 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-04-13 21:43
Attachment: image.jpeg (632k)
Often I get calls for Theater Pit Gigs. Often the pits are exactly that - Pits! Environmentally horrid spaces of unguessable heat or cold, and humidity of Sahara-Desert to Rain-Forest quality. I was feeling very sorry for my clarinets. My main horn was a "Brannenized" 1969 Buffet R13, also in circulation was a Leblanc Dynamic H, and 3 Selmers - a Centered Tone and 2 wonderful "Brannenized" Series 10 clarinets.
My initial introduction to Ridenour Clarinets was their C clarinet, and I found it delightful in every respect. Wonderful tone, accurate intonation to the extreme, and comfortable under the hands. I used in in several shows, covering oboe and flute parts, and the Music Directors all were enchanted by the sound of this clarinet.
So, I took the next step, and purchased their Bb - the Libertas Clarinet. I found this instrument resplendent in every way. In fact, in a wee bit over a year this has become my main "go-to" clarinet for every gig, including Wind Ensemble and Symphonic work. Spot-on intonation, and a gorgeous sound. So, all my other clarinets are in retirement!
Now - my A clarinet. I played an early Selmer 10G clarinet, with serial number and documented proof of being one of the few selected by the Selmer Factory to be sent to Moennig and Ralph Morgan for fine-tuning and regulation. It is a most fabulous instrument. The sound is to die for!
But, I've already found love for Ridenour Clarinets with the Libertas and their C clarinets. Trusting the fact that Tom Ridenour is one of the absolute best Clarinet Acousticians in the market today, I ordered the new Lyrique A Clarinet.
Side Story here - A very good Orchestra friend of mine recently purchased a pair of Buffet Prestige R13 clarinets, and immediately took them to Brannen Woodwinds in Evanston, to have them do their magic. He asked me to test drive his pair, so I did. Got to tell you - these are very beautiful looking horns, and they indeed played quite well, but - the Libertas Bb played circles around the Prestige R13 Bb. So, he has 2 clarinets and he's in around $6,500 each!
The day came (yesterday, in fact) that My Ridenour A arrived. This Clarinet makes that Prestige R13 sound like a toy! Anything from an earth-shaking FFF to a whisper ppp, totally even scale, great pop and ring. What a great clarinet, this one is! So fluid to play, very comfortable under the hands, absolute first-rate quality of manufacture. I lost the time of day playing it! It is THAT good. So - the Selmer 10G A is now in official retirement from me, and probably soon on the market.
Good timing, I'm scheduled to play Smetana's "Moldau" in a couple weeks, written for C, A and Bb, so it will be an all-Ridenour gig for me.
The Ridenour Clarinets are the "Real-Deal" truly Professional Clarinets. Regardless of price. Sorry, you couldn't give me a Prestige now. I am a very happy fellow!
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-04-13 21:45
Photo above is my 3 Ridenours. C, Bb and A.
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-04-13 23:45
Ken...watch me light a match in a rocket fuel factory:
"Ridenour....why those clarinets are made of hard rubber, everyone knows a good clarinet has to be made of wood! A wood clarinet sounds "woody," a plastic one "plasticy," a hard rubber one "rubbery," and a purple one "purpley."
(I'm kidding. I much enjoy my Ridenour A.)
Post Edited (2016-04-13 23:46)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-04-14 00:39
I wonder if any of the fine professionals who have Ridenour clarinets "to play in poor conditions" and save their "better" clarinets to play indoors or when it's nice- ever wish it would start raining so they would have an excuse to play the horn(s) they actually prefer. ("Darn it- the weather is beautiful.")
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2016-04-14 00:44)
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-04-14 01:28
Dave, Dave, and Stan -
Dave 1 - Call Tom and chat! They're wonderful folks there!
Dave 2 - Funny!
Stan - Not sure, but this I know - My choice is the Ridenour. I still only play the Buffet R13 Eb, because Tom doesn't market one. I still play my Yamaha Bass, because I'm not ready to buy the Low-C Bass from Tom until February 2017.
