 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: cxl
Date: 2014-07-01 12:44
VANDOREN MP,5RV and 5RVL,which one's timber is more darker??
les.cxl@gmail.com
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-07-01 13:19
Gosh I don't believe it works that way. The 5RV Lyre is a more standard facing; I think more players use this one more successfully. But your sound is going to come from using your air column efficiently - PUSH from the core (abdominals); use a "natural" tongue position (or position as you would to say the sound "EEEE", NOT "Ahhhhh") and tongue tip of the tongue to the tip of the reed.
Anyone and EVERYONE should be able to get a big resonant sound - that part is easy (academic) to learn; easy to execute (with a little effort that is).
............Paul Aviles
P.S. I just caught the thread where you posted the question first. I'd like to respond to that as well. You can achieve "the sound you want" from almost any mouthpiece. As you match reed strength to the facing you have, you can pretty much get the same overall level of effort out all those mouthpieces. There are trade offs of course. One might argue that it is easier to get a focused, even timbre throughout all the registers with a facing like the 5RV Lyre as opposed to a B45. Or you may feel you can get a wider range of colors out of a B45 than a smaller the smaller facing of a 5RV Lyre. But if you are looking specifically at on mouthpiece over another of very similar facing dimensions (5RV to a 5RV Lyre) the difference comes down strictly to comfort for the way YOU play (5RV =take in less mouthpiece into mouth; 5RV Lyre = take in slightly more mouthpiece into mouth)......but I'd still go with the Lyre, all things being equal.
Post Edited (2014-07-01 13:33)
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Author: as9934
Date: 2014-07-01 19:33
You also have to take into consideration the profile of the mouthpiece as both of these are offered as standard or profile 88 (sharper beak more geared towards american). You should also consider the reed, ligature,barrel and clarinet. Perhaps you could provide us with those? If I had to make an anwser I would say that the 5rv lyre may be slightly darker because it is a slightly longer lay. Although this is a great mouthpiece (I use it myself) I encourage you to try others in this price range such as the rico reserve x10 and the fobes debut. If really want a dark, open sound a b45 is best because it has a very large chamber that really fills up the horn.
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill Wind Ensemble
Buffet E11 clarinet , Vandoren Masters CL6 13 series mouthpiece w/ Pewter M/O Ligature, Vandoren V12 3.5
Yamaha 200ad clarinet, Vandoren B45 mouthpiece, Rovner ligature
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Author: Bruno
Date: 2014-07-01 23:04
That's right, Jack. I too think that they are black. And that's about as dark as it can get, right? I make a point of buying black mouthpieces. Other colors are just not dark enough.
bruno>
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Author: Bruno
Date: 2014-07-01 23:39
On a more serious note, I don't like profile 88 mouthpieces. IMO, Vandoren only offers them to increase sales. I can't see where they provide any benefit to anyone besides Vandoren.
It seems important to me to have the largest oral cavity possible, and reducing the jaw opening even a trifle is not helpful.
bruno>
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2014-07-02 02:19
The 88 profile can make taking more mouthpiece more comfortable for some players. But then, why else would any company market anything but to increase sales and make more money? Many players, apparently, don't share your opinion (which should be perfectly OK).
That's also why Vandoren markets everything from an M13 to B45. Different strokes...
Karl
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-07-02 10:19
Bruno,
I realize that there are some that make an issue about "oral cavity size" or "shape" as a determining factor to sound, but in the straight forward French/American school of thought, I would say not. The reed/mouthpiece system is the point where the INITIAL tone production happens. To get this system to operate optimally, it is necessary to deliver AIR to that point. The air needs to be swift moving and/or pressurized. So size of the oral cavity with that idea in mind is irrelevant.
I would say also that exponents of the 'oral cavity importance' tend toward placing their tongue as if they are making the sound "AHHHH." This has the adverse effect (since the back of the tongue begins to block the top of the throat) of restricting the flow of air and actually making it harder to produce good sound. This is why John Yeh used to say "open throat is closed throat."
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-07-02 15:43
I prefer the thinner beak of the Profile 88 as that allows the clarinet to be held up higher more comfortably for me compared to their thicker standard beak.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Bruno
Date: 2014-07-02 17:44
Paul,
Although set-up should be a first consideration, I personally never think about the size or shape of my oral cavity, nor do I think about air or tongue position. I concentrate fully on sound and always have. I let my body and my subconscious do what they have to do to develop the sound I want, and I try not to interfere.
Brass players call it 'bel canto' playing. It is a great way to remove impediments that many students are burdened with by their teachers and themselves. I'm a firm believer. It's worked for me for thirty ++ years. Too much concentrating on mechanics is a hinderance to a beautiful sound, AFAIK.
And as far as the profile 88 is concerned, I've never thought that comfort should ever be a consideration in playing a horn.
B>
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