 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-07-19 07:39
Attachment: Rovner.JPG (132k)
Attachment: NonameA.JPG (129k)
Attachment: Crampon.JPG (135k)
Attachment: NonameL.JPG (128k)
(Actually, 4- or maybe 6 or 8.)
I've been playing clarinet regularly now for 5 years after 38 years off. After a season of experimentation with ligatures, I returned to an early favorite- the Rovner dark. I've stuck with the Rovner through clarinet changes, mouthpiece experimentation and changes, reed changes, learning ATG, etc etc. I've occasionally swapped ligatures briefly since then, but only rarely and never expecting or finding any improvement.
I know many (most?) of you swear by (at?) your ligatures and the profound effect they are supposed to have on all aspects of your play. And I have also heard and pretty much believed that if a ligature holds your reed securely and without fuss, that's all it can do and any other claims are overblown. My early experience went both ways, but for a couple of years I've strongly leaned toward the 2nd- cynical- view, I admit partly because that simplified my equipment choices and reduced my angst.
SO... about a week ago when I was blowing a rather poorly performing reed, for grins I swapped the Rovner for first 1, then 2 other metal ligs sitting in my cabinet. And the play immediately improved with one of them, not so much with the other 2. Now- I have bad bad memories of previous glimmers of improvement that quickly faded, so I was skeptical. But I have been having a blast for the past week- all my reeds play better, so it seems- and many issues are fading away. If this is a placebo effect, I don't care, I am a happy camper- I just hope this lasts.
My best guess is that some physical aspects of my play have shifted over the past year or so- and the Rovner dark was fighting me and I didn't know it.
The ligature "responsible" for all this goodness, "NonameA"- I am almost certain came from the Ridenours on my Arioso. It has no name on it. I can't imagine there is anything special about it, or that it cost them more than a couple of bucks. (Ted or whoever- right?) Now I guess I have to re-enter the ligature fray and figure out what really works best that makes any sense for me to buy. I bought, used, and then sold an Optimum back during my experimentation days, disgusting to consider paying for another.
And what of those other 2 metal ligs? The Buffet Crampon came with my first used TR147, and always seemed to play a little better than I expected, just not this time. And "NonameL" came from the Ridenours with my "Lyrique 2nd", and didn't do much this time either.
All parts of your clarinet setup work together, so you cannot choose any one part independent of the range of options for each of the others. Even though that would make life simpler. Sigh.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-09-26 18:25)
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2015-07-19 19:01
I wouldn't give a nickel for any of those 4 Ligatures.
If you want to try a really great Rovner, try the Van Gogh Rovner. Also the Versa X with the metal exposed is great.
They DO play quite differently than your regular or dark Rovner.
Ligatures don't make or break someone, but can be a nice difference/nuance.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
Post Edited (2015-07-19 19:01)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-07-19 19:27
I applaud the willingness to experiment and allow for new ideas.
We all find our own solutions and the funniest thing about that is we find different solutions within our own different eras. I can honestly say that "young me" would not have agreed with all the solutions "old me" has come up with.
and so it goes
..............Paul Aviles
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-07-19 21:37
David- thanks for the suggestion of the other 2 Rovners, either looks like a good choice, and reasonably priced. My 2 Rovner darks might work out as a pretty even swap. Oh- and I bet if you had to play with any of the 4 I pictured, you'd be miffed and maybe have to work a bit harder, but inside 3 min you'd be fine. At this point I don't have quite that much latitude.
Paul- ain't it so... I often wonder what my 1972 setup (Noblet, stock mp and lig, Rico #2) would feel like to me if I picked it up today. Or how would my 2015 setup feel to me in 1972. I bet I wouldn't have set it down for 38 years.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-07-19 21:39)
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-07-20 00:17
I think I have the same stuff in my shoe-box as you ...
Stuff like this makes me crazy.
I was a skeptic, years ago, but I am astonished how something whose primary objective is just to hold the reed on the MP can make!
I use string (woven nylon) or Luyben. Cheap ... and I am poor.
