 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Ravi2000
Date: 2014-01-25 05:25
I use Vandoren V12 #3 reeds. I brought a box of ten today and am currently testing them all out for an audition I have tomorrow.
The problem isn't the reeds, I was just wondering if anyone has a suggestion on how I should use them. I wasn't going to use the same reed for warming up and the audition, but correct me if I'm wrong.
So, is there an order I should use them? The pack of ten I brought has a lot of different variations, even though they're all #3. Some are harder to play than others, of course.
Should I warm up for the good 30 minutes beforehand on a harder reed, and switch to one of the softer ones for the audition itself? This was just an idea, but does anyone have a system they find best?
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2014-01-25 06:26
Hi Ravi,
I think that you should order the reeds from lightest to stiffest, setting aside all the ones that don't play well off the bat.
I would find no advantage in warming up on a stiffer reed and then switching to a lighter reed.
In the long run I would suggest that you search the BB on the topics of "reed curing" or "reed preparation" and begin using a method of breaking-in the reeds long before they are needed. Once you're accustomed to the advantages of a reed preparation process I don't think you'll consider playing new reeds in a performance situation UNLESS you have no choice.
Best of luck on your audition tomorrow!
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-01-25 07:18
You won't like my suggestion, but here it is.
Firstly, if you are opening a box for the first time, it will be about four days before you should use any of them for more than 5 or 10 minutes a piece. I find that a good breaking-in period is the only way (for me) to guarantee that a reed won't become water logged (get dark colored and start playing all "thuddy") and then never come back to playability.
The other thing about the variability of a box of reeds is that you should simply put them in order of playability. I can get about 4 or 5 concert capable reeds out of a box. The next three or so can get by in the practice room and perhaps the last one or two will never be playable................and those are about the best numbers you can hope for.
If a majority of reeds in a box are too stiff for you, you need a softer strength reed. If a majority of reeds in the box are too soft for you, you need a harder strength reed. PERIOD.
.........................Paul Aviles
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Author: ThatPerfectReed
Date: 2014-01-25 08:03
Hi Ravi:
Yeah, sigh, I'm with Paul on this one. New reeds aren't played so much as broken in. Mark Nuccio of the NY Philharmonic shares this mindset in some interesting Youtube videos that I've linked below.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=rico+reeds+mark+nuccio&sm=3
That said, an emergency suggestion.
I've read that stroking a previously wet reed with a moist finger, from the middle to the tip, helps close pores and "seal" the read, making it less prone to water logging.
Good luck on your audition.
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Author: muppie
Date: 2014-01-25 08:11
Does anyone use the ATG system for reed finishing? Will the reeds still require breaking in even with the ATG system?
I am also curious about synthetic reeds because I read that they are instantly playable without requiring a break in period. I also read about Legere's generous free swapping policy, but living in Australia, it's not very practical (cheap / quick) to be sending a reed back to Canada/USA.
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2014-01-25 09:02
I live in Australia and play Legere reeds. When I bought my first reed, from Brass and Woodwind, Ormond, Melbourne. I got a reed that was too hard. They were perfectly happy to swap it in accordance with Legere's policy. This was several years back, so I can't say with certainty that they still would. I've found Legere to be very good people to deal with.
Tony F.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2014-01-25 04:38
I'm of a different mind than most folks. I simply open a box, and play the reeds. I don't adjust them anymore. After doing this for a while, I feel now that I can pretty much play any reed out of the box. That doesn't mean I don't see some as better than others, but I just rotate them and practice.
For the day of a performance, I will simply go through reeds till I feel a pretty good one. That's the reed I use. It might be the same one that worked for me yesterday, it might not be due to changes in temperature or humidity or whatever from day to day. But I'm sick and tired of messing with reeds, perfecting them, only to have the humidity change or some other factor and it affecting my once "perfect" reed.
For your audition, I'd open up reeds till I find one that works. I would use that for practicing. I would THEN open up reeds to find another one that works and use THAT one for the audition, but do NOT spend a lot of time warming up on that reed. Brand new, these reeds will go dead on you after about 45 mins to an hour. After a few rotations, they'll be broken in, but a fresh reed I wouldn't expect to last more than an hour.
And for the record, you break in reeds however you want, or don't. There's no right or wrong. No one will ever hear you play and pick out how you broke in or neglected to break in a reed. All that matters is the sound at the end of your horn, and how much you have to fight your setup to get that sound (hopefully it's not a lot).
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Wes
Date: 2014-01-25 05:36
Also a user of V12 #3 reeds, I wet,sand, and dry them for about 3 or 4 days until the raised grain is gone before I play on any of them. Then I try each one for strength and playability, sanding down those that need it, trying to make them all good reeds. If the low notes are fuzzy, I sand the back up to the bark, but mostly I sand near the tip if the reed is generally still too hard. Good luck!
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Author: jonok
Date: 2014-01-25 12:12
Muppie,
I use ATG - as a result I get 10 good playable reeds out of a box. Some are better than others of course, but all are playable.
I also break in new reeds (once they've been corrected if necessary) ... playing a new reed for 5ish mins a day for about 4 days. Then they go into the rotation of 4 - 6 reeds. I don't definitively know if this makes them last longer, but some swear it does, so I decided it's no great burden to do this, so I do.
