 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: John J. Moses
Date: 2013-07-08 19:04
Hi All:
In an earlier post, I sited a recent post from The Examiner. It was nice surprise for me to find & I thought many of you would enjoy seeing what I've done over the past 50+ years.
It was, in fact, Self-Promotion to post, but in my case it wasn't done to promote more work, but rather to encourage many of you to promote yourselves more. You can always hire an Agent or Promotor to do the work for you, but you just might do a better job yourself!
There is nothing wrong with Self-Promotion! If you don't help yourself at every opportunity, you will lose out. It's nice to have others speak up for you & even have articles written about you, like mine, but Self-Promotion is OK.
Just do it, but be honest about your accomplishments.
http://www.examiner.com/article/john-j-moses-brings-experience-to-the-clarinet (corrected)
JJM
Légère Artist
Clark W. Fobes Artist
Post Edited (2013-07-08 19:07)
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Author: BflatNH
Date: 2013-07-08 22:29
JJM- I appreciated your example. Indeed, opportunities are rare and precious and presenting yourself in a positive light is important. Just because people see something (someone, you), they may not know what it means or what it is worth and need something concrete. I would rather hire or associate with someone who is solid and at least somewhat confident and it is up to me to sort out those who overpromote themselves or have other issues.
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Author: Dileep Gangolli
Date: 2013-07-09 00:12
Not sure if promoting yourself on a clarinet bulletin board actually leads to more work or is more about puffery.
Where else do you suggest self-promoting? What other online outlets allow for self-promotion?
That is why people hire pros do promote their work.
Post Edited (2013-07-09 00:15)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-07-09 00:56
The basic premise is very sound. We need to be self confident TO BE SUCCESSFUL (not really the other way round).
Of course there are "banner ads" and every now and then some of us kinda go off on tangents about ourselves ............it's all part of life.
...................Paul Aviles
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Author: William
Date: 2013-07-09 18:20
Over the years, I have gotten many of my gigs via self promotion, calling contractors, friends, networking, schmoozing, etc...many of the things we all do to get work. However, this BB has always had a policy limiting how far we can go. What I was questioning in JJM's posting was really, where's the line and what causes Mark or GBK to step in and say, "NIX".
For what it is worth, I do not think there should be a ban on self promotion, but then again, I can imagine how it could get way out of hand if allowed with no constraint. Without having a whole panel of lawyers drafting a legally binding document, perhaps some definitive guidelines could be posted "one mo' time". Thanx
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Author: DougR
Date: 2013-07-10 14:43
Oddly enough, there was a segment on the PBS NewsHour last night about this; apparently Juilliard is starting to offer courses in self-marketing for its students. The segment didn't go so much into exactly what that might mean; it was more concerned with the fact that it seems to be necessary these days, plus highlighting that some students turned up their noses at the idea of "marketing" because they're so busy with their "art" (an attitude I fully understand, btw).
Not many of these students are going to have features written about them. But the social media (which I only dimly understand myself, I'm afraid) gives young musicians many more ways to connect with people than back when "self promotion, calling contractors, friends, networking, schmoozing, etc." (to quote William) was sufficient.
If I were starting out and trying to establish myself as a musician, one of the things I'd do is have a website AND a Facebook page, that I'd constantly link to in my email signature on all the emails I send. I'd also have a Facebook presence, and make sure to post upcoming gigs there. I'd have cards printed up and distribute them lavishly, and have sound samples on my website. I'd try to get someone to shoot my gigs, and post the best parts on my web pages. If the footage and sound quality were worthy, I'd stick them up on YouTube and list my website/FB page. (I'm sure there are many other "must" internet thingys that young musicians use that I'm not aware of.) That's in addition to the traditional calling contractors, schmoozing, going to others' gigs & hanging out with them, etc.
Whether all of this is mere puffery or not, whether it leads to work or not, whether "puffery" is in reality "creating awareness" (which corporations spend tons of money to do) is an interesting question. There used to be an adage in advertising, "Half of my ad budget is completely wasted! -- the trouble is, I don't know WHICH half."
As for self-promotion on the Board here, for my money anytime any of us gets a feature article written about us, I'd love to read it, and wish you would post it.
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Author: BflatNH
Date: 2013-07-10 21:58
I think it is good to build community, on both sides of the music stand. We do that here in part, and by proper promotion, with the community. I think for performers, familiarity does not breed contempt, but concert attendance.
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Author: John J. Moses
Date: 2013-07-11 03:49
Bravo DougR, well said. Your post may awaken some young artists in even more creative ways than we can imagine!
JJM
Légère Artist
Clark W. Fobes Artist
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Author: William
Date: 2013-07-12 14:09
Still the question, where is "the line" and what exactly constitutes improper postings of personal accomplishments??? Ambiguity may sometimes lead to favoritism....I'm just say'n.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2013-07-12 14:39
Glenn and I make the final judgements on applicability of the rules. Yes, we bend them at times depending on the thread and the poster. And yes, sometimes they seem arbitrary and subjective when compared against the written rules. But as with the law, there are times when white and black become gray, and we discuss in the background how far out of line the discussions get.
We most certainly don't get it perfect, we merely try to get it reasonable.
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Author: pewd
Date: 2013-07-12 14:51
DougR, yes, and this doesn't just apply to music. There are many fields where you need to self-promote to be successful.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: John J. Moses
Date: 2013-07-12 16:38
Hi Mark & Glenn:
Thanks for your continued support and friendship on your wonderful Clarinet BBoard. I think Mark & Glenn do a fine job of monitoring the BBoard, and my post has helped many younger players who have contacted me off the BBoard for advise on their own Self-Promotion.
JJM
Légère Artist
Clark W. Fobes Artist
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Author: rgames
Date: 2013-07-14 04:14
"If I were starting out and trying to establish myself as a musician, one of the things I'd do is have a website AND a Facebook page"
It depends. If you're trying to sell CD's to the general public or you have some commercial product to pitch, then yes. However, if you're trying to get a gig through an audition or trying to sell music to publishers then I would say no.
Here's why: for an audition committee, I don't know that any one has ever asked me for my website. I am fairly confident that none ever cared if I had a website.
In trying to capture the interest of publishers (my current piece of the music biz), having a website makes no difference UNLESS it's a bad website, in which case it actually causes harm. As such, it's actually better *not* to have one.
So, again, unless you're trying to appeal to the general public or you have a specific product to sell (e.g. a notation program like Finale), a website or Facebook page is actually a bad idea.
rgames
____________________________
Richard G. Ames
Composer - Arranger - Producer
www.rgamesmusic.com
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2013-07-15 16:40
I totally agree with you John. As long and one doesn't lie it's very proper to self promote ones self. Bravo on your great acheivements and career. You should be proud to show people what you've done in your musical life. It should only serve to encourage others to pursue their own careers. BRAVO
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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