 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Clarijan
Date: 2014-03-12 19:34
My local music store has come across a Buffet R13 that was leftover inventory of another music store that closed long ago and was never purchased, making it essentially a new horn. I have verified by the serial number that it was manufactured in 1970. I am looking for any comments on the advisability of purchasing this instrument. The instrument is in great shape. The wood is very tightly grained and has no cracks probably due to the fact that it was it was stored in a damp basement with consistent temps. The case was destroyed as it was covered in mold but the instrument pieces were wrapped in plastic and weed not moldy. Pads are in great shape and the instrument needed only a bit of adjusting for sluggish key action. The sound is fabulous but a bit resistant. I have done little investigating of new instruments in the last few years and so don't really know how this instrument would compare to what Buffet produces today. I know there are those who believe that today's Buffets don't compare favorably to those made at the time this instrument was made. Any thoughts on this unusual opportunity? Any thoughts on a reasonable price for it?
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2014-03-12 16:00
If the price is right and it plays OK for you, then I'd buy it. Quality, particularly wood quality, was much better then than now. The sluggish keys probably indicate the need for a service, so factor that cost in. The resistance may just be the mouthpiece you tested it with, so if you can try it with other mouthpieces. It's probably something you could learn to live with, anyway.
Tony F.
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Author: Bruno
Date: 2014-03-12 20:07
Grab it! I play an R13 from the same period and they're great! The resistance you feel can be modified with the right MP.
You may not ever get another chance at such a great axe.
bruno>
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Author: ramsa
Date: 2014-03-12 20:40
I'd like to know what a new old stock Buffet like that actually sells for...
Sounds like something I would do in a heartbeat, if the money was right.
Can you say without breaking any rules here?
Just wondering...
This is a genuine signature.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2014-03-12 20:52
R13s from that period varied tremendously, and maybe half had uncorrectable intonation problems. Check the intonation with extreme care, having a friend watch an electronic tuner so you can't see and adjust.
Buffet barrels at that time were cylindrical. A reverse-tapered barrel (Moennig, Chadash) can help intonation and response a lot.
Buffet altered the position of the register vent around that time, raising it enough to correct most of the original R13's intonation mismatch between the chalumeau and clarion registers.
Buffet stock mouthpieces at that time were unplayable and had tremendous resistance. Check with your familiar mouthpiece.
The sluggish key action can usually be fixed with small drops of key oil applied to the points where the keys meet their screws or rods. If it's a vertical rod that's sticking (left low F, the ring keys) this is due to wood shrinkage. It should abate as the wood absorbs moisture from playing. If not, it's a fairly easy fix for a competent repairman.
I wouldn't pay the new Buffet price. First, there could be small cracks. Second, the seller has little or no capital investment to recover. I'd offer $2000 and be prepared to pay somewhat more.
Good luck.
Ken Shaw
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2014-03-12 18:48
Fascinating story no matter what the outcome.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: rmk54
Date: 2014-03-12 23:12
Remember that in 1970 this instrument would have cost about $300 new. That's equivalent to about $1900 today.
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Author: ThatPerfectReed
Date: 2014-03-12 21:12
Clarijan--what is your motivation for its purchase?
Are you looking for a clarinet to play and hold or do you have thoughts of selling it in the short term at market, perhaps having invested some $ in it that it's final sale price will justify, allowing you to still clear a profit?
Either is fine by me and you goals may be a combination of the two (e.g. Sale in 10 tears ).
I play an r13 from slightly earlier and love it. But it's been maintained since purchase. It was a good time for grenadilla as sure as some of the line at the time had intonation problems.
Bottom line...forget its pedigree for a moment. What do you and others in the know think of its play? What does a competent repair tech think needs to be done to it, if anything and at what cost?
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Author: Wes
Date: 2014-03-12 22:59
In about 1990, I bought a new old stock 1971 Buffet in a attache case for about $950 from a store. It has a fine sound but was a little flat, requiring a 64 mm barrel to get up to pitch. As I played it for a few years, the pitch rose a bit and a 65 mm barrel was ok. The original 66 mm barrel is still too long. A 65 mm Chadash barrel sounds great on it, brightening it a bit and helping the left hand clarion notes from being too high in pitch. I replaced the original pads soon after I got it, thinking that they looked like single skin pads, and that made it play better.
One could assume that laying around all those years may have allowed the wood to expand causing the bore to contract slightly, making it flatter. I've heard of other Buffets of this vintage being a little flat.
Buy it if you can!
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Author: Clarijan
Date: 2014-03-16 06:38
Thank you to everyone for your thoughts. To answer a couple questions, I'm working on the premise that I would use this as my primary horn. I haven't gotten a firm price on it from the dealer yet, but he quoted around $1000. (There's an employee discount involved since a family member works at the store and it doesn't have a case.) I've played on it quite a bit since my original post with many different mouthpieces including a Kasper, several Johnstons and an M13 Lyre and the best response has been with the Lomax Prelude, although its a bit on the bright side (I'm chalking that up to the fact that it isn't a rubber mouthpiece) and a Zinner blank customized by my repairman. Its pitch is really great. Doesn't seem to have problems with the 12ths. The B above the staff is noticeably high, but I think that lowering the pad just below it would take care of a lot of that. So it looks to me to be a no brainer! I think it's a great horn!
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