But there are no requirements - just what you decide you'll do.
Every now and then you pull out a reed that is just magic. That's a good day - unfortunately it's matched by the day you cry when it gives up.
-------------------
aspiring fanatic
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Author: Bruno
Date: 2014-01-25 21:29
I've seen players soak their reeds in a glass of water. There's a nice lady (a bit talkative) who presents very helpful videos on YouTube, and one of her presentations was about flattening out warped reeds. She held one up and I could actually see the distortion in the bottom of the reed.
Her reeds are warped because she soaks them in a glass of water. If you wet your reed(s) in your mouth they generally don't warp (P.S. I've NEVER had a warped reed!), and saliva is a lot "wetter" than plain tap water and your mouth is warm, so it works better and quicker. Further, it only wets the business end* so the reed doesn't get saturated. The moist warmth of your sub-lingual fossa is perfect.
As they say in Brooklyn, 'try it, you'll like it.'
*When reeds are partially immersed in water for a few minutes, the micro-tubules transport water throughout the entire reed by capillary attraction. This doesn't happen when the end of the reed is moisturized in your mouth for the time it takes to do it.
B.
Post Edited (2014-01-25 16:32)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2014-01-25 21:54
Bruno,
You are absolutely correct concerning the capillary attraction that allows water to soak throughout the reed. This is exactly why I soak my reeds (butt end and all). This gives the reed (in my opinion) some protection against the digestive qualities of saliva.
I find that once a reed has gotten used to being played, all things sort of even out and from that point out it doesn't matter too much how you start them off that particular session. But the first four days or so work best for me with water first, and only short duration (5 minutes usu.) of play.
....................Paul Aviles
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Author: ThatPerfectReed
Date: 2014-01-25 22:25
(Joke)
What I can't understand--maybe some fellow clarinetists can agree with me here--is why reeds are sold with this top tapered half.
The second (and I do mean THE SECOND) I take a new one out of the box, without a moment's hesitation, I use my hand saw to chop off this aforementioned funny looking tapered half and stick it in the fireplace.
Afterwards I'm left with this thick, shiny and "smooth on one side" piece of wood that the second I stick on my mouthpiece, consistently, and for years on end, from one reed to the next (provided of course I use this method), delivers consistently reliable results, even on some of most challenging piece in the clarinet repertoire.
I don't have to soak it, work it in, sand it, or even keep it in a humdity controlled environment. Heck, you can even stick one of those "bad boys" in the oven and its performance is unaffected. Not once have I ever squeaked ** had inconsistent results with articulation, or failed to disappoint.
** of course squeaking is predicated on one's ability to first make sound!!
![[happy]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smiley12.gif)
I'm thinking about releasing it as a competitor product to Tom Ridenour's Against the Grain (ATG) system, called ETG: which of course stands for Eliminate the Grain.
"If there ain't no grain, there ain't nothing to fix." Catchy slogan, eh?
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Author: ThatPerfectReed
Date: 2014-01-25 23:08
Ok--now for the wisdom, or at least I hope, compared to my joking post.
It's all about getting the most good reeds in the least amount of time, to facilitate the ultimate goal: good performance, itself eminating from good practice.
Like sfalexi, I've broken with my discipline and taken that amazing right out of the box reed and played it too much too fast--and because it was an amazing reed, it was fine: so I can entirely relate to his philosophy here about overdoing reed nuturing. But I've probably also ruined good reeds doing this.
Still more, even if I completely disagreed with him on reed preparation, I would be entirely on board with his notions of finding that balance between settling for the 95% reed, and making up for the difference in playing proficiency.
And yet, for me, I've produced the most number of good long lasting reeds using Paul's approach--and this is all a number's game.
The ATG system is as wondeful, IMHO, as it is not the holy grail of reed nirvana. Nothing out there is the holy grail of reed making/finishing. Two reeds cut from adjacent stock, down to microns of accuracy, can produce different outcomes. Like all (once) living things, cane has variety (due to genetic and environmental causes), even within a single reed, so as to present to nature different options for the most suitable candidate for the environment, and survival into the next generation. This isn't even to mention the differences that each reed can produce from exposure to different humidty, saliva, embouchure's, mouthpieces, etc.
I've found Vandoren V12's and Rico Reserves to produce the best reeds for greatness, and yet my best reeds were Oliveris. Remember, it's a number's game that's about what works best for you over the long run.
Synthetic reeds are great. They're consistent and let players spend more time practicing than preparing reeds (a good thing). I feel they aren't as good as the best cane yet, but like I've implied, the best cane is ellusive.
My favorite synthetics are Forestones. You and others may love another brand, discussion of which fills this board's archives.
Finally, some day when we produce the finest synthetics, they too will perform worse over time, as all moving parts are subject to wear and tear.
It's not until invention of the time machine that (presumably) follows that the perfect (synthetic) reed will be able to be perfect indefinitely.
Those out there who speak of their near 100% success rates at any particular technique of reed creation/adjustment are lying: maybe to themselves. In a best case scenario their standards for an acceptable reed fall way short; in a worse case scenario they're snake oil salepeople.
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