Tom
Post Edited (2015-07-20 00:23)
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Author: as9934
Date: 2015-07-20 08:16
No name A kinda look like a bonade to me; http://shop.weinermusic.com/BONADE-REGULAR-Bb-CLARINET-LIGATURE-2250N-NICKEL/productinfo/LB1R00/
I have heard a couple of good things about the bonade's. Obviously if Bonade likes it there must be something to them. I have also experimented with different ligatures and use different ones for different occasions. I tend to use my Rovner MKII when outside on the marching field with my B45, because it gives me a big strong dark presence. For classical settings I use my Pewter M/O because it was designed for use with my MP. What I was astounded by recently was the ligature that came with my student clarinet (a Yamaha 200AD). It was really vibrant and responsive without being to springy.
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill Wind Ensemble
Buffet E11 clarinet , Vandoren Masters CL6 13 series mouthpiece w/ Pewter M/O Ligature, Vandoren V12 3.5
Yamaha 200ad clarinet, Vandoren B45 mouthpiece, Rovner ligature
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2015-07-20 20:39
Stan, I have an old lig that looks to be the same as your NonameA. It came with a 1920's Buescher clarinet and it has thinner metal than most ligatures and a certain springiness to it that others lack.
After reshaping it properly to only push up against the centre of the bark without touching the sides of the reed, it does perform very well indeed with some mouthpieces. Cheap white cork grease on the screw threads can make it easier to gauge the tension as you tighten it up, making precise adjustment a breeze.
I also have a Buffet-Crampon stock lig identical to yours and, after properly reshaping it, found that it pairs superbly with my Yamaha YAC-1208 piece, but is horrible on everything else--especially the Buffet C Crown and Evette & Schaeffer C in my collection!
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2015-07-20 21:53
Thank You for this thread! I must admit, I didn't expect to find much to think about, until I opened it up and read it! (Silly me)
I was a long-term Bonade guy, regular and inverted. I really had no issues for most of my life. 20 years ago, with a big switch to a Greg Smith "K" mouthpiece and a Chadash barrel, I also found great success switching to the Rovner Dark. That was my mainstay for the last 18 years. Then, still on my 1969 R13. Now Rovner has switched their Dark ligature to a more vibration-friendly version with what I can only describe as a "sliced-up" version of itself. I kind-of liked them as well.
On another recent splurge of equipment variations, the trusty Smith "K" started having issues. A trip to Walt Grabner's basement (what an extremely wonderful person he is!) revealed that the Smith had gotten worn into an uneven lay, causing my issues. At that time, I picked up a couple of Walt's wonderful K14 pieces. In the long run, I made an error with these, they being just a wee bit too open for my everyday playing. I still use and love them, but for more commercial or jazz type gigs. I called another great person in the industry, Clark Fobes, and he gave me much food for thought. I ordered up his CF+ and his current favorite, the CWF mouthpieces. I really gravitated to the CF+, and to never face the realities of wearing out a favorite, I ordered up 2 more CF+ pieces. Still - using the Rovner Dark.
In the back of my mind, I still remember all the good results from the Bonade days of my youth, though then - on a pair of custom hand-made Frank Wells mouthpieces. I fished through my drawers of forgotten accessories, and brought out the Bonades. The regular just didn't do it on the Fobes. The inverted was better. I realized from reading other posts that these ligatures often get bent and do not give the best results because of that. I carefully adjusted the Bonade Inverted, and liked it very much.
On a whim, and of course by friends suggestions - I decided to give the Vandoren Optima a go. On the standard plate - it pretty much gives you a "perfect Bonade" effect. These were great! Why did I wait so long? So, I ordered up several sets of the Optima, for all my Beefers, my Eeffer and my A. I was pretty happy. Until....
Quick history catch up - I converted to, and totally love the Fobes E-flat mouthpiece. That piece is a real thing of beauty! Okay - on with the story...
Had a run of Bernstein's "Wonderful Town" on Reed 1 (Eefer, Beefer and flute). Right before curtain-up on opening night, I got all my gear ready and warmed up. While playing the overture on the Beefer, I notice something weird going on. Through my peripheral vision, I see the Optima on my Eeffer moving, all on its own! Then it sprang up and off the horn! I caught it with my right hand, and sort-of thought about freaking, as the next tune in this musical is all screaming Eeffer. I managed to pop it back on, got it adjusted back, and got the number down. A wee bit later in the act (fortunately, no more Eeffer in Act 1) it did it again! Seems that Clark Fobes' E-flat piece has a certain geometry to the outside that the Optima just doesn't like. I popped back on my Rovner Dark, and that was that, for the Eeffer, for the run of the show.
