 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Genevieve
Date: 2013-09-15 20:58
Hey guys, new user here.
I've been really working to try and improve my tone on the clarinet, something that my past teachers have never really emphasized. I'm having the most trouble forming the right embouchure to get to the sound I want.
My oral cavity is rather odd. I have a low palate, soft palate leak, and my jaw is naturally crooked so that my upper and lower teeth do not line up properly (this is something that even braces didn't help). Also, the space between my nose and my upper lip is slightly smaller than the length of the tip of my finger to the first joint (on x-rays, you can see where the roots of my upper teeth run almost directly into the bones in my nasal cavity). There are certain things I can't physically do as a result.
I currently play on a used Buffet e-11 that I bought my junior year of high school and on Vandoren v-12's, size 3. I plan on purchasing my first r-13 sometime this fall and am wondering how big of a difference it will make in my tone quality. Is it also possible that my physiological make-up will make it extremely hard if not impossible to get that beautiful tone I want? It seems like no matter how many long tones or different embouchure positions I try I can't seem to get a better tone and I'm getting very discouraged.
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2013-09-15 21:45
In my view only an experienced teacher who can physically look at your specific conditions can really help you to maximise your results on this.
You don't say what mouthpiece you are using. This is perhaps the most vital part of your setup and a good (and suitable for you) mouthpiece can help greatly. The mouthpieces shipped with the E11 are pretty naff.
Why are you set on an R13? There are many other clarinets available that are every bit as good or better. You can only tell what works best for you by trying several different makes and models.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-09-15 22:17
Genevieve -
You more than anyone know that anatomy is destiny. However, many fine clarinetists have anatomical oddities. Steve Girko, a truly amazing player, has a crooked lower jaw and rotates his mouthpiece well to the side to match. Bernard Portnoy, the principal in Philadelphia, had a very short jaw and adjusted by holding his clarinet absolutely vertical. Nothing is wrong in and of itself. You do what works.
Your soft palate leak can cause trouble. You should talk to your dentist and ENT physician about exercises and possible prostheses to deal with the problem. You should definitely ask for a reference to a practitioner who has experience in helping wind players.
I have a short upper lip, too. Just tuck it in tight and neat against your upper teeth.
The closer to your face something is, the more difference it makes. A new reed makes more difference than a new clarinet. After the reed come the mouthpiece and barrel. An R13 will sound and feel great, but a handmade mouthpiece and matching barrel, for around $500, will put your E11 almost at that level.
For your lower lip, learn to point your chin, drawing the tip down to make the skin tight between the tip and your lower lip. Only about half of the red part of your lower lip should be over your teeth. Then put your lower lip on the reed so that the teeth are exactly beneath the spot that the reed separates from the lay. (Mark it lightly on the reed with a pencil.) Then put your upper teeth on the mouthpiece, tuck in your upper lip and bring the corners of your mouth in to seal, making just a little of an "aardvark face."
Take a good breath and take a good but not enormous breath. Then blow a lot of air to make the tone, not biting and sending the air all the way through.
Above all, what makes the difference is YOU. Open your mouth, shine a flashlight into it and look in a mirror. Then yawn. Your soft palate and uvula will rise. Relax and snore. Your soft palate and uvula will descend. When you have memorized how this feels, play your clarinet and yawn and snore. You won't use either extreme, but it helps to know what they feel like.
Then use the flashlight and mirror to learn how your tongue feels in different positions. Usually, you'll want the back of your tongue high, with a "ski-jump" contour down to the tip and a little lift at the end. This focuses the air stream and lets you tongue with minimum movement and effort.
But, once again, the important part is you. You need to learn to make many possible sounds, not just one. Read the great Robert Bloom article at http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=94788&t=94788
To make many beautiful tones, you must also be able to make many ugly tones. Work on them all. Snarl like a buzz-saw. Roar like a lion. Howl like a wolf. An awful squeak has the high frequencies you also use to give energy and "ping" to your tone.
