 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: nobregagui
Date: 2014-09-24 01:37
Hi,
Has anybody ever heard about a Dexter clarinet? What is this brand? I can't anything in the internet about it.
Thank you,
-Gui
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: nobregagui
Date: 2014-09-24 07:13
Do you all know where I can find information online about this brand?
-Gui
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2014-09-24 08:06
The fact that there's no mention of it on the net has to tell you something. If it were of any consequence there would be something about it. Can you give any more information? Is it an old instrument or a new one, what key system, key? Wood or plastic? Where have you heard of it? Chinese manufacturers will knock out small quantities of generic instruments with whatever name the customer specifies on them. Music shops sometimes order a batch with their name on them and sell them as their own house brand. There's no way to keep track of these odd names, when there may only be a handful in existence and they were all made last Tuesday.
Tony F.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: nobregagui
Date: 2014-09-24 08:42
Attachment: IMG_1635.JPG (587k)
Attachment: IMG_1636.JPG (526k)
Attachment: IMG_1637.JPG (456k)
Someone actually gave it to me. Someone that has $20,000 worth of instruments that include trumpet, alto sax, bassoon, oboe, french horn, etc. This clarinet was amongst them. As they are all expensive instruments, according to their brands and models in the internet, I thought that this clarinet would be a nice one too. I don't know whether it's wood or plastic (I'm thinking it's plastic) and I don't know the key, because I don't have a reed to test it out. I just got it today.
I'm attaching a couple of pics for you to see.
Thank you so much for all the help you're providing.
-Gui
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2014-09-24 18:56
I'm intrigued by the metal-lined upper joint. Does the metal lining extend the whole length of the joint or is it only around the tenon? Is there any metal lining in the lower joint? This would suggest that unless it's a tenon repair the clarinet isn't one of the cheap Chinese generic things, they don't ordinarily go to that much trouble. Interesting.
Tony F.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Liquorice
Date: 2014-09-24 20:00
Damn- for a moment I thought you'd found some rare recording of Dexter Gordon on clarinet!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: nobregagui
Date: 2014-09-25 07:48
Tony, thanks again for your help.
The metal goes all the way down to the other end of the upper joint. It extends the whole length of the joint. It is a continuous peace of metal in the inside. The lower joint does not have any metal inside.
Do you think the black part is wood or plastic?
What more thoughts do you have on this?
Thanks a lot.
-Gui
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2014-09-25 10:24
Lets see if I can stir up the chooks
An excellent way to test if a Clarinet is wood, plastic, or Ebonite (rubber) and doing minimal damage is to heat up a small needle in a cigarette lighter or spirit lamp (wear some sort of heavy gloves whilst holding the needle of course) and touch the flat end of the tenon joint with the sharp end of the needle. The resulting smell will unmistakeably be the odour of burning plastic OR rubber if that section of the instrument is made of those materials. If the instrument is wood , you'll probably detect some sort of oily smell.
As I said , minimal damage is done to the instrument. The tiny mark or indent is easily removed with a slight rub using fine emery paper.
"Oh Goodness Gracious Me ! He's suggesting that you BURN THE CLARINET" !
BJV
"The Clarinet is not a horn" (neither is the Oboe:)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2014-09-25 19:29
I'm pretty sure this doesn't fit into the category of Chinese generic production instruments, it's more likely that it's a stencil from one of the European or possibly American makers. Many of the major manufacturers made instruments for other companies to fill gaps in their product lines or for direct sale by music stores. I think this may be one such.
Since little seems to be known about the name I suspect that this one may have been made for direct sale by a retailer, and the only way to be sure of where it was made is to look for similarities with clarinets by major makers. I've no idea what it sounds like, but it may well be a decent instrument. Sorry I can't help you more, but someone here may recognize elements of the keywork that they've seen elsewhere. From the machining marks on the tenon I think it may be hard rubber rather than plastic. These were often metal-lined to provide strength and to prevent distortion.
Tony F.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2014-09-26 03:04
Another way to heat the clarinet without putting it near an open flame is simply to rub it vigorously against wool or cotton, e.g., pants or a shirtsleeve. If the instrument is rubber, the sulfur smell will be obvious. I've done this with mouthpieces in the past.
Best regards,
jnk
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: chris moffatt
Date: 2014-09-26 03:21
Well now - I believe, doubtless Chris P can confirm, that Malerne did produce a line with metal sleeving in the upper stack. And he was a great maker of stencils.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: nobregagui
Date: 2014-09-26 07:35
Thanks a lot for everything, Tony.
Barry, I'll try it. Thanks.
Thank you, Chris and Jack.
-Gui
Post Edited (2014-09-26 07:52)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2014-09-26 07:50
Gui. Lets us know how you go with the hot needle test.
Jack, no naked flame is used , just the heated point of a needle. Yes, I can imagine that friction such as rubbing vigorously with cotton material ect could bring out the odour of Ebonite. May not work with plastic though. Whatever type of test is used it's basically to determine if the Clarinet is made of plastic or Ebonite. If the distinctive odour of either of those substances is not detected one would assume that the instrument is actually made of some type of wood.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2014-09-26 11:52
Gui. All these materials have been used to make quality Clarinets. The most popular is wood , but Ebonite (Hard Rubber) is also excellent if the Clarinet has been made well. Even plastic Clarinets have improved greatly over the past twenty years or so.
