 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: jan
Date: 2001-05-16 13:50
Im doing this etude for my lesson. its a slow piece (#8 in the perier book if anyone here uses that book). It should sound beautiful but I hate it just for the fact I dont have a beautiful sound. I have a good sound, even a nice sound. but its NOT beautiful.
I dont know why I cant get the kind of sound I hear in my mind...a pure, even, mellow sound. to me i sound rhaspy..grainy.. I have been playing a long time. over 10 years before i stopped and now over 3 ive been really serious about it.
I have a brand new clarinet (selmer signature) less than 6 months old. have been trying all kinds of mouthpieces (including some gregory smiths i got last week) I have good reeds Vandoren V12 . So i guess the problem is me. i have tried all kinds of embouchure adjustments and i just dont know what im doing wrong. im getting very frustrated!! anyone have any ideas?
jan
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Author: bob gardner
Date: 2001-05-16 14:14
It sounds like you need a one on one. What does your teacher have to say? How do you sound to others?
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Author: jan
Date: 2001-05-16 14:20
Im going to ask him tonight but im so bothered and keep thinking about it thought i would see what ppl here have to say.my teacher has never mentioned that i sound as bad as I think I do. im not sure what others think....
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Author: William
Date: 2001-05-16 14:26
One question--what reed strength are you using? Greg recommends 3.5 for his mps, but for you, that may not be right. Have you tried slightly softer or stronger reeds to see what effect that might have on the quality of your sound. Also, try VD regulars (blue box) and see if that helps. It is difficult to diagnose embouchure problems via cybertalk but perhaps you are not taking enough mp into our mouth. Try a bit more--until you squeak, and then pull out a little. Breath deep and play from "the bottom of your lungs." Again, these are just guesses, what you probably need is some personal help from a qualified clarinet teacher. In any case, it sounds like you have good equipment and a good internal concept of the type of sound you want, so don't give up. Maybe someone else will have the right answer, these are just thoughts of mine, hope they help--Good Clarineting!!!!!!!
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Author: Fred
Date: 2001-05-16 14:40
Jan, the other question is - do you really know what you sound like? If you are trying to compare your sound that you hear while playing with a recording of a player you admire, you will never get there or be satisfied. In terms of tone, you cannot determine what other people hear by listening to yourself play unless you get a good recording of yourself.
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Author: graham
Date: 2001-05-16 15:53
Try a wider range of reeds. Vandorens can get harsh when pushed. Try Glotin, Zonda, Superial Classique, and see if they suit you better.
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-05-16 20:56
Jan -
I hated my sound for years. It's only in the last year or two that I've started to be able to please myself. When you make music, there are no words to hide behind. You reveal who you are and how you feel directly. Nevertheless, I've found that some physical things make a difference. Please recognize that this is a work in progress (even though I've been playing for many years). It's a synthesis of things I've learned from many great players and teachers.
Breath is the basis of playing -- much more so than finger dexterity, embouchure, tongue position or whatever. You start by sitting or standing up straight and "sucking your stomach in" and expanding your chest as if you were a guy trying to impress a girl at the beach. Then you drop everything down and out with a bump, and simultaneously inhale, beginning at the bottom of your belly, expanding your abdomen and the ribs in your lower back. As you fill up, your chest will rise naturally. (I learned this exercise from the great teacher Keith Stein.)
You'll probably get dizzy or cough. That means you're straining to get the last bit of air in. Practice stopping just before that point. As you learn to do it, you won't need to "suck in" or get tense first. That's only to let you feel the difference between tension and relaxation. Ideally, you want to just breath.
Once you are full of air, you simply let it out. Never push up from the bottom, but always push down. (This comes from William Kincaid.) When you do this, your tone will be more resonant and you'll find that intervals that tended to have blips in them (like altissimo D to clarion C) will connect smoothly. You're looking for the feeling of a direct connection between the airstream, beginning in the bottom of your abdomen and connecting with the reed.
Next, you need to take more mouthpiece -- what Leon Russianoff called a "chonk." That is, you push up with your thumb until the reed vibrates freely. (You should have only about half of the red part of your lower lip over your lower teeth, and your teeth should be right under the point that the lay of the mouthpiece starts to curve away from the reed.)
