 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: cjb206
Date: 2015-12-25 00:48
Hi all,
I have a student who, some how, creepingly over time, without either of our notice, has developed pretty bad basic blowing/embouchure technique.
I'm sure we all know the sort of thing - lots of upper body tension, shoulders raised, bit of a clenched biting embouchure, pinched with too little reed vibrating, and struggling to play fluidly and without convincing support over the registers (especially in fast semiquaver passages).
Sadly I think it is her counterintuitive response to managing the challenges of her instrument as her intellect/talent is permitting her to race through the repertoire (running before she can walk - my fault perhaps).
Her set up is ordinary enough - M13 with VD V12 - #3's (sometimes softer I believe). So I hoped I could solicit some tips/strategies for helping her to un-learn the counterproductive habits.
I personally had to go through this the hard way without any support from a teacher, and have taught myself a double lip embouchure that I am satisfied with. She quite clearly understands what the issue is after I demonstrated exactly what she's doing (she was somewhat shocked that I could imitate her sound so convincingly), but i fear that is no help in reconstructing the method for her practically.
all thoughts welcome
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2015-12-25 01:50
The important thing is whether or not she wants to make the needed changes. If she can hear the difference and understands what's involved, I don't think a special procedure or teaching technique is needed. She probably needs to change in three areas: get the right amount of reed in her mouth; use enough air to produce a full, steady sound; a little basic embouchure reshaping from whatever she's doing to a round shape that distributes embouchure pressure around the mouthpiece instead of upward under the reed.
She needs to practice at least some of her material slowly so that she isn't frantically trying to get notes and articulations out at the expense of paying attention to basic sound. I know someone will recommend long tones, and they aren't in themselves bad. But she needs to be able to apply the basics above when her fingers are moving and, when that's somewhat settled, when her tongue is articulating.
Having her experiment with double lip wouldn't hurt, either, especially since you've adopted it and can make suggestions from experience. But double lip isn't necessary and she can't convert all at once, anyway. Slow and moderate music and rudimentary exercise (scales, arpeggios, some of the other finger studies in the method books) with persistent attention to embouchure, air and reed in the mouth should help so long as she knows what the goal is and accepts its importance.
Karl
Post Edited (2015-12-25 02:34)
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2015-12-25 03:48
Good advice from above. Add a mirror so the students can see whats going on. I think every student should have a mirror to look at when practicing, not just for the embouchure but also for finger positions, angle of the horn, all of that. Some players get sloppy and start playing with flatter fingers, mainly the right hand.
Although I did teach, but didn't like it, it's so important to get the students playing correctly, so you are doing a good job nailing this problem early. Slow long notes while looking in the mirror should fix the problem and stop future problems. Maybe have a mirror in your teaching room.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2015-12-25 09:19
Instead of a mirror, if you have the capability, video record it. I know I personally feel weird staring at myself in a mirror playing and it might not be a true representation.
Maybe a GoPro or laptop camera or something.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-12-25 15:27
Yes, the mirror!
Students seem to hate that...........I use it all the time !!!
That in conjunction with L-O-N-G tones should get her to slow down, listen and retrain properly. I would think she hears the difference and wants to play well. It is probably either that she also realizes that changing will be really hard work, or she has NO idea HOW to change.
Slow it down
................Paul Aviles
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Author: tylerleecutts
Date: 2015-12-25 23:37
I would at least put a student with a M13 on 3.5 reeds or harder. That mouthpiece has next to no resistance and needs resistance in the reed to compensate, at least moderately. This may be contributing to the lack of effort presented in embourchre and blowing, but nevertheless reed strength is very individual between the player and mouthpiece.
I second the advice on mirror practice. Slow David Weber exercises are very valuable on tone and growing the fundamentals.
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Author: cjb206
Date: 2015-12-26 13:17
I'm reluctant to simply move her on to a stronger reed, particularly since a great deal of what she exhibits would (in my experience) most likely be exacerbated by increasing reed strength. I don't think it has anything to do with lack of effort or desire to improve as has discussed in a couple of posts.
She's only 12yrs old, and is a talented and dedicated player advancing onto UK grade 7-8 repertoire. Indeed, what I observe on reflection is what I consider to be the counterintuitive human response to the challenges of the instrument. Exploring the altissimo for example often initially reaches a barrier with e and f, where voicing isn't quite right thus producing a grunt. Younger students, often perceiving themselves to be 'trying harder' (viewed positively), tense up their upper body disrupting their diaphragm support, and pinch/bite on the reed with their jaw. This can be successful in producing a tone (though not the desired one), and thus this becomes unconsciously processed into the technique despite the explicit teacher input to the contrary, as a counter-intuitive response to voicing issues. I think a lot of this develops also during the independent practice. Throwing a harder reed into the mix at this point, would probably result in more of the same. However, I do accept that ideally with this mouthpiece a harder reed would improve aspects of her tone and response of the mouthpiece once that embouchure is secure.
I agonise a little that some of what has been suggested as responses aren't really engaging enough to promote independent learning; nor do they constitute a pedagogical approach to solving the issue. I'm really asking about how I would structure a series of lessons over 8-10weeks with objectives and success criteria, and something to hook her in through investigation. What are the small steps for progression?