Then go to the other end. Croon like a mother comforting her baby. Hum along with My Country 'Tis of Thee and Silent Night.
The sounds you can make are limited only by your imagination. That's what you want to stretch and exercise.
So, maybe too much information. Do it a bit at a time, and always look for something new to add.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2013-09-16 00:29
I have to go with Norman here as far as the mouthpiece. A good player will get a better tone with the proper moutpiece for themselvea, the right fit, with a Bundy than with a professional clarinet and a mouthpiece that doesn't fit the player properly. Of course having a knowledgeable teacher is always the best way to go but it need to be someone that is willing to experiment with different mouthpieces and different playing positions as far as tone goes. I would suggest the first thing you do is to try as many mouthpieces as you can and a few different reed strengths to find the best fit for you. Remember, one type of mouthpiece will require a softer or harder reed than another. Once you find the best mouthpiece as possible experiment with different embouchure positions, angles and tongue positions. You have to find the right way to play for you and you are the best one to find out what that is.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Genevieve
Date: 2013-09-16 03:19
Hi Norman and Ed, thanks for your input. Last fall I upgraded from my Vandoren M13 (which I had played on since 7th grade and was rather worn out) to an M30 and replaced my Bonade ligature with a Rovner Versa. Those alone made a huge difference in my tone. I still play on a Yamaha barrel that has been adjusted, but it is consistently out of tune. :(
As for why I'm set on an r-13 or similar model, my teacher did try my clarinet out several times during the semester when problems came up. She was able to somewhat conclude that it had not been very well taken care of by the previous owner and was "blown out". Not only that, but since I have owned it it has cracked twice: once above the A key and the second time behind the register key and through the tone hole. There are also a few other issues, such as tight springs on the pinkie keys which doesn't help me technically as I'm double jointed in my pinkies and thumbs. I tried an r-13 and it made playing so much easier for my physical oddities, which is why I'm looking at purchasing one .
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-09-16 17:12
For me, the most important element to getting a full sound is using air properly.
To this end you need to focus your air as much as possible up front (and this should not necessarily be impeded by any issues of yours save for the upper palate leak) in just inside your mouth. I find a relaxed, normal resting position tongue works best in most situations (or just place it the way you would when you say the sound "EEEEEE").
The other key is that you must actively PUSH the air at all times by engaging your core. Some great players of the past used to say that you keep you stomach OUT through the entire process of expelling air, but the key is to push with your abdominal muscles. If you can feel your clarinet vibrating under your fingers...........THAT'S the sound you want all the time.
..............Paul Aviles
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Author: rmk54
Date: 2013-09-16 17:32
She was able to somewhat conclude that it had not been very well taken care of by the previous owner and was "blown out"
-------------------------------------------------------
Uh-oh. The term "blown out" drives some of the amateurs (and I use that word with the greatest respect) *crazy*.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-09-19 19:28
I disregard the term blown out since the only characteristic one can point to that may cause deteriation of sound over time is the tendency for the bore to become more ovate (more expansion and contraction where the trickles of condensation occur).
This can be cured by putting the bore back in round.
Usually, leaks from bad pads or purely adjusted keywork are much greater culprets.
...................Paul Aviles
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-09-19 20:54
Alvin Swiney, who worked for Hans Moennig, says that lint from cloth swabs accumulates in the tone holes, impairing response, and that this is what is meant by "blow out." He says that simply scraping out the deposits restores the instrument.
Ken Shaw
Post Edited (2013-09-19 20:55)
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Author: JoeE
Date: 2013-09-28 00:21
My first teacher, Jimmy Wilber of Cincinnati and a former student of my father, who was principal of the CSO always told me, "Don't blow the clarinet, play the clarinet." It is though the sound is produced like you would speak...when speaking you are not aware of air coming out of your mouth. I think of it as more like air pressure and not a stream of air producing the sound. Take a breath, hold it and then count to 10 out loud...although you are "holding" your breath, obviously air is coming out in order for you to sound the words. Now play the clarinet in the same way...take a big breath, support the air (like holding your breath), and play. Try it.
