 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Beausoleiljacob
Date: 2015-04-16 07:38
Hi Everyone,
I am new to this form and this will be my very first post!
Anyways, I have been playing the clarinet for easily 6 years now and am still not sure on what style or strength to buy. Some info: I have a Buffet R13. I usually play on a Rue Lepic 3/3.5 and the same goes for the V12's. I play on a Vandoren M30 Lyre Mouthpiece.
Ok. So my problem is I am not achieving the sound I want with these reeds. Some out of the box play gorgeously but I have to spend profuse amounts of money to actually find 5 good reeds. With the others however, I try to profile them using my Vandoren Reed Resurfacer but it never seems to do the trick.
The sound I am looking for is of a lot of clarinetists. A round, dark and bold sound. I like to be able to play loud and really soft. Yet not all of the vandoren reeds seem to do it. I love the sound of the ones that do play nice however.
Would switching down to a lower reed strength (2.5 :/) work? What do you guys suggest?
How many clarinetists does it take to change a lightbulb?
Only one, but he'll go through a whole box of bulbs before he finds just the right one.
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Author: Guillaume
Date: 2015-04-16 11:47
Hello !
Hard to say anything without being with you, trying different combinations of mouthpieces and reeds... Everyone is unique, and a brand or a strength that is good for me will certainly not be good for you.
I'm very comfortable with my B40 Lyre and V12 or 56RL or V21 3,5 reeds, but a friend of mine prefers V12 4 on B40 while a student of mine likes very much Rico Grand Concert Select 4,5 on a M30...
The choice of reeds is a very personnal matter, the best thing to do is to try different strengths and brands until you find what's the best for you.
Guillaume
http://www.guillaume-jouis.com
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2015-04-16 15:43
One of the few clarinet accessories that many of us believe actually lays true to its claims:
http://www.ridenourclarinetproducts.com/ATG1.html might be best here.
I too use a Vandoren Reed Resurfacer, but I apply these ATG techniques in its use.
There is plenty of information here on the board, (not to mention Youtube videos) that you can find with the search feature on this product.
I have no financial relationship with anyone in the music industry.
One caveat: It is my opinion that ATG is a fabulous way to get reeds, out of the box, to play well. But that over the life of the reed, its techniques should be used less and less on any particularly aging reed, for to not back off from its application may result in a reed that is too weak.
I have found that once a reed is basically balanced using ATG, that most imbalances experienced by the player thereafter are best addressed by moving a weaker reed microns higher on the mouthpiece (and vice versa), and to the left if the right side is stronger (and vice versa). Other players may disagree.
ATG teaches how to test each side of a reed for its strength.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-04-16 16:06
Gosh, I usually get about 6 usable (concert ready) reeds per box of Rue Lepic, so the first thing to check is whether you break in reeds and if you do, HOW.
Look at this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9y0Zv3EZ-Ms
This process is pretty detailed, but as long as you take about 3 to 5 days BEFORE you put any real time on a reed, then you are re-hydrating them enough.
THEN I humbly suggest that the underlying issue is that you do NOT use your core properly. I am learning not to say AIR PRESSURE, but what you MUST do is ALWAYS have your abdominal muscles fully engaged and pressing. The moderation of the air comes NOT from pushing less, but from engaging your diaphragm MORE to counterbalance pushing air out. Why is this necessary? You need to have a smooth flow of air at all times to achieve the kind of sound you want. It also needs to respond quickly (fractions of a second) from one level of air movement needed to another - and this changes from note-to-note, register-to-register and dynamic-to-dynamic. So your abdominal muscles work ALL the time, pressing as if you are at your top dynamic, and when you are not (particularly at pianissimo) then it is your diaphragm holding you back (basically how you stop a long note anyway).
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2015-04-16 17:48
Certainly it helps to be able to adjust reeds. The basic exercise is to twist the mouthpiece from side to side and balance the reed so that both sides play the same. Then you can take cane off or clip the tip to bring the reed to the strength that works best.
However, your sound comes from your anatomy and your mind. The mouthpiece and reed are nothing compared to your brain.
Practice making many sounds, ugly as well as beautiful. Play Three Blind Mice as if you were a mouse - scurrying and squeaky. Then play it like the farmer's wife, clomping after them waving a knife. Then play it like the cat, slinking around waiting for nice mouse tails to eat. Then play it like the Three Stooges, complete with slaps and eye-pokes.
More seriously, read my favorite article on making many good sounds http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=94788&t=94788.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2015-04-16 17:55
Nice article.