Lately, I've also found on all the other horns, that I have now migrated to the Fobes CWF mouthpiece, and also use Rovner Darks on all of them. Every now and then, I'll pop on the Optima, but usually go back to the Rovner by the end of the gig.
Guess that's the way I am, currently.
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-07-20 22:43
Ken- thanks for sharing. Interesting that Rovner dark remains a dependable old friend for you. Recently on another thread somebody said they wouldn't touch one with a 10 ft pole, or something like that. We all seem to have similar, and different, experiences.
aa9934- NonameA is not a Bonade or even a cheap copy, the part that touches the reed is not flat like the Bonade. It's just the normal roundish ligature, but the reed contact part looks deliberately roughened up.
ALL OF YOU- I do have 2 Rovner darks, looks like both are newer design. Anything I could do easily to experiment on 1 of them? Somebody said glue in a piece of cork. I don't want to ruin it in case I resell. But that wouldn't be the end of the world, especially if the modification has a decent shot at really improving how it plays.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2015-07-20 22:48
Stan..
Am I correct in assuming that the NonameA ligature you seem to now like is one you've tried on your current setup, in days past, with less positive results?
I'm truly glad when people find setups that work for them, even if, as you conceede, that the effect may be purely perceived. I am open to the idea that ligatures can make subtle differences, despite limited perception on my part of such findings--although I prefer my ligs in metal.
I do though caution drawing conclusions after 1 week of play, especially if nothing about your setup has recently changed aside from the "lig," barring perhaps you're improvement as a player.
To those out there on the fence about spending $ on ligatures, my 2 cents would be that in the metaphorical "street fight" between diligent use of a time tested etude book and a ligature, the etude book wins every time.
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-07-20 23:34
Dave- yes, NonameA previously seemed pretty nice for what it was, but no better than my alternatives. I'm taking my positive results with it now more as a negative on the Rovner dark than as a plus on the NonameA. And as I said, it's an indicator I need to revisit and refine my ligature choice.
I have many minor positives over the past few months. And surprisingly, that's meant each additional increment feels that much better.
I don't regret (most of) my dead end detours- I learned hugely from them. Even just knowing there's nothing useful down a particular road is a good thing.
BTW it does appear both my Rovner darks are the newer variety. At least the one box says "Design Improved Performance", and they look identical other than one being more heavily used. Though honestly I never played them side by side. And I don't know which came in that box, the one in my picture or the newer looking one.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-07-20 23:35)
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Author: GBK
Date: 2015-07-21 00:10
fskelley wrote:
> I do have 2 Rovner darks, looks like both are newer design.
> Anything I could do easily to experiment on 1 of them?
> Somebody said glue in a piece of cork. I don't want to ruin it
> in case I resell.
Rovner dark ligatures sell for only about $20. Hardly a big investment.
Be brave - take a chance experimenting.
Although I think that the Rovner dark ligature muffles too many high harmonics for the sake of a more covered sound, an experimentation you might make is to make 5 razor blade cuts horizontally across and completely through the front fabric. It will free up the sound a slight bit.
...GBK (who still has yet to find anything better than a properly adjusted older inverted Bonade)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-07-22 05:54
Today I tried, in pretty quick succession, Rovner dark, NonameA (still liked it better), Rovner dark with newly oiled screw (another discussion here suggested that might make a difference, I couldn't tell), and Bois. Left the Bois on for today's session, it plays as well as anything else I have, maybe better.
I will probably go with the advice of a Versa X when I can. Other BBoard discussions are mixed about it, just like everything else. At least it looks easier to deal with than most, and has several choices of how to configure. And it won't break the bank.
3-4 days on the Bois has been pretty good. I've learned to shove it down firmly and far enough to avoid any shifting (last time I used was with Legere, good luck with that). Also, since I'm keeping costs minimum, I've ordered a $6 BG Revelation clone- reviews of those here on BBoard are terrible, but several eBxx buyers gave it thumbs up. If it's no good for me, at least I'll feel free to experiment with mods to it. Stay tuned.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-07-24 18:35)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-06 08:22
Attachment: 6dollar-1.JPG (128k)
It took my $5.99 ligature 13 days to arrive from China. While waiting I've mostly continued playing on my Bois. I do like how the Bois plays, but I find it pretty inconvenient to position and reposition after reed adjustments. I'd hate to end up wanting to use it all the time. Though it does have a modern look with minimalist appeal.
