 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: BGBG
Date: 2015-10-09 02:01
Very old reeds, have newer, but trying to learn reed adjustment. Two wont play, look like warped toward mouthpiece and seal shut. No sound. Perhaps end clipped too much-not sure. What if anything should I try in order to get reed to open up ? Not crucial, simply trying to learn. If not work, no big deal. I do not have knowledge or equipment to remake the reed- only sandpaper and clippers.
Post Edited (2015-10-10 04:01)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2015-10-09 02:53
The reeds have warped along the bottom and must be sanded flat. Put a sheet of 400 grit (black) sandpaper on a flat plate (such as plate glass), press only on the bark and work until the bottom is flat and shiny all over. A useful shortcut is to take an Exacto knife (or even a pocket knife) and shave off a fairly thick slice about 1/8" long at the end of the butt.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-10-09 22:23
First I want to say upfront that I personally do NO work on old reeds. After the month or so life expectancy, I move on to new reeds.
When making reeds, a friend of mine would take them almost finished (that is, reeds with more material left on the vamp to be taken off later), get them all wet with saliva, slap them on glass, let them dry and warp, and then sand them flat. That process would continue over days until there was no warping. Only then was the reed treated to final shaving.
I would humbly submit an analogy when discussing USED reeds. Look at the prow of a wooden ship (or any bent strip of wood for that matter). You get it that way by getting it wet, bending it to shape (more likely in phases), clamping it down and letting it dry so that it permanently takes on that shape.
What we do when we play reeds is essentially the above described process. It would make more sense to me to try and wet the old reed, place it flat side down on glass and place something heavy upon it until it dries flat (also may take several attempts). Sanding a reed that already has the dimensions you wanted will only take the dimensions that did work (in the past) away.
Or you could just buy a new box of reeds.
..............Paul Aviles
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Author: nellsonic
Date: 2015-10-09 22:45
It seems the OP's point is that he's just experimenting on old reeds to learn. Nothing wrong with that, except that an old reed will never play like a newer one, and the only point to all this fuss is how a reed plays when the work is done.
Most of the learning from working on reeds that are past their natural life is only theoretical, even if it's hands on. It seems a much better use of time to concentrate on new reeds once one has even the most basic understanding of how the tools work. It's not that complicated, but the actual development of skill does come only through practice on reeds one intends to play.
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Author: knotty
Date: 2015-10-10 02:16
BG just curious, do you have new reeds that are broken in and play well?
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Author: BGBG
Date: 2015-10-10 04:16
I was going to say that I do have plenty of reeds that are in fact new with only 4-5 short sessions on them and they are still breaking in and do play well. I am not trying to make a new reed out of an old one, and since I play just for myself and not professionally I do not have to be perfect or in a hurry. I try to play every day for a few 15-20 minute sessions. I realize this is also a disadvantage for I am not forced to be great in a hurry and I do not have the advantage of personal contact with many good players. It seemed I do not know enough about reed modifications as others seem to nor feel I can evaluate them accurately. I am simply trying to build skill at evaluating and adjusting them to play better. And believe me, details like this help a lot so I know exactly what to do. I watch videos that may say to sand reed but not with what paper, what direction nd how many times and what to do when done. To answer the question, I have 29 reeds of several brands, in 2, 2.5 and 3 strengths with 3 to 5 playing sessions on them. I also have 5-8 old ones which did not have the careful break in and use but do still play and maybe 2 that wont play at all right now. I find forum helpful for many people give many opinions on things I need to learn. Even though only for me, I like to be good, get better, and learn skills. But I CAN afford reeds and when none of mine will play I will of course buy new. I didnt really think I should practice adjusting a new reed which doesnt maybe need it so chose older worn-out ones. But I appreciate all the advice and patience with people like me. Really helps. High speed internet has given me ability to access many helpful videos as well.
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Author: knotty
Date: 2015-10-10 04:27
Thanks BGBG, one of the best info I've found so far is a book by David Etheridge. It's called Clarinet for Dummies and was printed in 2010. He has a very detailed section called "refining your reeds" with big clear pictures and some details I've not seen anywhere else. The rest of the book may be too elementary for you though.
~ Musical Progress: None ~
Post Edited (2015-10-10 04:28)
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Author: BGBG
Date: 2015-10-10 20:45
Right now I have reeds in plastic bags, maybe 3-5 per bag. Humidity in house is 55-60%, maybe about same in bags. I have a chart to track each reed and playings, simple-just a date and a check so know when and number times played. I try to play 2-3 times a day with maybe 3 reeds each time, and soak, play a song or two, listen, and see if any adjusting needed. I may adjust a little at the time or do another time if involved. I dont soak long or play long on a reed. I am not sure whether to dry laying it flat side down or curved side (vamp side) down but I see it is done both ways. Like the suggestion to lay on flat side down and put a weight on it but havent done so yet.
When I started I just played on 1 reed until it wouldnt work or was split and soaked a lot and a little in various liquids. Now I play very little, soak only 3-5 minutes, so reed has chance to adapt, so I feel I have learned something and improved. I doubt if ANY books would be too elementary for me but I was and am still confused about the many different , even opposite, things that seem to work. So instead of seeking the ONE WAY I now try many things to see which I find right for ME. That is the benefit of a forum I feel.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2015-10-11 07:26
A couple of points:
First, a reed that's warped in the way you describe is not retrievable, at least in my opinion. But there is also a question to be asked about why they've warped that way. Normal warping occurs lengthwise along the back (flat) side - the edges pull up, leaving a high area straight down the middle. This is caused mostly by uneven drying time between the front (vamp) side and the back. The warp you've described - toward the mouthpiece (I assume the facing) - can really only be caused by applying rather extreme force against the vamp, forcing it more or less unrelentingly toward the curve. Except maybe with an extremely soft reed, it's hard for me to imagine how a reed would take that shape under any normal playing conditions. But, having warped in that way, I wouldn't recommend wasting any time trying to learn how to correct it - the reed's elasticity is gone and no adjustment you make is going to restore it.
Reed adjustment is one of the most difficult things, I think, to learn by reading about it. You really need to see adjusting techniques in action. If a teacher can't be found, videos are the next best sources. I've just gotten back from a trip and haven't been in the house long enough to look anything up as suggestions. There are Tom Ridenour's videos, which are of course specifically meant to illustrate using ATG techniques. They *are* a place to *start*. There are probably others - maybe Ricardo Morales has posted something. Mark Nuccio has a couple of videos on YouTube about reeds - mostly, I think about choosing and conditioning them, but maybe also about adjusting them. I think you have to begin by seeing the techniques.
After you have the basic techniques, it isn't so much a matter of "What should I do," but one of "What's wrong with the reed," or more to the point 99% of the time "Where is the reed too stiff?" If the reed isn't vibrating as you want it to, you need to find where the wood lacks enough give and remove small amounts of material leaving a smooth surface - no bumps to interfere (Roger Salander called them "fences" in an article several decades ago in Clarinet). The trick is to find the spots. You can't add wood to correct soft spots, so generally, unless the reed is overall just slightly too soft (when clipping may be useful), it's best to forget about reeds that have collapsed.
Karl
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