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
Post Edited (2016-04-14 04:15)
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Author: DougR
Date: 2016-04-14 04:42
Good Lord, Ken, what a review!
After reading it I toddled over to Tom's website to check out the C instrument (it's on my bucket list, but in light of your review, not perhaps for long). I prowled around the website much more fully than in the past, and had a wonderful time discovering how much Tom knows and how far his clarinet horizon stretches. What a guy! (I now know that Tom studied mouthpiece craft with Everett Matson, didn't know that, and that he makes a "HW" model clarinet mouthpiece based on the actual measurements HE TOOK of Harold Wright's Ched…so if I were going to try to sound like Harold Wright, Tom's is the mouthpiece I'd do it on)
My only question to you is, did he send you multiple instruments for trial, or just the one? How detailed was your pre-purchase discussion in terms of setting up your instrument before shipping? (in other words, how "right out of the box" was the horn he sent you?)
Finally, what kind of bore oil does he recommend for rubber instruments?
(I'm kidding, I'm kidding)
Good luck with the A, and thanks for the review!
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-04-14 05:13
Well, Tom is no slouch as a player, as well as being a master mouthpiece guy and clarinet acoustician. He holds advanced performance degrees from Yale, and studied with Kalmen Opperman. I had discussions with him about the C, and he sets them up, does any adjustments needed, and ships them out. The C was beautiful out of the box. Absolutely marvelous. I told him that the only thing I hate about the C is when the gig is over, and I have to pack it in. The Libertas was equally superb out of the box, fully play tested by Tom, who listened to my wishes and desires, and found the best choice. Now - I did send my Libertas back, to be fitted with a traditional register key. For some reason I'm very comfortable with his ergonomic register key on the C, but I couldn't adapt to the Libertas. But - no problem, he fitted it with the old fashioned key, and here I am. The new A clarinet was a month and a half journey, as he had to build them when I ordered. I said I wanted a thoroughbred warhorse that sings! He promised me a "Bad-Ass" clarinet, and he sure delivered! Right out of the case. He knows - he designed, built, tested, blew and delivered! Also of interest, I love the Ridenour register key on the A! Weird, eh?
Hope this answers your question!
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: DougR
Date: 2016-04-14 07:11
Thanks, Ken. Exactly what I wanted to know. And again, best of luck with them all.
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Author: sax panther
Date: 2016-04-14 11:59
does anyone know what the difference is between the Arioso and the other models (576 and Libertas)? I already own an R13 and an Opus, but do my fair share of outdoor cold/indoor crowded and sweaty gigs so have always been intrigued by getting a decent hard rubber instrument.
I'm asking because there is one in the UK on the auction site, and the seller states in the listing, "it's the Arioso ASB-101T with ergonomic register key, making it identical to the lyrique". Didn't know that was the only difference? Stan In Orlando, I notice you've got one - do you know?
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-04-14 17:45
Attachment: AriosoRCP2010.png (302k)
Hi Panther- I looked at the Ridenours' listings for the Arioso for a while before I ended up ordering one from them- after they had removed the references from their web site. But I had copied a page, and I still have it! This is one of their last "official" statements that Arioso = 576BC, though I also have emails to that effect from my purchase.
I occasionally wonder if a current 576BC would feel or play any differently, but I really doubt it.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: sax panther
Date: 2016-04-14 19:18
Excellent - thank you Stan! As one of the people who got stung by the ebay seller described in another recent thread "beware this ebay seller" (or something similar), I'm a little more careful when buying online. Maybe I'll stick in a bid and see what the fuss is about - they seem to receive glowing reviews on this board.
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-04-14 19:36
Mine has the standard register key as described in my screen capture, the one you see apparently has the ergonomic key. I have seen Ariosos on eBxx periodically, at prices from $200 to $700 or so, before and after I bought mine from the source. Some tempted me, but in addition to not knowing what repairs might be needed (true for anything used), I was never completely sure which were actually the same as the 576BC. Even the wording on that screen capture kind of implies that earlier Ariosos might not be the same (even with the same model number?). I have also read that other sellers may have licitly or illicitly manufactured Ariosos (identical design? or not?) that would not have gotten Tom's personal attention. One of Tom's issues through the years was keeping control over the manufacturing, licensing, patents, and all that non-musical stuff- often very frustrating for him I'm sure. Glad he eventually got that all sorted out, but earlier designs (such as the TR147 variants) are not always kosher. Perhaps the Arioso is in between, some OK some not.
