 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: TomS
Date: 2016-05-05 07:17
Considering purchasing an E-flat for use in a non-professional community band. I love this little instrument (God help me!).
Secondary uses might be to strip paint or encourage the evacuation of all vermin from my home.
Once owned a Selmer Series 9 that was excellent, but sold it years ago ...
Wondering if someone has experience with relatively inexpensive E-flats ... I'd spend as much as the Buffet E-11 (about $2200.00, street price) ... but open to alternatives.
Biggest issue with this little critter is intonation, especially in the altissimo register ...
Suggestions?
Tom
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2016-05-05 07:24
Your only choice is a Bundy. It's indestructible and damn good. A decent mouthpiece and maybe a custom barrel will make a dramatic difference.
Ken Shaw
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Author: concertmaster3
Date: 2016-05-05 08:06
There are a few options on our favorite "bayside auction site". If you're willing to go up to 2200, there was a Leblanc LL and a Buffet R13 just from doing a quick search.
Ron Ford
Woodwind Specialist
Performer/Teacher/Arranger
http://www.RonFordMusic.com
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Author: TomS
Date: 2016-05-05 15:52
I owned a Bundy (overall very sharp and terrible intonation, unplayable IMHO ... actually sent it to Mike Lomax and he had same opinion and no cure). I may have just had a really bad one ... I have several Bundy B-flats and they are fine. Bundys have NO flies on them, overall ... MP I used was HS*/WW G8/VD 5RV ... Mike mentioned that sometimes a custom barrel could work wonders ...
Test played LL (seemed OK at the time) and the R13 I was not especially impressed with (I think this one was a dud). The Selmer was by far the best, but during one of my "resets" and getting out of the playing business, I sold it for a good amount ...
Hoping an Asian made XYZ brand has a glimmer of hope ... but I'd give the E11 a shot, if no Asian options ...
I asked Ted Ridenour if Tom might entertain making an E-fer, but I don't think they'd touch it with an 11-foot pole ...
More suggestions? Surely someone has an endorsement?
Thanks in advance!
Tom
Post Edited (2016-05-05 15:56)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2016-05-05 16:47
I played a Leblanc LL Eb in the U of Tennessee Band and subbed in the Knoxville Symphony. It played very sharp (with a Selmer mouthpiece, probably a C*). I had to improvise thick tuning rings by sanding garden hose washers down for both the top and bottom barrel sockets, but after that it played fine. You might try the same thing for a Bundy.
Clark Fobes makes an extension that fits between the body and the bell, which has gotten unanimous praise. I have no idea whether it will fit a Bundy, or in fact anything other than a Buffet.
Older Selmer Ebs (such as the Series 9) are the gold standard.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Johan H Nilsson
Date: 2016-05-06 00:34
The single Vito Eb I have tried had better intonation than the single LL I have tried.
I bought the Vito for $300.
Mouthpieces and barrels matter more on Ebs than on longer clarinets, so the work doesn't stop with the clarinet.
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-05-06 06:17
Howdy!
I posted this a few days ago, and I share it with you. A great E11, at a good price. If you call them, they may very well bargain with you, ask for Bonnie.
Here is a great Eb at a good price:
http://www.hornstash.com/products/Used-Buffet-E11-Eb-Clarinet-1034XX-2799.html?cPath=5_43_54_586
And rather worth it, too!
(Note: I do know the folks @ HornStash, very nice people. I have played the Eb in this note. And, no, it is not my property being sold! Just like to help folks find a very nice instrument!)
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: TomS
Date: 2016-05-06 15:37
Thanks everyone ... now looking for instruments recommended.
We have a semi-pro Wind Ensemble here that I occasionally play in, and the "squeak-o-phone" player uses an R13 with Lomax MP and Fobes extension ... and she sounds fine.
I wonder if Fobes extension works with E11?