I also worked more with NonameA, and found that if I left the top screw as loose as possible, it plays better, almost as freely as the Bois. (I did many such experiments years ago and had tried to put aside the whole concept as old bad science- my bad.) Of course it is easy to find many such suggestions on various YouTube videos and BBoard threads- though some of you- I think- do as I'd been doing and always crank your ligature down tight. So anyway, by the time "6dollar" ligature arrived I'd already made progress. I did note that my Rovner dark seems to play the same regardless of the screw tightness- maybe that's why I had quit trying.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-06 08:30
Attachment: 6dollar-2.JPG (148k)
Attachment: 6dollar-3.JPG (143k)
Attachment: 6dollar-4.JPG (112k)
Attachment: 6dollar-5.JPG (139k)
6dollar is not impressive in build quality, alignment, and such. Eventually I'll compare side by side with similar models from BG and Rovner. But it did not inspire confidence. Once I got it in place, though, it seemed OK.
But- how did it play? Initially- very disappointing- duller than the Rovner dark. Maybe that's no surprise, with that green cord pressed against the reed. But... it only cost me $6, not even worth sending back to China, so I felt free to mess with it. And I pulled off the greed cord (just glued in place)- leaving what looks a lot like the metal reed supports on several pricier ligature models.
And now it plays WONDERFULLY. 2 days in... super super. So once again I am a happy camper. Yes I guess I'll spring $40 or $50 for something better made eventually. But progress is progress.
Since 6dollar did not come with a cap, for now I have to use the gold tip cover already in my collection shown in 6dollar-5.JPG. But that has a tendency to pop off, even on cane reeds (don't even try on a synthetic).
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-08-06 08:33)
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2015-08-06 08:51
Looks like someone integrated a Vandoren Optimum twin-bar pressure plate into a Rovner.
I'm not at all surprised that it plays well!
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Author: ned
Date: 2015-08-06 10:21
''I know many (most?) of you swear by (at?) your ligatures and the profound effect they are supposed to have on all aspects of your play. And I have also heard and pretty much believed that if a ligature holds your reed securely and without fuss, that's all it can do and any other claims are overblown.''
In reply, I can only offer a cricketing analogy...
If the sky is overcast, the bowler (i.e. fast bowler) will more than likely, move the ball through the air, on it's way to the batsman...then again...don't count on it.
The 4th Test starts today, by the way, and judging by the server addresses of this thread's correspondents, most of you won't be watching.
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-06 14:29
So... if you had to choose between attending a live performance by your favorite clarinetist in the entire world, playing your choice of music, close up and personal... vs your most serious sporting event, again best possible seats and setting- which would it be? Maybe this should be another thread.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-13 20:31
Versa X on the way from Wisconsin to FL, $41.88 with shipping. 2 Rovner darks sold, old rack EQ unit sold, Bois might sell- so I came out ahead. Expecting my jaw to drop.
(Edited to add- OK, the WI store did not have it in stock even though website said they did, and let me order it. And they didn't tell me about 2-3 week back order until I called today. That's what I get for being nice and waiting 36 hr before calling. So cancelled that order and instead ordered from Xxxxx123 for $46.05, higher price and 2 days lost, grumble grumble.)
(Edited again to add- I'm consistently playing on the $6 Chinese eBxx clone while waiting for the Versa X, and doing rather well with it. Of course I am hoping for a big step up with the Versa. But if not, I guess I will still have learned something- Mythbusters always says any result is a result. For sure, though, I got huge benefit out of leaving the Rovner Dark- which is how this thread started.)
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-08-17 04:39)
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2015-08-14 23:06
As to your most recent question Stan, I will postulate that the answer might be the opposite of what would be given if you posed the same question on, say, an ESPN blog, if not diametrically opposite.
Maybe not.
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-16 01:37
Attachment: M123.jpg (101k)
And to take this thread still another direction- I just discovered via Google Earth that online retailer Xxxxx123 ships from an address clearly labeled "Xxxxxx's Frixxd". In fact, both of these are owned by Guxxxx Cxxxxr. And so is Wxxxxxnd Brxxxxxnd. But not the WI store that failed me.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-08-16 01:40)
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2015-08-16 01:45
Stan, I have bought from all four of those outfits in the past, and still receive sales material from all of them, with mostly identical pricing. What a waste of paper!
