 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Funfly
Date: 2014-04-29 03:24
This might sound a dumb question but here goes…
Can you tell me why the clarinet family goes up an octave and a half when the sax family goes up in octaves?
Martyn Thatcher Mature Student Cheshire U.K.
Clarinet - Yamaha SE Custom
Alto Sax - Yamaha YAS 480
Guitar - Yamaha FG 375-S
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Author: Katrina
Date: 2014-04-29 03:28
Physics. Because it's a cylindrical single-reed instead of a conical single-reed. I don't remember why that makes it go up a twelfth, however. The only physics class I ever took was a Physics of Music class in undergrad.
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Author: alto gether
Date: 2014-04-29 10:19
Air in a cylinder closed at one end vibrates with a node at the closed end and an antinode at the open end, so it can vibrate as 1/4, 3/4, 5/4 . . . of a wave.
Therefore the second register is 3x the frequency = a twelfth above the first.
In a conical pipe, antinode at each end gives 1/2, 1, 3/2 . . . waves and the second register is 2x = an octave above the first. This is also the reason a clarinet is about an octave lower than an oboe or sax of the same length.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2014-04-29 10:24
>> Can you tell me why the clarinet family goes up an octave and a half when the sax family goes up in octaves? <<
It's in their genes
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Author: Funfly
Date: 2014-04-29 13:18
Just to clarify this...
By conical do you mean across it's length, so a 'tube' will blow an octave and a half whereas a cone will blow an octave?
Martyn Thatcher Mature Student Cheshire U.K.
Clarinet - Yamaha SE Custom
Alto Sax - Yamaha YAS 480
Guitar - Yamaha FG 375-S
Post Edited (2014-04-29 13:21)
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2014-04-29 14:06
That's not right. How can there be an antinode at the mouthpiece end of a cone? There's nowhere for the air to go. Zero air motion = max pressure. It has to be a node.
Here's a good explanation: http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/pipes.html
alto gether wrote:
> Air in a cylinder closed at one end vibrates with a node at the
> closed end and an antinode at the open end, so it can vibrate
> as 1/4, 3/4, 5/4 . . . of a wave.
> Therefore the second register is 3x the frequency = a twelfth
> above the first.
> In a conical pipe, antinode at each end gives 1/2, 1, 3/2 . . .
> waves and the second register is 2x = an octave above the
> first. This is also the reason a clarinet is about an octave
> lower than an oboe or sax of the same length.
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2014-04-29 16:15
Acoustically the clarinet behaves as a cylinder closed at one end. A flute behaves like a cylinder open at both ends and sax and oboe behave as a cone closed at one end.
A closed end cylinder is missing the even harmonics, including the octave. When you pull the energy out of the fundamental the twelfth gets reinforced instead of the octave.
Clarinets add the throat keys to fill in the space till the next register.
Other related differences include being able to play lower with the same length of instrument. And going up a twelfth gives us a greater range of frequencies.
Also, our fundamental is relatively strong compared to the sax and flute. It is easy for us to play down low. Sax and flute like to jump up to the octave if they have the slightest leak.
For fun, if you have a flute head joint, play it without the rest of the flute attached. The cover up the end. The note will jump down an octave.
Steve Ocone
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Author: BobD
Date: 2014-04-29 17:14
OK, but why do cylinders and cones behave differently?
Bob Draznik
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Author: Funfly
Date: 2014-04-29 19:04
As I understand it recorders go up in octaves and they are cylinders closed at one end just like a clarinet.
Tell me if I am wrong about recorders, I haven't played one for over 60 years!
Martyn Thatcher Mature Student Cheshire U.K.
Clarinet - Yamaha SE Custom
Alto Sax - Yamaha YAS 480
Guitar - Yamaha FG 375-S
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Author: BobD
Date: 2014-04-29 20:04
Ah, Mart, isn't the recorder open at both ends?
Bob Draznik
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2014-04-29 20:05
Recorder counts as open because of the hole where the fipple is.
Funfly wrote:
> As I understand it recorders go up in octaves and they are
> cylinders closed at one end just like a clarinet.
> Tell me if I am wrong about recorders, I haven't played one for
> over 60 years!
>
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2014-04-29 20:07
http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/pipes.html
BobD wrote:
> OK, but why do cylinders and cones behave differently?
>
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Author: BobD
Date: 2014-04-29 21:20
Thanks Dibbs, that's as good an explanation as I've seen........
Bob Draznik
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2014-04-29 22:56
Note to Dibbs - there is probably confusion of terminolgy as in an air column there are 2 different types of nodes and antinodes, pressure and motion, and these 2 types are always 180 degrees out of sync so a pressure node is also a motion antinode.
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