Anybody else with more info on these issues, please share!
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-04-16 19:30
Well, several days in on the new A clarinet. Yes, the scale is very even, bottom to top. No change in timbre from the low E up, as opposed to most other high-end horns without the extra "low F correction key." An absolute wonderful instrument.
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2016-04-16 22:20
JoshJNYC recently put up a YouTube video showing how his Bb Libertas is doing after two years. Nice, dark focused sound on a Vandoren 40D mouthpiece and a Vandoren Klassic String Ligature. "Ridenour Libertas 2 Years Later."
Ridenour clarinets are obviously quality professional instruments worthy of serious consideration. (I own one myself and enjoy playing it--even prefer it to my last Buffet R13). And the Vandoren 40D mouthpiece seems to be supporting Josh's tonal concept very well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXstW4Gp8uE.
Post Edited (2016-04-17 07:37)
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Author: TomS
Date: 2016-04-17 18:52
Had mine for over two years and still my primary B-flat. Had one pad replaced (top trill key) and Tom slightly reworked the C/G-sharp tone hole for me. Some plating wear (no more than my Buffets). I modified the RH sliver key to suit my wonky hand.
No complaints. I'd buy another in a heartbeat. A fantastic value. I am still planning on a few others purchased from RCP.
Tom
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-04-17 22:34
Would my assessment, at least in the soprano clarinet realm be that, all other aspects of the setup equal, that in large size testing, we might find a Ridenour Clarinet to offer more resistance than, say, an R13?
It's important for me to say that I am not associating quality with resistance. In fact I've heard Tom (Ridenour) describe this as how his instruments hold color, shape and pitch of sound so well, i.e. as an attribute feature.
Thoughts?
(Personally, I find the instruments very "rubbery"......
that is in a hard rubber, won't crack, dimensionally stable, outdoor approved instrument that at least equals wood, if not outright surpasses it from a materials standpoint in terms of reliability and sound production. ![[wink]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie3.gif)
Post Edited (2016-04-17 22:37)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-04-17 23:04
When I first got my Arioso (= 576BC), I had for some time been playing a Leblanc Dynamic 2 from circa 1958, a "big bore" clarinet. And I was quite surprised how all aspects of the playing experience were identical to me, between the 2 instruments. Which perhaps says I am or was the non-princess unable to feel a pea under the mattress- but I'd be curious how others have found such comparisons. I was very happy to find I'd lost nothing in the transition.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2016-04-17 23:25
Not sure about how much the rubber has to do with the characteristic tonal features and reisistance of the Ridenour clarinets. (Is his wood G1 clarinet just as resistant?) It has a lot to do with the pitch stability, though. I think small scale clarinet production is undergoing a shift in design to offer a greater range of choice. At the high end you see this in the Backuns, but you also see it lower down the price scale not only in Ridenour's very affordable rubber instruments but also in Gao's many new design choices in wood, including three variation on the "German" ideal, and many new twists to the French/American concept, and the new Uebel Boehm clarinets in wood, each speaking in its own distinctive voice. All these makers (Backun, Ridenour, Gao, Uebel) are not afraid to stray from the Buffet, Selmer, Yamaha templets and come up with something else that just might be considered an "improvement," and become a force to be reckoned with. The difference goes far beyond any one variable such as resistance and concerns the entire make-up and "personality" of the clarinet. I have no crystal ball, but it is just possible that the viable future of the clarinet, at least in North America, may rest in the hands of small and innovative makers like these (and others that will appear).
Post Edited (2016-04-18 00:11)
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-04-18 01:59
Seabreeze, I'm pretty sure that the fact that Ridenour makes his instruments in hard rubber affects neither their resistance nor acoustics.