And don't get me started on Interstate Music. I've had stuff take a week to get here from Milwaukee, even though it's just across Lake Michigan from here.
Post Edited (2015-08-16 01:55)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-16 02:05
Yes, it's all either a glowing example of capitalism at work, or of how it wastes resources, or both- depending on your political point of view. I'm just glad that I have every item on the planet readily available to me from multiple sources, at well below full retail price. It was not always so, and it may not remain that way, who can predict?
Every one of us is always waiting for something- either already ordered or that we intend to order when we can.
And there was a time that a trip across Lake Michigan was a dicey proposition that might take months for the right weather, with a good chance of your shipment ending up on the lake bottom. So we have made progress.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-08-16 02:07)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-20 08:15
Versa X will one day arrive here via slow boat (UPS Shipping Innovations) from Mxxxx123. One of my old Rovner darks is already shipped, the other is packed and waiting for buyer to pay for it or to be relisted, and my Bois is shipped. Meanwhile I have continued to prove that 6dollar ligature is far better than NonameA, NonameL, or Crampon (see my original post).
Yesterday I reconsidered my removal of the green cord. I stuck it in there for most of my play time. Afterwards I glued it back on. Then today I was very careful to position it in the center of the reed. Only the green cord touches the reed, and only on a very narrow strip right up the middle.
And then I had my best play session on clarinet, ever. Everything was working right. Not perfect, but way beyond anything I have been used to. (Later I said something about it to the wife- she said, "I know".)
In a perfect music world, we would all get a little better every day, so that we could always say, today was my best play session ever. Maybe that is true for some of you. My own experience has not been so uniform. So a "best ever" day is always a delight. Now (as after previous best ever days) I have to see how it holds up over time.
I am giving a good deal of credit to 6dollar ligature. I think the reason I did poorly with it initially is that it was rather mashed in its plain plastic bag during its trip from China. I eventually carefully rebent and adjusted it, but only after having removed the green cord. It seems that I should have worked with it longer before altering it.
It will be very interesting to compare performance with the Versa X. Maybe 6dollar is my keeper. Weirder things happen.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-08-20 08:41)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-21 03:59
Versa X arrived TODAY, 6 days from order date, not bad at all. Tracking was nonexistent (only populated today), that's why I expected it to be longer. And I think I can get a few bucks back from Mxxxx123 on a price match, so all should be OK. I grouch but really, it's good.
A different day, a different reed, a different ligature, and different expectations- and it went really well. On David's suggestion I started with "flaps under"- later I can try one or both flaps on top. It is tricky to position the reed and the X so that the cradle is centered on the reed and the reed on the mouthpiece, lots of fiddling until I get the routine down. I hope this is not a critical adjustment (I'll try to figure that out later also), but for now I'll assume it needs to be on the money. More photos later.
I only played 6dollar in it's designed form- with the green cord- one day, so comparisons at this point are tenuous. 6dollar and X play differently, and fairly or not I'm calling the X better (or for sure better potential) and it's going to get all my play time unless or until I have some reason to change again. Today was another great play day, it would have been tough to beat yesterday.
Mostly in the coming days I want to settle into my new configuration and readjust my repertoire for the improved response. And, as I've said, confirm the good changes are "permanent" and dependable over future weeks and months. I'm not very worried.
I also expect to revisit some reed choices I recently rejected- I have a nice selection available. And I will re-evaluate what I've reported in various BBoard threads, and revise and update as needed once I am sure what is long term reality. As an example, it seems my whole problem with reeds dying on me after a couple of songs- went away after I abandoned those Rovner darks.
And speaking of Rovner darks- I see on the instruction sheet that came with my X that most/all Rovners can be reversed to normal rather than inverted position- to put the screw above the reed. Too late for me now, but I wonder if doing that would have helped me. Any of you ever try this?
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2015-08-21 13:50
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> I oil ligatures when I start to feel friction.
>
What kind of oil is best for ligatures?
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-08-23 16:58
My jaw has dropped and may never return to normal.