Next, arch your soft palate (at the back of your mouth, where your uvula is) as if you were yawning, and raise the back of your tongue into that open area. Your tongue should be in a ski-jump shape. Experiment until you hear plenty of high overtones. Don't worry right now about being "bright" -- you want the resonance. It helps to whistle and think about your tongue position, although the middle of your tongue has to be lower when you play than when you whistle.
Be sure you're not closing off your vocal cords in a silent "grunt." Keep your throat relaxed and open. Remember the direct connection between your breath and the reed.
Even if you don't play double lip, you should experiment with it. Use a slightly softer reed, let the mouthpiece "rest in a bed of roses" (in Ralph McLane's phrase) and let the reed loose to vibrate. Yes, you'll squeak. You need to learn to let things go without squeaking, but you can't play freely without that possibility.
You'll sound dreadful - a bright shriek.
What you do then is start to round things off. Back off on the volume and round your lips and your sound idea to have an "ooo" (as in "moon") in it, while keeping the resonance. (This comes from Kalmen Opperman.)
Once the reed is vibrating freely, you will find you can make many good tones - warm, sweet, excited, angry, loving, show-offy, sleepy - it's limited only by your own personality. The clarinet can do only so much for you. The rest comes from who you are. This is where you really come in as a person. You need to open your heart and feel the sound as part of you, coming from your guts.
It helps to listen to the great musicians, and not just clarinetists. Get any record by the great tenor John McCormack. Play just the first phrase of any track and then play it on clarinet, going back and forth with the record to learn to get the feeling into it that he does. Of course you can't actually sing the words, but you need to get as close as possible. Do the same with the Pablo Casals recording of the Bach Suites for solo cello. These have no words, so you don't have that excuse. Nevertheless, you'll find it hard to get the same intensity and personal expression that Casals does. Other musicians whom I listen to for this immediate and learnable impact are Billie Holiday, Mabel Mercer, Fritz Kreisler and Dinu Lipatti.
You never stop learning. If you're stuck with a sound you don't like, you have to burst out of the boundaries you've gotten used to. For a little while, you have to be a beginner again, making new, bad sounds that you then bring under control. Be prepared to squeak and sound awful. Then find out what you can do with it.
It isn't easy. It's about getting to know yourself better, including what you don't like very much.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Corey
Date: 2001-05-17 00:12
I(being 14) always thought all proffessional clarinets would have the smooth,velvety, round tone that i have heard from clarinets------i play an Buffet E11 with a hite premeire mouthpiece and i get a bueatiful sound that is warm and mellow .----------------------------------------------->Corey
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-05-17 00:16
Corey,
There's such a variety of sounds that can come out of a clarinet - klezmer, jazz (all sorts of varieties), chamber music, orchestral, vocal accompaniment (obbligato). Some are far from "smooth and velvety" ... even in orchestral music. Think of the Nielsen ...
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Author: William
Date: 2001-05-17 03:55
Another thought: IMHO, we clarinetists are too much concerned with the quality of our sound while our audiences are only concerned with, 1) were all the notes played the right ones in the right places, 2) were they played in tune, and, 3) were they played pleasingly to the ear (with proper musical expressivenenss and in balance with the other players). All clarinetists have different qualities of sounds, but what sets the great ones apart form the rest (given the fact that we can all play all of the correct notes with perfect rhythmic timing), is how well they play with regards to musical expression and intonation. The specific quality of their sound is the least important qualifier for "greatness" in my book. So, start with the "sound" that you have, tune it, time it, and concentrate on playing with beautifully expressive musical phrases. Even if your clarinet sounds like a duck, you will be diva of the flock. Good clarineting!!!!!
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Author: AlanT
Date: 2001-05-17 10:38
William, I agree with you. Here's something else to think about. The "ideal clarinet sound" that we have in our mind comes from listening to others play the clarinet. Our perception of our own sound comes from listening to ourselves while we are playing. Even if we could get our perceived sound to match the ideal sound they really would not sound the same to an external listener.
But, everyone's search for their ideal sound does keep alot of MP, lig and reed comapnies in business.
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