 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Tracy
Date: 1999-04-19 05:04
Greetings, all...
I've been watching this newsgroup for a little while and figured it was time to come out and introduce myself.
I used to play clarinet in grade and high school years ago (now I'm approaching 40). I put that instrument as "away" as I've ever put anything in my life. But recently I discovered the jazz clarinetists of the '20s (and I'm most impressed with Johnny Dodds) and decided to try again. My primary interest is in ragtime, and most ragtime orchestrations call for A and C clarinet parts.
So... I bought myself a period V. Kohlert "enhanced" Albert system A clarinet (three rings on upper joint, four sharps, just like the Boehm system) which I'm starting to noodle with. The mouthpiece is a Selmer HS*. The instrument belonged to a fellow who had it repadded and corked, then didn't play it for years. Needless to say, I have no embouchure anymore, so I'm just working on trying to play all the notes. Guess I have a couple of questions, if anyone would care to help...
Is the mouthpiece appropriate for a beginner? (I'm using some No. 2 reeds sent with the clarinet)
Am I indeed considered a beginner? I've lost my embouchure, but in about a week of playing I have figured out the Albert system AND remembered how to read clarinet music (I also play piano).
I also noticed that this clarinet in particular seems to require much larger hands than my old Bundy. Is this so?
I'm having a great deal of trouble playing the lower notes in the clarion register. Is this most likely an embouchure problem or a mechanical one? I can hit them if I start from E and slur down.
The instrument is in the shop right now to fix some sluggish keys, so I can't tell you the serial number, but I suspect that it is a pre-WWI model. Does anyone know how the quality of that brand compares to the quality of other brands contemporary with it?
Are there any problems inherant with antique clarinets which I should be aware of?
And a side question... I have numerous books on jazz, even one about Johnny Dodds, yet none of them mention what set-up he was playing. Does anyone know? He did play two clarinets, from the pictures. A Bb and an A? Or a C?
I'm sure I'm going to have many, many more questions as I re-learn how to play. I'm fortunate in that I seem to be getting back a lot of skill in a very short time. It has such a beautiful tone... I'm really thrilled to have it.
Thanks to anyone who cares to reply..
Regards,
Tracy
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Author: George
Date: 1999-04-19 12:58
Can't help on most things, but your problem with getting the lower notes on the upper register to speak sounds like a pad leak. However, if it's in the shop now, maybe it will have been fixed when you get it back. If not, look at the lower pads carefully - even a bit of leak here would produce the symptoms you describe.
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Author: Rick2
Date: 1999-04-19 14:59
The HS* is a relatively closed mouthpiece, but I started on the same thing. It should do you well until you begin consistently going above the staff. At that stage, you need one of two things, a stiffer reed or a more open mouthpiece. I personally went in the direction of the more open mouthpiece (with Rico Royal 2-1/2 reeds) but I'm finding I am at the limit of that setup now as I try to play altissimo G and I'm starting to train my emboucher for #3 now.
I don't think you are a beginner, it will come back to you quickly.
The A clarinet is slightly bigger than the Bb clarinet, so what you feel is bigger in the fingering may really be that way.
Your low note problems may be mechanical or they may be breath support (not likely emboucher as I can play any chalumeau note with a very sloppy emboucher). More likely, its a combination of both. Try again when you get it back from the shop.
Have fun and welcome back!
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Author: Bill
Date: 1999-04-19 18:07
Tracy,
Someone else is 40 too! Thank God! Here's my input, for what's it worth (opinions, and humble opinions at that, follow):
The HS* is pretty closed for jazz. As a matter of fact, it is really not an appropriate mouthpiece for the kind of playing you want to do, BUT, yes, anybody can make anything work if you try hard enough (had to say that--spent too much time on the Klarinet mailing list not to!). Invest in something more open (examples are Vandoren B45 and Selmer HS**). At the minimum, don't play #2 reeds on that HS*!!! The big concern is fitting a mouthpiece to whatever bore dimensions that instrument has. To me, that's the hard part. Most mouthpieces today are made for a narrow bore and may not play well on yor horn.
The Albert requires more stretch in the right hand than a Boehm.
The sluggish E is a pad leak.
ENJOY!!! --Bill.
