 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: darby
Date: 2001-04-22 21:38
I've asked about which brands are good, now I'd like to find out what names I shouldn't bother with. I know the Chinese horns are a no no, but what about all those weird names seen on ebay? Are the clarinets from France with all those different names any good? Thank you.
Darby
P.S. what about the older horns with the wrap around register keys? Any advantage/disadvantage?
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Author: David Kinder
Date: 2001-04-22 21:50
Personally, I'd stay away from Jupiter clarinets. They just seem to be junk.
Then I'd stay away from wood Armstrong/Artley clarinets. The plastic ones are good, but they're for students. Wood ones just won't perform at the level I'd expect them too.
I don't know anything about Amati - but they're priced for the intermediate player.
Conn and King to me are saxophone and trumpet manufacturers, so I wouldn't buy a Conn clarient, but that's only my opinion.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2001-04-22 23:33
Mark C, shouldn't we be cautious in what we say here? I'm sure all of us have our PERSONAL negatives, which may do harm, not good. IMHO Don
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2001-04-23 00:26
Actually, some of the Kings were made by SML and are very nice instruments. The ones marked LeMaire, Strasser, or Marigaux are nice performers. The King Tempo is a student instrument. I just overhauled a Conn 444 for a customer out in CA that turned out to be a real good performer for jazz work. It have a very large .594 bore. I really can't tell a any difference in the 444 and the 424 except the little medallion insert on the bell on the 444. Conn Directors and 16's are student instrumentsl. Jupiter is getting better. There saxophones have improved quite a bit. I think that their new student line alto is a fairly good instrument and isn't at all that pricey. (767 GL?) Wrap around register mechanisms haven't been manufactured in a LONG time. It is just as convenient to place it in the back and the simplicity of the design is much better. I wouldn't buy a Pathfinder!
John
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-04-23 00:53
But Don - carrying that logic forward, we shouldn't be discussing our personal positives here, either.
If people have had personal trouble with certain brands, I think it's fine to talk about them. The repair techs on this board have more than once expounded on the positive and negatives in construction of certain brands.
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2001-04-23 01:14
Oh, one more: "Parrot".....the general rule of thumb of repairers is not to recommend any instrument named after a bird or a woman! (Geesh!.......I've started something now!)
John
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Author: deejay
Date: 2001-04-23 01:37
I don't like Armstrong clarinet very well. School has one and a few keys have broke easy, I don't think it plays very well in tune either.. or atleast when I played it..
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Author: joseph o'kelly
Date: 2001-04-23 02:04
As much as I love their top of the line instruments, I hate their student line. This brand is Buffet. In the past the student line was called Evette. I can not stand for the plastic Evettes and I can not stand the current B-12 and B-10 instruments.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-04-23 13:01
Accord, Artley, Armstrong, Angel, B&H Regent (only because the keys break and can't be repaired), Blessing, Console, Concord, Dixon, Dolphin, ..... And I've only got to the Ds, and omitted the ones I've forgotten. I've worked on 117 names of clarinet and almost all of them are junk or close to it. Perhaps that is why we tend to focus on the good ones rather than the bad!
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2001-04-23 18:03
The old saying, "You get what you pay for," can be a pretty telling thing. When you see an ad that says, "Brand new clarinet--$150.00," I would run the other way. Those are usually off brand instruments (like the Chinese ones mentioned earlier) and aren't worth the $150.00 that could have been spent on a down payment for a better instrument.
As a general rule, buy the best you can afford at the time--even if you have to stretch a little to do it. If you're not sure about the maker, stick to the major favorites of professionals--Leblanc, Buffet, Selmer and Yamaha. These offer good warranties and have reputable dealers that are equipped to help with problems.
Some dealers offer a rent-purchase deal--that's a good one if you're not sure you want to stick with a particular model. If you like it, buy it. Sometimes you can get a 7 day satisfaction guaranteed deal. Always deal with a reputable person or dealer who offers your money back should there be a problem with the instrument.
If you want a plastic instrument, get a higher priced model--and ask the dealer how many he's had to take back or what the repair rate is--he'll tell you if he's an honest dealer. If you want a good wooden clarinet--don't buy the cheapest model--go to the intermediate-upper level and you'll be happier.
Again, these are general rules of thumb. There are always exceptions.
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Author: Michael
Date: 2001-04-23 18:36
How good would you consider the Vitos to be? I play a Vito, I think it's OK, but then again I'm only 13 and have only played one other clarinet in my lifetime--a bad plastic Bundy. Well, I guess that's why I'm here--to ask about the quality of Vito compared to others.
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-04-23 18:44
The old Pan Americans are pretty awful.
Look at the metal piece connecting the vertical rod and the pad cup for the 4 bottom keys. Avoid anything that has the "fin" of the connecting piece running beyond the middle of the pad cup, as this is a sign of cheaply made keys.
Avoid any metal clarinet (except for the silver ones that go for high prices).