We resently had a rehearsal where are leader asked us to "give birth to a sonic baby," rather than just have a flute, clarinet and bassoon playing the passage.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2015-04-16 17:59
Beausoleiljacob wrote:
> I usually play on a Rue Lepic
> 3/3.5 and the same goes for the V12's. I play on a Vandoren M30
> Lyre Mouthpiece.
>
> Ok. So my problem is I am not achieving the sound I want with
> these reeds.
Without contradicting the responses you've already gotten, I need to go in a couple of different directions.
You mention two models of Vandoren reeds. There are still six others (Traditional, V21, two "German" and two "Austrian" styles) in addition to maybe half a dozen other brands (some with more than one model) out there. What else have you tried?
The real issue, though is that reeds don't make your sound what it is. They can have some effect, but the basic quality of tone is shaped by other parts of the system. Embouchure and oral (inside your mouth) shape, use of air and the musculature involved in moving it, tongue position and other more subtle parts of your approach to sound production have a lot to do with the result, at least once you've found the right *range* of reed strength. And then there are the influences of the mouthpiece, the instrument and even the barrel that, IMO, have more to do with sound quality than the reed's design (brand and model).
You have not, after six years, probably even scratched the surface of the possibilities in your own technical approach to sound production. That's not a criticism, not meant to minimize your accomplishments so far. But the fact is that there are probably many changes you can make, some bigger and some more subtle, to come closer to the sound you want. Meanwhile, finding the reeds that make playing easier - that get in your way least - is really a trial and error process. You can search among the obvious alternatives: VD Traditionals and V21s; D'addario Reserves, Reserve Classics and Grand Concerts; and Gonzalez FOFs and GDs. Or you can learn to make the Vandorens you're already used to play better by learning to make adjustments to improve the ones you can't play out of the box.
> The sound I am looking for is of a lot of clarinetists. A
> round, dark and bold sound. I like to be able to play loud and
> really soft. Yet not all of the vandoren reeds seem to do it. I
> love the sound of the ones that do play nice however.
>
Cane reeds are by nature inconsistent - from reed to reed and from day to day. You could try synthetics, but many players don't like them. And be careful of searching for a verbal ideal - "dark" and even "round" are not very meaningful when discussing sound, and without a clear idea in your imagination of the actual sound you want - independent of the influence of descriptive words - you may never find what you think you're looking for. Or, worse, what you thought you wanted doesn't work as well as you thought it would. Read through the thread about "What is dark sound?" that's still on the first page of BB topics.
Expect clean response and clear sound from a reed. Deepen and color ("darken?") it with your own sound production technique. Learn to improve the vibration of almost-good reeds with ATG or Reed Resurfacer or Reed Wizard or a knife or reed rush - any combination of techniques you can learn about to salvage them from the trash can (or recycling bin).
> Would switching down to a lower reed strength (2.5 :/) work?
> What do you guys suggest?
>
You'll get the best answer by trying a box of lower strength reeds. We can't hear you play. The right reed strength will not close easily with normal or even a little more embouchure pressure and vibrates cleanly when played with good embouchure and breath support.
Karl
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Author: TomS
Date: 2015-04-16 18:11
Might be your air delivery system (breathing and blowing).
If you aren't adjusting reeds properly or at all, and not taking some care with how you break in and store your reeds, you WILL have problems. Guaranteed. I have to adjust nearly all of my cane reeds ... you can adjust with a razor blade, but a Ridenour ATG system is better ...
I use a M30-lyre (non 13 series) regularly ... it's GREAT. But, I really had terrible luck with V12s on this MP. Try some VD blue box or Legere Classic. The blue box reeds aren't that much brighter than the V12s ... actually, IMHO, darker with more "hold" on the higher notes ... The Legere Signatures kinda-sorta work on this MP, too.
Not tried the 56s on M30-lyre. Local music store doesn't stock them, so I don't buy them ...
But, for kinder and gentler playing, I use M13 (not lyre) and Legere Classic or Quebec. I really prefer the compactness of the closer facings.
Stick with your current MP and check our your air delivery systems and improve your reed rituals.
Tom
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Author: William
Date: 2015-04-16 22:25
I gave up on the inconsistencies and other cane hassles over five years ago when Forestone of Japan came out with their wonderful bamboo/resin synthetic clarinet and saxophone reeds. For the most part, they need no break-in, no moistening and no "balancing"....and they are very durable. The newest Black Bamboo reeds are ESPECIALLY mouthpiece friendly and play well on my new Walter Grabner K11* as well as my trusty old Chicago Kaspar #14, bought while I was in college. Synthetic reeds are the reeds of the future, and for me, that "future" is already here with Forestone of Japan.
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