinet you might have a better shot at it.
My other question is "Are you playing an arrangement by someone that just used Finale or a similar program to transpose a chordal part to clarinet?" I ask this since a couple of years ago, I was playing in a local civic band that was featuring one member as soloist using an arrangement that his wife (a percussionist) had written (more like transcribed) using a music composition program of some sort. It was loaded with impossible tremolos across the break like the one you have indicated.
So, I asked her why she picked these notes and the answer was "it was a piano part that I just separated out for different instruments." She had no clue as to how hard she had made the part for a clarinet to play.
If it was me, I'd just play it an octave lower.
HRL
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-05-13 16:29
Drill another hole in the top joint (between the top trill tonehole and speaker tube) and add another trill key for this tremolo.
Or if you can do without the B altogether, push a banknote of the ideal size rolled up into a tube in the bell to flatten the bell note to an A# (I just remembered US banknotes are all the same size so it wouldn't make any difference what value you use!). That works for playing the low Bb on cor anglais in Mahler symphonies so should work on clarinets.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2016-05-13 16:44
Alexi-- am I misunderstanding? A#4 would be throat tone A#?
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: kdk
Date: 2016-05-13 17:00
This is one of those cases where arrangers (or composers) deserve whatever comes out when people play what they've written.
How many players are on the part? Is it doubled somewhere else (in the same octave)? I'd make it metric in the quickest subdivision you can do with control. If there are enough people playing it, even a relatively slow tremolo between the two notes should create the intended effect.
I don't know a fingering that would span that interval. I'm assuming there isn't time to put some kind of paper extension into the bell to make the Bb come out with a completely closed fingering. I did it just now with a piece of letter-sized paper rolled into a cone and pushed into the bell. It actually produced a decent A#/Bb and pressing the C# gave me the C#. You'd need time to put the insert in (and you have to secure it somehow, or it just blows out when you play). Or have a stand-by instrument prepared ahead of time with the insert and pick it up at some point when there's time before the passage. You won't be able to play B5 with the insert in place.
I'd say this is going to too much trouble to get an inept composer/arranger out of trouble, but YMMV.
Karl
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Author: Burt
Date: 2016-05-13 19:49
A modification of Chris' second idea may work here. Bari sax players lacking a low A will use a piece of PVC pipe in the bell (length decided by trial and error) and finger the Bb. The other notes (other than low Bb) are unaffected. I did this when I played bari.
It's a little trickier on a clarinet, not having gravity to hold the pipe in place, so you would need some spongy material on the outside, much like a trumpet mute, except that it needs to seal on the whole circumference. Best guess is 1" diameter, which is readily available.
This should also work for low Eb when transposing the low E on an A clarinet part.
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Author: Jeff Chan
Date: 2016-05-14 23:17
A trick I discovered when experimenting in trying to get a low e-flat on a clarinet (an A clarinet part that was written for a full Boehm) was to insert a Pack-A-Stand (the plastic one with the folding legs) into the bell. It fits tightly enough to stay, but is easily removed.
This trick gave me a sufficiently in-tune low e-flat. It will be a bit stuffy, of course.
I just tried this and fingering a middle line b does result in a b-flat, with an easy tremolo to the c-sharp above. As noted in a previous post, you will need enough time to remove the item if a b natural is later required.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2016-05-15 04:50
I like the idea of inserting a pack-a-stand or tube of some sort. Like I said, it's coloring behind a brass line (it's part of a march), but it's supposed to be at double forte so although it's not the main part, it definitely fills out the background.
I have two meaures rest before and after this tremolo so I can easily stick something in that bell and pull it back out.
I'll reply tomorrow or the day after with the name of the piece in case anyone is wondering.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2016-05-15 06:43
How fast is a tremolo? How long would it take to train the fingers to execute the regular fingerings at the desired speed? Not trying to be facetious; it might be doable.
It brings to mind the break-crossing series near the end of the Mozart concerto in the version for standard soprano clarinet. After playing that undoubtedly a great many times over the years, you can probably fly through those notes cleanly at a fine clip (unless you've been handicapped by an attachment to the new-fangled basset clarinet version.) So . . . .
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2016-05-17 20:14
The piece is a march called "The World is waiting for the Sunrise" (a euphonium feature).
The tremolo seems to be at a spot where it should be played quickly and almost 'violently'. So I'm playing it around 16th notes at 160 (the tremolo...the piece is slower, we're taking it around 110).
But like I said above, I think the best course of action is to change the octave, or just quickly shove something in the bell to lower the pitch.
Just wanted to get back to you with the name of the piece.
here's the march, and it's cued to the parts with the tremolos. you'll notice about four bars before the tremolo starts, and then after it ends, there are more bars rest before the next one. Should be enough time to insert the 'mute'.
https://youtu.be/LyBDLtpoFS4?t=1m24s
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-05-18 00:26
Alexi..don't know if Uncle Sam issues his musicians "A" clarinets (baring maybe the Army's Orchestral players) or if this is allowed, but might you transpose a section of the work around the difficult trill where (if) there's a break, up a half step and play that section, including the trill (now a clarion "B" to "D") on an "A" clarinet?
The 2 measure break you describe at 160 clicks (metronome, not klicks as in kilometers soldier ;-) ) seems too little time to swap clarinets.
????
Post Edited (2016-05-18 01:07)
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2016-05-18 06:03
Quote:
Here is a video. Check out the 1st clarinetist's fingering; there may be a clue there of some sort. Lol. Seems to me they just took it up an octave. I can't hear the correct octave in that part. No biggie. Gets the point across.Quote:
Alexi..don't know if Uncle Sam issues his musicians "A" clarinets (baring maybe the Army's Orchestral players) or if this is allowed, but might you transpose a section of the work around the difficult trill where (if) there's a break, up a half step and play that section, including the trill (now a clarion "B" to "D") on an "A" clarinet?
The 2 measure break you describe at 160 clicks (metronome, not klicks as in kilometers soldier ;-) ) seems too little time to swap clarinets. I didn't put it as clearly as I should have. My bad. The piece will be played around 110 bpm. The speed of me going back and forth between notes (A# to C#) is around 160, just to put in perspective the previous poster's idea of just working on it. I might be able to work on it one day, but with about 5-10 unique performances a month, with different music for at least half of those, and working up to the fourth of July holiday (a ... shall we say.... holiday of note for us Army bands? lol), I don't think I'll have the time or even really the patience to work it up by next month.
I think I'm gonna just try one of two things. Either bring it up or down an octave and see if it lies well, and if that doesn't work, I'm just gonna ask the tenor or alto saxes to play THAT specific tremolo and let them hit it in the correct octave.
Well, if anything, I got some great ideas. I really do want to try the pak-a-stand idea, as that'll be easy to implement and try out. But if that doesnt work, I'm just gonna play it up or down an octave (more than likely down an octave so it's not too high and shrilly with all those clarinets and flutes)
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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