 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-03 15:31
Hallo
This is my first "topic" here and it is about an old. old clarinet. Perhaps from 1860 or around....
Here is a link: http://www.vernissage.nu/old_clarinet3.jpg
And I try to attach... :
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-03 16:05
Hallo again
I did not make it...
Can I ask You about a bell? Now I am making one in brass(?) and one in Wood,
but can I put an extra hole like Fobes extension, for now the bell in Wood is
so long so it is possible...Then the form of this bell do not matter so much...
About a bell in brass I have not seen one but other ....A brass bell will look nice I Think(?)
The moutpice is difficult the bore is 13 mm, so I will start(?) with a Eb mouthpiece i think.. (I will order one from China)
The brassrings are ready but the bras was thin so I made them double...
It is perhaps a C clarinet and kind of anachronistic with only 5 keys...
How far from the last keyhole at the end of the clarinet should I make
the "open hole" in the Wood bell?
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
Post Edited (2014-03-05 13:28)
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2014-03-03 17:49
I'd measure the distance from the left index finger hole to the right ring finger hole and compare it with a "normal" contemporary Bb clarinet; this should give you a rough estimate on its pitch.
Per the bell - see if you can find a cheap plastic one from a Bb, just to experiment with the placement of the hole (if any).
Good luck - looks like a "project" you got there... :-)
--
Ben
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-03-03 13:47
I give up. How do you play a throat Ab/G# on these?
............Paul Aviles
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-03 13:54
Hallo
Thank You a good idea...
Have you read the book "Horn, strings and harmony" A. H.Benade ?
He wrote about tubes with "open holes"...maybe any plastic tube will fit...
Perhaps if I buy one meter and cut it in 18 cm pieces and start making holes in
diffrent distances and diffrent sizes to....
Yes I have a old Couesnon to compare with...
Have you seen a clarinet wth a brass bell?
Tank you again
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2014-03-03 13:59
Paul,
Usually just the speaker key alone or the A key plus thumb and/or L1.
Post Edited (2014-03-03 14:00)
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-03 19:04
Hallo Paul Aviles
Well I am not there...I don´t have a mouthpiece yet...
I have an old unused SML but wont start making it fit...
The bore is 13 mm, so when I get(?) one Eb mouthpiece from China I will start.
I have a fingering list for 5 keys clarinet...hum...
So it will take a time befor I play Wildcats blues
I used to play trad. in Gothenborg in the 60-
Best regads
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
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Author: MichaelW
Date: 2014-03-03 15:23
This is a very basic 5 key instrument, but judging from key shape and construction certainly not from the pre- Iwan Müller era when 5 to 8 key clarinets were standard. Your JPEG picture shows a length of 43 cm between top of upper and lower end of lower joint minus tenon. That would be the size of a (German) Bb instrument. The missing insert for R5 must have looked similar to the carved finger hole “chimney” on the attached foto. I have a plastic bell of an old Meinel Bb clarinet, dimensions see foto, which I would gladly send you if you could use it.
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Author: MichaelW
Date: 2014-03-03 20:30
Attachment: Bell.jpg (143k)
Attachment: R5.jpg (170k)
Sorry, the system didn't accept the photos. The bell socket has an outer diameter of 33 and an inner diameter of 27 mm. I try again:
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-03 23:28
Hallo
Thank You, thank You...
It is a very slim clarinet so a bell should be only around 28 mm outside and 22-23 inside where one put it together ...bore is just 13 mm
You have a nice Picture of the little “chimney”, yes I made one in black carrubber to start with...later in rosewood perhaps.
I think the clarinet is short(43 cm) my Couesnon is 50,5 cm(without bell and mouthpiece)
I think of making an extra open hole in a little longer bell. I think the form then does not matter so much.
Otherwise a brass bell could look nice(?) But I must have a mouthpiece first.
A slim small mouthpiece
Thank you again
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
Post Edited (2014-03-05 18:30)
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-05 14:05
Hallo again.
Can I ask You about clarinet mouthpieces?
As the old clarinet is so small and slim it will be so much work to try to make a Bb mouthpiece to fit, would it be all wrong to start with a Eb piece, which can be smaller from start?
I Think the clarinet is a C clarinet and I Think a modern c-mouthpiece is almost the same size as Bb...
I have been looking at Fobes "extra hole extensions" to make a bell in Wood that has not a typical form but a "all open hole" instead?
here is a Picturelink : http://www.vernissage.nu/old_clarinet5b.jpg
But were? I wrote before, to start just with plastic tubes and to start making holes.
But perhaps it will be easier when I get the mouthpiece from China an Eb.
Best regards
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
Post Edited (2014-03-05 18:27)
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-06 13:05
Hallo
Can I ask you about the extra "open hole" in a long homemade wooden bell.
In the book "Horn, strings and harmony" A. H.Benade, he writes about the dimensions of a "open hole".
Can it be possible to make a hole, at a distance in what could be right compared with a Bb clarinet and then making it larger untill the tune/it sounds right? If my old clarinet "is" a c-clarinet?
A H Benade ment that a larger hole needs a shorter(or a longer?) tube?
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-07 07:00
Hallo Ben.
Am I right you are writing from Switzerland?
My old clarinet, a flee-Market-finding, has a history. It came with old grandfather Dormond from Switzerland and I got it from little-girl Stephanie Dormond...in a fleemarket in Stockholm the "Slakthusområdet"
I have a link two clarinets to compare : http://www.vernissage.nu/old_clarinet6b.jpg
In this Picture the old clarinet has a brass bell....well I think this looks nice, but as I wrote before I am working on one in Wood...(see link .....old_clarinet5b.jpg)
How is the relation large bore(15 mm) or a small bore(13 mm) to the length of the same tune?
Best regards
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
Post Edited (2014-03-07 12:21)
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-18 11:33
Hallo again.
Now I got the mouthpiece, a Eb one. It is nice(?) from China....
The bore is about 14 mm and it fits in the barrel(yes!).
Now about the pitch, it sounds... the low E sounds like my Bb Couesnon´s low F (what would it actually be...now?)
If the clarinet is a C-clarinet it should have sound a real low E...hum...
I am aware of that the mouthpice bore is to large and the length of it is too short. The length of Eb is 62,5 mm compared with my SML 72 mm (without the tenons).
My brass bell gives nice low notes and my wood bell works too (without extra hole).
However I can feel a "resistance" in the "throat tones"(?)...
Can it be the mouthpice? Is the chamber too big?
Best regards
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
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Author: Staffan
Date: 2014-03-18 12:06
Hallo.
I have been thinking(?)
If the clarinet low E sounds like a Bb-clarinet´s low F, that actually is a low Eb, the old clarinet is too low...(hum)...than the mouthpice is not too short but has a too big chamber???? Is it so?
In the book of Arthur Benade he writes about putting a rod of 6 mm diameter inside the mouthpice?
The triad(?) of F-A-C-F sounds not too bad ....lower....
Staffan
Senior photographer in Stockholm.
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