Tom
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-05-06 20:15
Aftermarket barrels and the lower Fobes extension work very well with an E11, however - you may have to have the socket on the extension modified a bit for proper fit. The extension really does help tame the bottom end of the Eb. Fobes makes excellent Eb barrels, too - (as does Backun) these barrels really take any chance of the "toy ocarina" sound away from the Eb throat tones. (The Backun barrel also has a cut-out enabling you to use un-cut Bb reeds on the horn. A time-saver, and Bb reeds on the Eb really opens the sound!)
Good luck on your quest!
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: MartyMagnini
Date: 2016-05-06 20:38
I use the Fobes extension on my E11, and it fit fine with no alterations. I must say, I find this particular E11 to be a very nice instrument - much closer to a professional instrument than the E11 Bb, in my opinion. I would play it in a professional situation with no concerns. I also recommend the Backun barrel with the cutout - makes it so you can use Bb reeds without cutting them. I have always used Bb reeds on Eb, as many players do. I don't know if any other barrel makers feature the cutout - it's a great idea.
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Author: DarkHairedIrish
Date: 2016-05-07 04:28
"I asked Ted Ridenour if Tom might entertain making an E-fer, but I don't think they'd touch it with an 11-foot pole ..."
Maybe if enough of us ask for a Ridenour Eb clarinet we could make it happen.
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Author: Dm Zisl
Date: 2016-05-07 16:02
What I did was, I got a Normandy 8 (can be 10) 1950's eefer off eBay in good shape, they go under $500 and are fully professional instruments. Took it to my tech, got things fixed what needed to be fixed. Got the Fobes Eb extension, Backun 41.5mm and Fobes 43mm barrels, and Backun bell. For setup, I am using Grabner Eb mouthpiece, M/O lig. The entire "eefer on a budget project" cost me under $1,500 including partial recorking and repadding.
See the video here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZxha3SEZyQ
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Author: bradfordlloyd
Date: 2016-05-07 17:28
Dm Zisl's approach is what I did and would recommend as well.
I was able to pick up a vintage Selmer Paris eefer from that auction site that was in good shape, but was missing part of the throat Ab/G# key. I got the horn for less than $200, and was able to have a key fabricated for about $100.
Then, I had the horn overhauled, bought a case, added a Backun barrel and bell, and now alternate between a Fobes Eb mouthpiece and a Vandoren M30.
It's a great horn that plays beautifully and very well in tune. In all, I have put approximately $1,000 into the horn and have been pleased with the results (especially when compared to the cost of a new horn).
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Author: bill28099
Date: 2016-05-08 02:03
I got a basket case pre WWII wooden Normandy off of eBay some 10 years ago for around $200. Cleaned it up and re-padded it myself. Had a tech repair the severely damaged lower tenon. It plays quite well up to high C and after that it is invent your own. I've loaned it a couple of times to orchestra players and they seemed to like it. Never tried barrels or bells on it although it could sure use a nice bell, eons ago someone took it off with a pair of pliers.
A great teacher gives you answers to questions
you don't even know you should ask.
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2016-05-08 04:20
I played Eb clari in a military band 55+ years ago. When the base closed the band was disbanded (lovely word) and I "souvenired" the Eb. If I hadn't it would have just sat on a shelf for decades and then been sold as scrap. It's a metal Albert system, I think by Buffet, and probably goes back to the 1800's. I normally play Boehm system claris, but the muscle memory is still there and when I pick it up my fingers automatically go to the right place. It still plays and tunes well.
Tony F.
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Author: Ed
Date: 2016-05-08 06:23
I see that there is a used Noblet currently for sale in the classifieds area.
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Author: TomS
Date: 2016-05-08 20:13
We might take up a collection for Tom Ridenour to fund the E-flat project ... a million bucks might do it ... the way I understand E-flats, there is just something intrinsically problematic with making the little beasts behave ... I don't think you can just scale-down a B-flat and expect it too work properly.
Perhaps a complete review and totally new design paradigm might produce an instrument that plays as well as a good B-flat ... and probably wouldn't visually resemble the current E-flat models ... maybe extra keys, MP re-sized, etc.
Maybe a clarinet designer will post some insight on this ...
Looks like a properly tweaked E11 is the most available solution in the meantime, if you don't have 6 grand to spend ...
Tom
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