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Author: Dee
Date: 1999-04-20 01:05
Albert system clarinets require more hand spread than Boehm system clarinets rather than being a function of brand or whether it is an A or Bb (there is a slight difference in spread between these two but not as noticeable as Albert vs Boehm). If you compare the fingering, it quickly becomes obvious that this will be so. For example, all fingers down on the left hand plus 1st finger on the right hand is a B natural on the Albert but a Bb on the Boehm. Looking at the keys, you can see that on an Albert, the first hole is open and the second hole is covered by a pad (which closes when you close the third hole). On the Boehm,the 1st hole is closed by a pad while the second is closed by your finger. So on the Albert you have to reach up to that first hole thus resulting in more spread.
By the way the Rubank Elementary method book (not the intermediate or advanced) comes with a fingering chart with Albert on one side and Boehm on the other.
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Author: Dee
Date: 1999-04-20 01:13
Well in using the old Albert system you might consider that since these are no longer made, maitenance might eventually get to be a problem. If one of the keys breaks or the threads in the rods strip, it could be a tad difficult to repair. Springs and pads though should be easy. They haven't changed much. There's just more of them in more sizes now. I have some old Alberts that I plan to restore to playing condition but my intent is to only play them on infrequent occasions not as my regular instruments.
Also if you learned on a standard Bundy (i.e. Boehm system), you might want to pick up a new or used large bore Boehm system clarinet instead. The Selmers were used a lot in the 30s and 40s for jazz. Leblanc currently has a Pete Fontaine model that is large bore and aimed at the jazz musician market.
Anyway, no matter what route you go, HAVE FUN.
By the way, I stopped playing in 1969 when I graduated from high school and didn't start again until 1989. It comes back.
A few months of lessons with an experienced teacher would help you get it back more quickly plus you would learn to differentiate instrument problems from player problems and they could prevent bad habits from forming and correct any that already exist.
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Author: Tracy
Date: 1999-04-20 05:33
Greetings, all!
Thanks for all the very nice, encouraging and helpful answers. My clarinet is still in the pound, but I hope it will come home tomorrow. I bought some Vandoren reeds - 2.5 and 3, to try out. Dee will be happy to know that I just won an old Rubank book on eBay, and the charts are included (I asked before I bid).
I'm fortunate that in my little town of Grass Valley, California, we have a very nice old fella from NY who repairs all the band instruments. He seems to be very interested in my clarinet, so I'm hopeful that he will keep it in ship shape for me.
He also mentioned the bore fitting problem with newer moutpieces. He has some professional models which he will try to fit to the clarinet when I'm ready to move forward. For now, I just want to be able to make the notes speak. Yikes!
I can't wait to get it back and start blowing on it again - hooo ... hooo... makes the s.o. nuts, but hey.. I like the fact that I can write or transpose music on the computer and play it right from where I'm sitting. That is, if I can play it at all. But I'm working on it!
Thanks for all your help... I'm very much looking forward to participating in this forum in the future. Oh, boy, I can see lots of questions in the future!
And if anyone can come up with info about Dodds and his clarinet, it would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks again!
Regards,
Tracy
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Author: ron
Date: 1999-04-25 22:16
Hi, Tracy -
Interesting post. I live in Sacto, play Albert system too. Also stopped playing for many years then took it up again. Once you've played for a while you have experience behind you - your chops may get out of shape but you'll never revert to beginner status again.
I have several old horns I'm in the process of 'restoring' and my guess is, from the way you describe it, that your Kohlert is an Oehler system. If I can be of any help to you don't hesitate to get in touch sometime, either here or by e-mail. Here is preferable though, so others can benefit by any general (Albert horns) info exchange. I don't know much but I'm willing to share what I may.
Regards,
Ron in Sacto, CA
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Author: ron
Date: 1999-05-09 21:16
Tracy -
I got your message but it didn't include your e-mail address and I don't know how to get it from this BB. A pop up window tells me to put my address into Mail and Groups Preferences. Ignorant me, I don't know how to do that (sigh). I'm pretty sure your key 'construction' problem(s), the way you describe them, are a minor annoyance fairly easy to fix. Write me directly, or here and I'll be happy to respond.
Ron in Sacto
>>>rbaxter@pdqnet.com<<<
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