For example, I have recently purchased a chalumeau (made by Nuvo;soprano in C I think), which I have found a really interesting for variety of reasons, but also since the blowing is slightly different. Much like which switching between bass and Eflat or exploring saxophone or double reeds, playing around on this chalumeau really brought issues of voicing, pressure, lips, etc to the fore because they differ slightly (a lot). I thought about using this as a starter lesson into helping her re-think the important aspects of blowing through investigation and experimentation. From there we could investigate how she voices notes e.g.
Can you voice a high E with middle C fingering?
How successful can you be playing with 'no' embouchure?
Could you play with the mouth piece switched round upside down? Can you double lip?
How much reed can you keep in before you lose control?
Through exploring these issues in a fun way with exercises each week, I thought she could then go on to generate success criteria for embouchure and blowing freely, easily and efficiently to then apply to her serious playing.
It might sound a bit involved, but good planning seems to make all the difference.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2015-12-26 19:44
cjb206 wrote:
> I agonise a little that some of what has been suggested as
> responses aren't really engaging enough to promote independent
> learning; nor do they constitute a pedagogical approach to
> solving the issue. I'm really asking about how I would
> structure a series of lessons over 8-10weeks with objectives
> and success criteria, and something to hook her in through
> investigation. What are the small steps for progression?
Apology in advance for a very long post (it will have taken me much longer to write it than for anyone to read it):
jb206 (sorry, we don't have even your real first name to use), your concern seems extremely well-intended and you sound well-trained pedagogically. But I think, based on almost 40 years of experience as well as academic training similar to what you seem to have had, that you're leaving out the most important feature of this situation: the child is only 12 years old.
She may not be developmentally at the stage where *she* is able to reflect and act on a series of discrete steps and goals, nor is she, it may be, capable of the kind of focused and detailed self-monitoring that you're hoping for in an "independent learning" - i.e. unsupervised practice - environment. You can break things down into what you perceive are simple, separate and sequential steps but it may well be (especially if she has already run into a wall or plateau) that when she goes home, she will simply go back to practicing what she understands and feels control over - the notes and rhythms.
At 12, she may intellectually understand what good sound is and why hers falls short, but conscientious as she may be, not really sensitive on her own to what she really sounds like, if that makes any sense. She can hear objectively (if she's talented) when she plays a note that is contextually wrong (and out-of key note, like a key signature error) or that is different from what she already knows is correct from prior practice, and, again, if she's talented, she can self-monitor rhythm within her experience and major expressive changes (dynamics, accents, articulations, tempo) in basic but probably not very nuanced ways.
My experience, though, is that if she's typical of most kids whom I've taught over the years, sound, quality of response and intonation, to name three areas of playing, simply elude their notice when I'm not with them to point out the problems. This is often exacerbated by the growing need of talented, successful students to deal with more and more music from their school programs and perhaps their outside community ensembles if they're involved in those. Learning to play the parts becomes their primary focus, even if it isn't their teacher's. Yet, I have to say, I have never (to my recollection) ever had a student of mine reach high school age (15 or 16) without major, seemingly almost spontaneous (but really quite gradual over time) improvement in all those tone production areas that you're trying so conscientiously to help your student improve over the next 8-10 weeks.
My approach, as I described in my first post, was, I think, engaging your *problem* more than you perhaps think. With all respect for your intent, you want to approach the situation as an adult with an adult sense of analytical organization and goal-directed focus, albeit wrapped in a light, sequenced and, perhaps, slightly covert pedagogical approach. But, IMO, a 12 year old just wants to play, and while she may work along your process while with you, she will in all likelihood go her own way when unsupervised despite your efforts.
Am I suggesting that you ignore the problems of pinching and lack of support? Absolutely not. But I think (again only an opinion, but one based on several decades of success with school-age students) that you need to (a) forget about a time line (kids work at their own speed) and (b) focus persistently when you're working with her on the basics I outlined earlier, applying the changes consistently to the music she is working on. The big difference between what needs to be done and what you're probably already doing, is that she needs to slow down for significantly more of her work and listen to the result while following your suggestions as to what to feel, what to change, and what the hoped-for result will be. She may dutifully do everything you ask at lessons, then go home and race through her band music and lesson assignment and feel accomplished when she has everything (notes and rhythms) "right." But gradually, as you simply don't let her play with her shoulders up and her jaw pinched shut and no air in her lungs, she will begin slowly, gradually to adjust on her own and the changes will become internalized and habitual (which is what is needed). The lesson approach can be as positive and even "fun" as you can think of ways to make it. The better you are at that, the more your student(s) will enjoy not just their lessons, but playing in general. Their progress toward reaching their musical and technical potential won't come in a ten-week program, but in persistent and incremental change internalized over time.
I think your student is very lucky to have you as her teacher.
Karl
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Author: JonTheReeds
Date: 2015-12-26 23:46
Give her permission to play as slowly as she needs to play, so that her playing is relaxed and fluid. If the relaxed (but supported) technique is not ingrained then imposing a tempo will just tense her playing. Give her space and time, the rest will follow. A slow start often ends with a quick finish
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The older I get, the better I was
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