Also, firm your embouchure so that the mouth is encircling the mouthpiece. This can be done by thinking "ooh"...the mouth cavity and the outside of the mouth, too must be used to produce the "ooh" formation. Some players also try to force a slight smile...pulling the corners back slightly...yet still holding the "ooh". One step further is to add the "tee" or "kee" formation inside the mouth to the "ooh"...much like saying "too" or "koo". Work on these things and your sound will improve!
Ralph Morgan made mouthpieces...duck-billed and an "A" shaped chamber...which were made for taking in more mouthpiece, a less firm embouchure, and very easy to blow. They produced a beautiful sweet tone, although I always thought short on volume and projection...but sweet. They're still available (RM10 and RM06) in some stores online...I believe made by his son. Worth trying.
Hope all of this helps.
JoeE
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Author: Clarnetamaphone
Date: 2013-09-28 02:48
Making a fine, characteristic clarinet sound is at once complex in some respects and simple in others.
Regarding equipment, there are many well made mouthpieces today that will yield good results, IF you have a well balanced reed. So, making a good sound assumes you have equipment that will facilitate your efforts and not work you to death or kill your endurance.
No matter how good your mouthpiece may be made, you MUST learn how to test and adjust reeds for balance. Poorly balanced reeds will frustrate your efforts at developing correct and efficient tone production mechanics.
With that, let's set equipment aside for now.
First, the most important thing is concept. Answer this two part question: what is good clarinet tone and why is it good?
Harold Wright's playing answered the first part of the question. Your answer may be different. None the less, you need an ideal example you can refer to. Without a point of reference you'll not be able to evaluate progress.
The second of the answer part starts with shape: focus or excellent definition in the shape. Next, consistency of color, volume and shape from tone to tone, hand to hand and register to register--as much as possible. You can also hear this in Wright's playing.
Next, once you develop the concept of tone you prefer and understand why it is good, you need to answer another question: how do I do the same thing?
Now, the focus shifts to what happens behind your nose, and the answer has several parts.
1. The air. How to blow correctly is too much to go into here. Suffice it to say a full, consistent air stream is essential. The lungs, diaphragm, etc, are used to generate the air, but just as importantly, the tongue is used to regulate, shape and direct the air.
2. The tongue should have a consistent position. I recommend a high/back position, as if you are about to say the word, "cake" or "key." This creates a narrow passage the air passes through that concentrates, speeds up and energizes the air, making less go further. This kind of air stream is narrow, compressed, concentrated and puts a high degree of force or energy into a small amount of air. Stand in front of a mirror or window and breath warm air on to its surface. A large haze or fog will form. Next. blow cold air on the window. A small haze forms. The cold air is what you want.
3. The embouchure: the biggest tone killer is biting. Biting is upward jaw closure on the reed. You should never close the jaw to control the reed. The embouchure creates the aperture or opening for the mouthpiece by opening and the jaw moving forward (for most people) so the teeth are more or less even. The embouchure stays fixed in that position, much like the curtains that open for a play.
4. To control the reed the mouthpiece/reed wedge is snugged up against the lips and into the mouth and into the air stream. To add pressure to the reed NEVER close the jaw (biting). Always snug the mouthpiece/reed wedge more firmly by lifting with the right hand thumb.
Put simply, tummy down (compression blowing), tongue's up, thumb's up, jaw down (and forward).
I have some videos on how to play double lip embouchure on youtube that demonstrates the proper mechanics.
Double or single lip are beside the point. What matters is what happens to the lower lip and its relationship to the reed. Many people recommend double lip as a theraputic means of learning not to bite. Double lip certain does help in getting the feel of freeing up the tone, getting more resonance and depth, a better legato, and a more consistent tone throughout. working on double lip can help you, even if you don't actually use it, because you can learn how it feels to play without biting and then transfer that feeling to your single lip playing.
