 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: alanporter
Date: 2013-04-28 15:33
Has anyone tried the new barrel Rovner has produced with a rectangular bore ? I don't understand the physics behind this.
Alan
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-04-28 17:16
Alan -
The physics are the same. Shape doesn't count -- only the volume and the taper. Plenty of organ pipes have a square interior, and some of the best large recorders are made of four pieces of plywood carpentered together.
The intersection between the round mouthpiece and upper joint bores and the rectangular barrel bore is likewise irrelevant.
There used to be a barrel with a square bore, but the name escapes me.
There's nothing new about rotating the barrel either. Kalmen Opperman did it with his handmade barrels and marked the best position with an inset mother of pearl dot. I've done it with all my barrels, checking them at North, Northeast, East, etc. and scratching a tiny mark to line up with the register key. The same thing works with the bell.
The other Rovner claims are pure hype. Try the Opperman method and save the $190.
Ken Shaw
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2013-04-28 20:29
I posted about this Rovner barrel a few months ago after seeing it advertised in the Instrumentalist magazine. If you search the archives you'll find other comments, some from several years ago. It appears that Rovner made this product a while back for a short time and recently revived it, although I could be wrong.
I can't say if this barrel is a good product or not, but the rectangular bore reminds me of the debate in the saxophone world about round vs. square chamber mouthpieces. This is a topic that always seems to generate a lot of discussion on sax chat boards.
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Author: Taras12
Date: 2013-04-28 21:11
Still, I'm curious regarding going from the round exit of the mouthpiece into the rectangular barrel into the round column of the body of the clarinet. Ken, you say it's immaterial. There must be some reflection of the soundwave as it hits the "wall" formed by the change from round to rectangular back to round. I would think some of the overtones and even the basic wave would get "clipped" thus dulling the perceived sound,...no?
Tristan
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-04-29 02:21
Clarieister -
The Opperman method is what I described: You make a pencil mark on the barrel, put the mark at the 12:00 position and play an open G. Then turn the barrel to 1:00 and play again, then to 2:00 and so on around. One of the positions will be more resonant than the others. I make a tiny scratch at the bottom of the barrel above the ring, aligned with the register key. For the bell, I put the scratch aligned with the bottom post of the lower joint. It's free, and I think it makes a significant difference.
Several years ago, there was a public tv special on grenadilla showing Buffet's consultant doing the same with the barrels and bells of an Elite. They then stamped the trademark so that everything would line up.
Tristan -
Remember that the air in the clarinet vibrates in place. The sound waves don't travel up and down the bore. Rather, the air vibrates at the pitch determined by the tube length. All that counts is the volume of the bore, not its shape. Square wood organ pipes are often doubled back. Think of a bassoon or trumpet valves.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Steven Ocone
Date: 2013-04-29 12:18
In the Buffet factory, the logo is not put on the bell till a player chooses the position. Place the logo in line with the others to have this choice. I believe the final reaming of the upper joint and barrel is done together with the logo in front.
I was working on an old clarinet with a customer. I did some work, reassembled the horn and played. It sounded much worse. I noticed a mark on the bell and one on the body. I aligned them and the sound of the clarinet was transformed. If I remember correctly, the marks were put there by Hans Moennig many years ago.
The bell affects all the notes on the clarinet, especially the open G for some reason.
Steve Ocone
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2013-04-29 15:29
Clarinetmeister, it's called the "sweet spot" on the barrel. Finding the placement that sounds and responds the best on your clarinet-MP. I do that with all my clarinets and have a mark on the barrel to line it up with the register key.
I wasn't aware that Rovner is making these barrels again, he usually informs me when he does. I was one of the first players to use his retangular barrel years ago. He experimented with boring out an old Buffet barrel and filled it in with his design and after we experimented with it for a while he made me a few out of some type of "plastic" or some type of material. I actually liked it and used it for several years in the BSO and when I played principal at the Eastern Music Festival. People that looked at it thought I was crazy until they heard me play on it. One player said it can't possibly work until we played duets together, he changed his mind. At the time I liked the compact sound and good tuning but changed to a Chadash barrel after a few years and then to a Backun barrel on my Buffets, a Segal on my Bb Selmer, when I tried them years ago. Just like a mouthpiece, I've changed a few times when I found something I liked better. Bottom line, if you like it, use it. Use whatever makes you sound and tune the best for you.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Bob Barnhart ★2017
Date: 2013-04-29 15:41
Ken,
I confess I've never experienced any "sweet spot" based on rotating the barrel.
Moreover, your observation that "shape doesn't matter" (particularly with a radially unsymmetric shape like the Rovner barrel has) makes me wonder how this phenomenon could occur at all, particularly when (it is my understanding that) barrels ARE radially symmetric.
BTW, I own one of the old Rovner barrels and it does play well with good tone and intonation. However, I WOULD align it with the windway on my mouthpiece (although I could never determine if this made any discernable difference)!
Bob Barnhart
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Author: Clarimeister
Date: 2013-04-29 18:19
Ahh thank you Eddie and Ken. I knew about the method, but i didn't know that you were referring to that with Opperman. My bad. Thanks again for clarifying!
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2013-04-30 01:18
Ken, if the sound wave didn't travel up and down the bore at all, then resonance fingerings wouldn't work.
And adding the Low F/C key wouldn't make a difference in the Resonance throat A fingering (which it certainly does).
Primarily of course the sound comes out of the next open hole, but there's got to be a bit of sound wave in the rest of the instrument.
I'm not an acoustician, nor physicist, I just play the thing.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-04-30 15:21
David -
Think of a jump-rope tied to a post at one end with you holding it at the other end. If you pull the rope taut and tap it, you create a wave that moves down the rope and then bounces back.
But you can also swing it in the standard jump-rope way, creating a "standing wave." With a well-timed pull, it's easy to make the standing wave turn in two sections, with a "node" at the center. In the same way, you can create two nodes, or three. That is, you create the overtones. This is what happens in the clarinet.
Raising or lowering a finger changes the length of the bore and thus the pitch of the standing wave, just as if you made a jump-rope shorter or longer.
Resonance fingerings create sub-nodes that emphasize certain overtones and change the tone color.
Ken Shaw
Post Edited (2013-04-30 16:00)
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Author: Bennett ★2017
Date: 2013-05-01 00:04
Just as a curious side note, I've come into possession of two conventional Buffet barrels that have been rebored, quite crudely. Their bore now is square, about 6/10" left to right, both top and bottom. (I think the solid figure that would fit inside is called a cuboid or rectangular prism).
With my Bb R13 they've a nice bright sound and absolutely terrible intonation.
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