For most of the off-brand instruments on eBay (i.e., not Buffet, Selmer, Leblanc or Yamaha), you run a dreadful risk of getting something so out of tune it's unusable. There are plenty of Vitos, Bundys and beginner-level Yamahas and Buffets. It's not worth taking chance on anything else, unless you have the chance to play the instrument first.
The old Buffets with the wrap-around register keys can be excellent instruments, but you run three risks:
First, the instrument could be at high pitch, which will make it useless for playing in any group. (Never buy any old Buffet that does not have the letters "L.P." (for "low pitch") stamped on the bell).
Second, these instruments are 100 years old and can be simply worn out or have had alterations made that make them.
Third, the very old Buffets (such as the ones with letters as well as numbers in the serial number) can have unstable pitch. The wear to the bore and tone holes results in notes that don't play in tune by themselves. You have to hear what you want and play there. To say the least, this is not good.
Therefore, before you buy an older Buffet, such as one with a wrap-around register key, you absolutely must have a chance to play it first.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-04-23 20:03
Michael wrote:
>
> How good would you consider the Vitos to be? I play a
> Vito, I think it's OK, but then again I'm only 13 and have only
> played one other clarinet in my lifetime--a bad plastic Bundy.
> Well, I guess that's why I'm here--to ask about the quality of
> Vito compared to others.
Vitos are made by Leblanc and are one of the four recommended beginner horns. The others are Buffet B-12, Selmer Bundy (actually the new ones have a different name I think), and the Yamaha student horns. However all but the Yamaha will need a different mouthpiece than the stock one supplied with the horn to do their best. I use a Vito as a backup to my pro grade Leblanc and find it does a good job.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-04-23 20:08
Ken Shaw wrote:
>
> The old Pan Americans are pretty awful.
Yes, I had one and shudder to think of anyone playing one of these.
> ... [snip] Avoid any metal clarinet (except for the silver ones that go
> for high prices).
Not entirely true. There were some decent student and intermediate grade ones that were nickel plated but do agree that it is hard to "separate the wheat from the chaff" on these.
>
> ... [snip] The old Buffets with the wrap-around register keys can be
> excellent instruments, but you run three risks:
>
> First, the instrument could be at high pitch, which will make
> it useless for playing in any group. (Never buy any old Buffet
> that does not have the letters "L.P." (for "low pitch") stamped
> on the bell).
>
> Second, these instruments are 100 years old and can be simply
> worn out or have had alterations made that make them.
>
The wrap around register key was continued into at least the early 1930s as well as marking the instruments with the LP. So some of them will be considerably less than 100 years old.
> ... Therefore, before you buy an older Buffet, such as one with a
> wrap-around register key, you absolutely must have a chance to
> play it first...
Actually this should be done with any used instrument. You don't know how hard it may have been used or abused.
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2001-04-24 02:22
That depends sometimes on when their instruments are made. For example, Conn Saxophones, trumpets, and even clarinets made before they moved their work shop from New York in late 1960's are even today esteemed as Vintage, especially Saxes. This is because many excellent technicians living in NY area leaved the company. Conn moved again their workshop to Chicago area in late 1980's, where execellent technicians live, their instruments again becoming famous for their artisanship.
Another example is early Yamaha. They were junks.
Old SML saxophones are seeked by many sax freeeks today.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-04-24 02:25
But early Yamaha classical guitars - before the company was called Yamaha (I have one) - are absolutely wonderful. Go figure.
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2001-04-24 03:56
There is another brand called "Sonata" which is either chinese or taiwanese and is nearly as bad as the Xing Hai. They also make saxophones and brass instruments as well as flutes and they are absolute rubbish. I had a student who tured up with a brand new Sonata Tenor Sax still in the plastic which had palm keys that were the wrong size and didn't reach the tone holes which was replaced by an instrument that came without a goose neck needless to say I contacted the shop that sold them and got stuck into them. Not to be confused with Sonata wooden Oboes from Czechoslovakia which are quite reasonable.
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Author: Jun
Date: 2001-04-24 17:22
i prefer my Yamaha custom CX which is grea....than buffet R13 in my opinion....the price is reasonable....
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Author: Cass
Date: 2001-04-25 14:02
I think it is also important to consider money, such as if you can re-sell a clarinet or trade up. With some brands, the store will not take it back in trade. No store will take my old Artley and to tell the truth I don't blame them even though I would like to have trade in value on it. They don't sell used Artley, Armstrong or most other student types. The same stores do sell used and re-conditioned Vito and Bundy clarinets. I never thought Bundy was suppose to be a good brand but from the store point of view at least they can sell it. I have a Vito that is good enough. Some day I would like a professional grade wood clarinet but until the budget allows it I am happy enough with my plastic Vito. I would keep it anyway to play outdoors where I would not take an expensive clarinet. The tuning on it is reasonable and I have never had problems of it breaking down or anything like that. I would say this is a good work horse clarinet, nothing fancy but does the job.
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