 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: maxcoletti
Date: 2013-08-07 07:46
Hi Forum,
I find it more difficult to consistently cross the break cleanly and smoothly from/to Bb4 (left hand A + register key) than from A4. I'm currently struggling with a 16th note passage involving E5-Bb4-E5. It usually comes out OK, but once every 5 times or so I get a squeak or the notes speak more slowly. In short, I still don't have "performance-confidence" for this. Maybe the challenge is related with the angle of the left thumb. Is it common to have more difficulty crossing the break from/to Bb4 than A4?
I started playing clarinet about two years ago. How long does it take usually to get this type of passages "under my fingers" so that they become second nature?
Thanks,
-- Massimo
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-08-07 11:01
That Bb is not a resonant note, so going from that (to almost anywhere) the clarion can be a bit jarring. What can help is to utilize vent fingerings for the Bb. You can start with adding the third fingers of both hands plus the RH pinky Ab/Eb key. One I like better (much better for more situations) is to just add the second and third fingers of both hands (no pinky necessary).
Now, for your situation going to E (natural I presume) this is mechanically awkward since you'd be releasing third finger of the RH and adding the first finger of the RH for the E.
The OTHER issue is one of sonic comfort. Chances are you may also be reacting to the odd interval of the augmented 4th (which will just sound odd to begin with). Best thing for mechanically and sonically awkward passages is to work it S-L-O-W-L-Y and very steady (with metronome) at first, and gradually bring up the tempo with clarity under your fingers.
...............Paul Aviles
SORRY !!! I just notice that I wrote the wrong vents for the second example......shouldn't write so early in the morning!
Post Edited (2013-08-07 23:45)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2013-08-07 13:34
If only full Boehms were the standard system, then top space E to mid line Bb would still be in the same register. So it's a simple case of putting down RH3 and closing the low Eb key for the Bb.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2013-08-07 14:14
Paul's suggestiongs are very good. Remember too, keep your fingers as close to the holes as possible so the distance is not far to move and try not to "press" to hard because that may make you not cover the holes on first contact. Keep your fingers curved too rather than straight, that cuts down greatly on distance your fingers have to travel to cover the holes. Keep them near the shape they would be in as if you were picking up a baseball. Also, make sure your fingers move from the top joint, not from each individual knuckle. Generally speaking, when playing fast, the lest distance your fingers have to travel the faster most players can play. Also, think positive, it actually can help. :-)
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Grabnerwg
Date: 2013-08-07 16:49
Think about rolling the index finger from the A key to the first tonehole. Many beginners/intermediates that I see try to lift the finger instead of using a rolling motion. Check to make sure that your index finger isn't too high on the A key to make it practicable to get to the tonehole in the time required.
Walter Grabner
www.clarinetxpress.com
New CXZ_G11* and CXZ_G13* mouthpieces.
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Author: maxcoletti
Date: 2013-08-07 20:12
Excellent suggestions, all of you. Especially Ed's about keeping a positive attitude. I sure need to keep that in mind after the tenth squeak in a practice session :-)
I do use resonance fingerings, and most break crossings are actually coming along pretty OK, after endless and painstaking S-L-O-W practice, just like you gentlemen said. I was still wondering however why it is more difficult (for me at least) to cross from Bb4 rather than from A4. Is that a common experience, or is it just me? And what's the average time (in years :-)) to perfect all kinds of passages that involve crossing of the break?
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-08-07 23:56
Perfection? I've been working on that for almost 40 years and ain't got there yet.
I think (and alluded to it above) that the A is not nearly as thin and unresonant as the Bb. Because of this jarring transition from a note that is using as short a tube as possible (the Bb) to one that is using nearly the full length of the horn, you notice this more (the A to which you refer does not use that much more horn, but it IS produced through full sized tone holes!).
With my second (and updated!!!) vent fingering for the Bb, I actually look forward to running into those particular intervals to see just how similar in timbre I can get them. But after all those years of playing the horn, I guess that must mean it ain't easy.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-08-08 04:02
Massimo -
Your problem is almost always caused by too much movement in the left hand.
You were probably told to "roll" your left index finger up onto the key A key. For me, this is terrible advice and leads to many problems. I've seen beginners rotate their entire left hand so that the palm is facing down toward the bell.
Instead, keep your left hand motionless and just "nudge" the A key with the upper edge of your index finger, raising it or moving it very slightly to get it off the tone hole. The same goes for your left thumb. Raise it just enough to open the hole and nudge the register key.
Watch in a mirror and work on keeping your left hand movement as small and quiet as possible. Think of making the movements invisible to someone watching.
Also, keep your left ring finger down. That anchors your hand in place and prevents excess movement. Keep your right index and middle fingers down, too. That way, the only movements are in your left hand.
Begin the exercise very slowly. Play and hold E5. Image the finger movements you will make to get to Bb4 and then make them neatly and smoothly. Hold the Bb4, image the (reverse) movements to go back to E5 and then make them. Never work faster than perfect. Slow practice is even better than fast practice. You're engraving the proper movements into your muscle memory.
Ken Shaw
Post Edited (2013-08-08 13:41)
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Author: kdk
Date: 2013-08-08 14:31
Much of what has been said here about the general problems of crossing from throat to clarion are well stated and generally accurate, but they may not have much to do with your specific problem. Slow your practice down and try to analyze carefully what your thumb is doing. You may find a solution in the angle of the thumb or, more likely, the placement of your thumb on the register key while playing Bb. You don't say if the squeaks occur on E or on Bb. If they happen when moving to E, your thumb motion may be pulling one or more of your left fingers slightly out of position, enough to open one of the holes.
The one big difference (never mind any differences in resonance - you're not complaining about sound, but about squeaks) is that playing A4 doesn't involve your thumb - it can be poised in advance to cover the thumb hole and open the register key when going up and is simply lifted when going down. When you play Bb4, the thumb is already occupied on the register key and has to somehow get to covering the thumb hole as well when you change to a clarion note. If you are going downward to Bb, the thumb has to open the thumb hole without releasing the register key.
So, I think especially if E is squeaking, your first attention has to be to what your left thumb is doing and how much movement is needed from its position on the register key as you play Bb to the position it needs to be in to also cover the thumb hole for E (or any other note above the break).
If Bb is squeaking, you might still be having some kind of coordination problem in opening the thumb hole - maybe not opening it completely or, again, moving one of the left hand fingers off a hole too soon. It may also be that Keeping your right hand fingers down may help just to minimize the coordination needed among all the fingers that are involved, apart from any extra resonance that may result.
Again, all of the above is based on your comment that the problem happens from Bb4 to E5 (and perhaps to other clarion notes) and not when A4 is involved instead of Bb. If the same problem exists using A, then you certainly have to add the difference in resistance between throat and long fingerings back into the mix.
Karl
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Author: maxcoletti
Date: 2013-08-08 21:17
Hi Karl, your analysis is spot on. The squeaks happen on E natural, and also on E flat or F. Oddly enough the passage from Bb to long B or C is quite good. The problem must be caused by a combination of air pressure differential together with left thumb and/or index mechanics, as you say. Another interesting observation: when using newer (hence slightly stiffer) reeds, the problem almost disappears. On the other hand a worn-out reed will chirp and squeak like a blackbird in those passages. So I'm going back to slow and deliberate practice. Thanks to everyone that answered.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-08-09 02:28
Max -
A worn-out reed will squeak and chirp under the best of circumstances, particularly if it's gotten frayed at one of the corners. I should have said that the first thing to do is try a new reed.
Ken Shaw.
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