If you learn double lip, you'll be able to play both single and double lip well--and double lip will most definitely improve your single lip playing.
I, personally, don't look at the matter as an "either/or" choice. I can play both, and having both techniques gives me extra techniques I would not have otherwise.
I hope this helps.
You can find my youtube videos at billyboy647 in the youtube search.
Hope this helps.
Ridenour Clarinet Products
1-888-AKUSTIK
ridenourclarinetproducts.com
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Author: Clarnetamaphone
Date: 2013-09-28 02:52
Making a fine, characteristic clarinet sound is at once complex in some respects and simple in others.
Regarding equipment, there are many well made mouthpieces today that will yield good results, IF you have a well balanced reed. So, making a good sound assumes you have equipment that will facilitate your efforts and not work you to death or kill your endurance.
No matter how good your mouthpiece may be made, you MUST learn how to test and adjust reeds for balance. Poorly balanced reeds will frustrate your efforts at developing correct and efficient tone production mechanics.
With that, let's set equipment aside for now.
First, the most important thing is concept. Answer this two part question: what is good clarinet tone and why is it good?
Harold Wright's playing answered the first part of the question. Your answer may be different. None the less, you need an ideal example you can refer to. Without a point of reference you'll not be able to evaluate progress.
The second of the answer part starts with shape: focus or excellent definition in the shape. Next, consistency of color, volume and shape from tone to tone, hand to hand and register to register--as much as possible. You can also hear this in Wright's playing.
Next, once you develop the concept of tone you prefer and understand why it is good, you need to answer another question: how do I do the same thing?
Now, the focus shifts to what happens behind your nose, and the answer has several parts.
1. The air. How to blow correctly is too much to go into here. Suffice it to say a full, consistent air stream is essential. The lungs, diaphragm, etc, are used to generate the air, but just as importantly, the tongue is used to regulate, shape and direct the air.
2. The tongue should have a consistent position. I recommend a high/back position, as if you are about to say the word, "cake" or "key." This creates a narrow passage the air passes through that concentrates, speeds up and energizes the air, making less go further. This kind of air stream is narrow, compressed, concentrated and puts a high degree of force or energy into a small amount of air. Stand in front of a mirror or window and breath warm air on to its surface. A large haze or fog will form. Next. blow cold air on the window. A small haze forms. The cold air is what you want.
3. The embouchure: the biggest tone killer is biting. Biting is upward jaw closure on the reed. You should never close the jaw to control the reed. The embouchure creates the aperture or opening for the mouthpiece by opening and the jaw moving forward (for most people) so the teeth are more or less even. The embouchure stays fixed in that position, much like the curtains that open for a play.
4. To control the reed the mouthpiece/reed wedge is snugged up against the lips and into the mouth and into the air stream. To add pressure to the reed NEVER close the jaw (biting). Always snug the mouthpiece/reed wedge more firmly by lifting with the right hand thumb.
Put simply, tummy down (compression blowing), tongue's up, thumb's up, jaw down (and forward).
I have some videos on how to play double lip embouchure on youtube that demonstrates the proper mechanics.
Double or single lip are beside the point. What matters is what happens to the lower lip and its relationship to the reed. Many people recommend double lip as a theraputic means of learning not to bite. Double lip certain does help in getting the feel of freeing up the tone, getting more resonance and depth, a better legato, and a more consistent tone throughout. working on double lip can help you, even if you don't actually use it, because you can learn how it feels to play without biting and then transfer that feeling to your single lip playing.
If you learn double lip, you'll be able to play both single and double lip well--and double lip will most definitely improve your single lip playing.
I, personally, don't look at the matter as an "either/or" choice. I can play both, and having both techniques gives me extra techniques I would not have otherwise.
I hope this helps.
You can find my youtube videos at billyboy647 in the youtube search.
Hope this helps.
Ridenour Clarinet Products
1-888-AKUSTIK
ridenourclarinetproducts.com
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