Wood , usually some type of African blackwood (Ebony/Mpingo/Granadilla) is excellent but the downside is it can be unstable and develop cracks ect. But it's usually very attractive and even pleasing to hold a quality wooden Clarinet in your hands. Nice to own a top quality one if you can afford it.
Ebonite (highly vulcanised rubber) also makes for good Clarinets if they are made well with the added bonus that it's far more stable than wood and sound just as good as wood in my opinion. Just don't leave it out in the sun or in a hot car. Tom Ridenour's Lyrique is a good quality Ebonite Clarinet.
There are now some really good quality beginner Clarinets made of various types of Plastics. Yamaha , Jupiter, Schreiber & Vito are several makes just to name a few. They generally have a 'lighter' sound than the wood or Ebonite instruments but by putting a good quality mouthpiece on them will improve the sound a fair bit. Usually a better more full bodied sound than the molded plastic mouthpieces that usually come with them. Even adding a Ebonite barrel seems to improved the sound a bit more.
This is a popular topic on this forum. Do a search here in The Clarinet BB and you will find a wide range of opinions.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cyclopathic
Date: 2014-09-26 12:23
Tony F wrote:
> I'm intrigued by the metal-lined upper joint.
chris moffatt wrote:
> Well now - I believe, doubtless Chris P can confirm, that Malerne did produce a line
> with metal sleeving in the upper stack. And he was a great maker of stencils.
nobregagui wrote:
> The metal goes all the way down to the other end of the upper joint. It extends the whole length of the joint.
Another possibility is Pruefer "Silver Throat" which also had the metal liner through top joint. Silver Throats had hard rubber joints with upper joint drawn over cupronickel (also known as coin silver) liner. Later STs had bakelite bell and barrel.
Pruefer was perhaps the most stencilled US mfg; Silver Throats had been branded under at least dozen different names. Sherwood, Cleveland, Dupont, Belmont, Schmoller & Mueller..
What is the diameter of metal liner at the top joint?
What is the serial #?
Could you post the pic of speaker key/hole, close up of throat, side and bridge keys?
Edit:
a couple links:
http://www.clarinetpages.net/vintage-plastic-composite-clarinets/pruefer/prufer
http://www.clarinetperfection.com/clsnMalerne.htm
http://www.clarinetpages.net/vintage-plastic-composite-clarinets/la-monte
from a look of the G# and Eb keys it looks like Malerne.. so the top join should be 14.5mm not 14.8mm
Post Edited (2014-09-26 12:38)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: nobregagui
Date: 2014-09-27 03:40
Attachment: IMG_1651.JPG (452k)
Attachment: IMG_1650.JPG (376k)
Attachment: IMG_1649.JPG (477k)
Attachment: IMG_1648.JPG (986k)
Attachment: IMG_1647.JPG (954k)
Thanks, Barry.
Cyclo, I have attached some more pics.
I can't tell the diameter of the metal liner. There's a pic with my fingers so you can try to have an idea.
There's also a pic of the serial number, which is 15483.
Thanks a lot,
-Gui
-Gui
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cyclopathic
Date: 2014-09-27 19:07
It is definitely not Pruefer. And it does look like Malerne, though not 100% sure
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2014-09-27 20:37
Often the give-away of a Malerne stencil is that the pad cup directly below the centre join is tilted upwards at a slight angle. I don't see that here. I've seen a Martin Bb with a lined top joint.
Tony F.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cyclopathic
Date: 2014-09-28 22:29
Tony you might be right it's not Malerne. Though IMHO that bend does not mean much: have L45A somewhere with similar bend on pad above break. Key was lifted off Vito and it had to be bend it to fit. Not sure why Malernes would do it at factory, perhaps they moved tonehole and decided it wasn't worth changing key jig?
The give away for Pruefer the throat G# (and similar keys) one piece go over design. Pruefer stenciled alot for just about anyone, until they could no longer compete with orient. I have seen a silver lined HR Cleveland (King) which was obviously a Pruefer (serial #s, keys, etc everything checks 100%). Perhaps the lined Martin you saw was also a Pruefer? good chance if it is from RMC era.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2014-09-28 22:57
I too had a Hard Rubber Martin Frères with a metal lined upper joint.
--
Ben
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony F
Date: 2014-09-29 06:46
I'm inclined to think that the Dexter wasn't a Malerne stencil, but came from another manufacturer. Couesnon did stencils, anyone have views on this as a possibility?
Tony F.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cyclopathic
Date: 2014-09-29 17:28
Thibouville?
did they make any HR silver lined ones? They did mark serial #s at the top of the joint, didn't they?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Matt Locker
Date: 2014-10-01 00:00
I had a hard rubber Buffet when I first got back into playing. It also had a metal lined upper joint, I think copper. It actually played quite nicely I thought.
MOO,
Matt
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