I'd like to think that said characteristics are more a function of the instrument's design, from bore and tone hole sizes to placement, to keys, etc.
"It has a lot to do with the pitch stability,"
In the sense that hard rubber can be machined to greater tolerances than wood, and is dimensionally stable, I completely agree.
"Is his wood G1 clarinet just as resistant?" Great question..don't know.
"I think small scale clarinet production is undergoing a shift in design to offer a greater range of choice."
I think design software and CNC lathes/routers of higher quality and lower cost have helped the boutique clarinet makers (e.g.Backun, Ridenour) towards the greater varieties you sight, by decreasing the cost of producing new models/variations.
I truly hope we as a group don't get into the "materials war." While the thing a clarinet's made of does matter in the sense that the porosity and decomposition of "Swiss Cheese," for example, makes it a poor candidate for making a clarinet out of, I've heard metal clarinets sound like what the layperson would refer to colloquially as desirably "woody," and wood ones that nobody plays well.
I'm of the school that says craftsmanship and player, more than, within the above reason, materials, make the instrument's sound.
This is not to cast shade on really high end wood instruments from Backun, Buffet, Selmer, Rossi, etc.----made from trees. This is to say one could fabricate a strong contender made of plastic....indeed one has, ostensibly, in Backun's Alpha.
The question as to what came first, the "chicken or the egg" in some of these market ideas is undergoing change, if for no other reason, the dwindling stock of good African Blackwood. For example, people once considered plastic clarinets "cheap," set price ceilings as to what they would pay for them, and as a result, manufacturers didn't put much effort into their design fearing they wouldn't get their money back on such efforts in the instrument's purchase price.
Which begs the question, "okay, show me a decent plastic instrument other than Backun's." To which I say, read the above paragraph.
It turns out that plastic may not only be an excellent material to make instruments out of but that wood was never "good," rather, in its day of original clarinet design, most profitable pre-plastic.
I know this must read like a joke, but my guess as to why Buffet puts these wood shavings in its Greenline is because they can command more $ for the Greenline instruments designed this way than the cost of alternative fuel sources to heat their factory with--which was the original use of these wood shavings--no joke.
I would genuinely be interested in arguments that to have mixed other (if not any) woods with their epoxy would have resulted in less of a Greenline clarinet in play, if not market perception.
And if I'm right, sadly, the market is of the impression that these wood shavings in this epoxy give the Greenlines their magic. I suspect this not the case.
Stated alternatively, to NOT have put some African Blackwood in the Greenlines might have begged the question as to the worth of their conventional African Blackwood product line, and how an R13 costs more in real dollars than in 1960, when the wood was (Buffet's admission) better.
==========
Anyway, has anyone played a G1 and a Ridenour Hard Rubber, or a G1 and a, say, Buffet, and care to comment?
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Author: LaurieBell
Date: 2016-04-18 15:07
A while back I posted a similar thread when I was looking for a reasonably priced clarinet I could play outside (that still had a good tone.) With the overwhelming good reviews I purchased a Bb Ridenour.
I was very pleased with the sound and responsiveness with the instrument right out of the box, as it didn't seem to require any break-in period.
But then I took it out for a spin for an outdoor concert. It was a fairly cold day, so I kept the clarinet tucked inside my coat during numbers. It played ok for about the first piece, and then it began to shut down, stopping up and becoming increasingly difficult to play. I changed reeds in the middle of the concert, thinking that might help, but it didn't. Later my stand mate suggested I switch mouthpieces.
My bad experience might have been a one-time fluke, or remedied by changing my mouthpiece or trying different set ups. But I just wasn't willing to put in any effort to find a solution, nor was I willing to risk another performance malfunction.
Reading this thread now, it appears many others have had great success with the Ridenour, so again, mine might have been an isolated experience.
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2016-04-18 16:21
Laurie -
Have you contacted Tom & Ted, and shared your rather scary incident? You should! There may be a problem with your particular clarinet that the Ridenours can easily address and fix! They do care about their customers, and truly want your experiences to be wonderful ones! Give them a buzz!
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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