Yesterday I tried a sampling of reeds from my reject bin. Vandoren blues that did not play well for me in the past, D'Addario, Leuthner, AW. (I'll wait a while on the Legere, not ready to completely blow my mind). And every stinking one was a winner. No, not every one was perfect- some obviously needed some more ATG adjustment or were inferior in one way or another. I did conclude that I want to continue for now with blues. BUT I could now use ANY of those reeds in a performance situation and be ahead of where I was only a month or so ago with the best reeds I then had at my disposal. And THAT is progress.
Ligatures get the credit. I'm left with a sneaking suspicion that instead it was some shift in my playing technique. We always do that kind of thing- for example if a sales person blows sales off the chart, whoever he/she is selling for doesn't want to pay the huge commissions due because "obviously the product is so good all those sales would have happened anyway". Maybe, maybe not. We take a pain pill, pain goes away, and we think "gee I didn't need that pill". Was it the pill, or was it that we knew we took a pill and it didn't matter what was in it? Placebos.
I still think it was the ligatures. One day down the road (a year or 2) I will pick up a Rovner dark and try to play on it. My guess is I'll do fine. Perhaps it was inhibiting proper technique for me, and I couldn't adjust until I got onto something else? Or maybe it will be a bad blast from the past.
Anyway, I am happy happy happy. :-)
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2015-09-26 18:24
A month later I am still playing all the time on Versa X. A few times I've covered the metal plate, always put it back to uncovered.
The X is better for me than my alternatives because of playability. I have no complaint about sound, perhaps in future I will compare to other pricey ligature choices.
I find the X to be finicky to position. It needs to be centered on the reed (right?), but really wants to slip one way or the other before tightening. And my example may be a bit cockeyed (or my 5RV lyre is crooked) so I can't really precisely center both top and bottom, it's always a compromise. A pain when I'm adjusting a reed and keep taking it off and putting it back on.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2015-09-26 18:26)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-04-19 17:08
Thanks to a helpful email from Brad Behn yesterday, I was pondering my mouthpiece (5RV Lyre) and all aspects of my setup again. And I was reading up once again on the specs of all the Vandoren mp, looking for something about the curvature of the facing (didn't find much) which Brad says is important to the high altissimo response I'm so keen on (I need the facing to not be too flat). And I was looking at a nice diagram of one of their mp pointing out the ligature lines, and... OOPS. I have NEVER paid attention to the TOP line.
And it turns out the Versa X (others?) is tall enough that, if you use the higher bottom line, you completely cover the top one (guess I'll eventually post a photo). And it seems to me that positioning any ligature too high could compromise the action of that facing curvature.
So---- last night I moved my Versa X down below the top line (now it hits or slightly covers the lower bottom line). And reeds that had refused to play C7 ![[C7]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/c7.gif) for me suddenly had no problem. (I moved the lig down and up- and C7 came and went.) I had an hour of play with my most limiting issue basically gone. (To clarify- with the lig too high, only certain reeds are good on C7, and those only for a few minutes of play. With the lig low enough, "all" my reeds play C7 and for longer- that's the initial conclusion.)
That's one day- we'll see if it holds up. But at least I've proven this is an important matter. And yes I'd experimented with position before, but other characteristics of play were better (like clarion stability) in the "wrong" position, that's how I ended up there. More work ahead, but progress is a good thing.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2016-04-19 18:08)
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-04-21 16:52
Bob Spring, one of the most sought out clarinet teachers in the States, of our generation, gives an interesting talk here about reeds, reed placement, prepping reeds, ligatures, ligature placement, pads, and just about all other things related to why it's our instruments and gear, not us, that's holding us back.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8Z1y7E7_04
(not)
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-04-21 22:31
David..I completely agree.
But, in your own opinion, would you mind, in that "pie chart in your head," breaking down the importance of metronome based etude and study exercises, sight reading, solos, group play, along with ligatures, reeds, reed prep, reed storage, etc., and any other things you can think of.
I ask this because I sometimes wonder if people think gear is going to make them a better sight reader.
You and I know better.
(David teaches advanced clarinet students, with known capabilities of advancing them further in competitive venues.)
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2016-04-22 03:05
I view it as a fast car - sure you will go quicker, but the trained high end drivers will get the biggest bonus from it.
Put an amateur in a formula one car, and they could go quicker, but also could easily burn out something.
We can't buy talent nor hard work.
We can buy great training
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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The Clarinet Pages
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