 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Jim Lee
Date: 2001-03-20 12:24
I am seeking opinions about the Selmer Signature Bb clarinet. I have played Selmer Series 9 clarinets for years and am going to purchase a new clarinet. I have played the Buffet r13 and the more pricey versions and like the tone but am a little concerned about the scale. I have read that the Signature has a very nice scale. I have not been able to audition a Signature and would greatly value the opinion of those who have.
Jim
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2001-03-20 12:45
I've tried 3 Selmer Signatures and was personally disappointed with all three, although others have found them to be one of the best clarinets they've ever played. I found them "stuffy," but with great key action and beautiful to behold. The scale is excellent, but I felt like I was having to work too hard to get the tone to go "all the way through" the instrument. I would have thought it was a quirk of the first one I tried until I tried the other 2 and found the same problem. I changed my mind about buying one after that--although I loved the "feel" of the instrument. What they did with the key placement, etc. is magnificent!
On Selmer's website at www.selmer.com, go to the paris clarinets and look up Tom Ridenour's comments on the Selmer Signature. He's very favorable about it.
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Author: Jan
Date: 2001-03-20 12:55
I have a brand new Selmer Signature. I tried the Buffet R13 Greenline, Buffet R13 and The SS. I chose the the SS because of the key position. I have small hands and my hand position felt natural instead of always stretched with the Buffet. The key action is excellent however the tone is somewhat stuffy. It takes a little extra effort (for me anyway) to get those crisp, clear tones. I thot it was just my mouthpiece clarinet combination at first because the m.p. I tested the horns on is the one I used on my R13, but Im still searching for the right m.p. that will easily give me the tone i like. Of course, part of that is the instrument and a lot of it is me.
good luck
jan
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-03-20 14:19
Jim -
The Signature is Selmer's top of the line instrument and is significantly different from prior models. It responds differently from all Buffet models. Either you like it or you don't. I like the physical feel of the instrument, as well as the intonation and evenness of response. Nevertheless, I find the resistance higher than I like and have trouble getting the sound I want, and so I stick with my Buffet R-13s.
The Buffet RC corrects some of the intonation problems of the R-13. You should certainly try that model. I believe the Buffet Festival has similar improvements. Mark Charette's son plays on Festivals, so he or Mark can tell you about them. I played a new Buffet Elite a couple of months ago and liked it. The one I played was a definite improvement over the original version. I also played a couple of Buffet Vintage models and liked them even better, though they are an R-13 design.
I would take Tom Ridenour's endorsement of the Signature with a grain of salt. First of all, while he's an excellent player and repairman, his embouchure and playing style are unusual. What works for him does not always work for others. Also, he is paid to endorse the Signature. If you look in the Klarinet archives for his postings from several years back, when he was working for Leblanc, you will find nearly identical statements endorsing the Leblanc Opus and Concerto models, which, by the way, play quite similarly to the Signature, at least for me.
As with all models, there is variation from sample to sample. About a month ago, I played a Leblanc Concerto at Woodwind & Brasswind in New York that was spectacular -- different from and better than any other Opus or Concerto I have tried.
These top of the line models are quite a bit more expensive than what most people play. If you have the money to buy an instrument in this class, you should try similar models from other makers. I haven't tried the new Yamaha models, but Mark Charette has said they're excellent. You should also try the Rossis.
In the end, you make your own sound, regardless of the instrument. Marcellus students all remark that he sounded the same on their mouthpiece and instrument as on his. You can do well on any good clarinet. It comes down to picking the one that lets you do it the easiest.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: mw
Date: 2001-03-20 14:53
For me, mouthpieces that work well with my Buffet R-13 didn't seem to work that well for me with my Selmer Signature. I opted for an older (Woodwind) Steel Ebonite that worked very well. I really like the keywork on the Signature & think they ought to provide (something like) 63mm (or so) barrel in the middle of the range between the 2 which are provided by Selmer ... which are 62.5mm & 64.5mm. Best of luck. mw
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Author: Cass
Date: 2001-03-20 14:55
One thing about Selmers, I have heard they play better with Selmer mouthpieces and my one experience backed it up. When I borrowed a Selmer while my clarinet was getting some work done on it in the shop, I ended up borrowing the friend's Selmer mouthpiece too, because my Vandoren B45 was too hard to play on it. It seemed like I was blowing as hard as I could and nothing was coming out. But with a Selmer mouthpiece, just a Goldentone and nothing special or expensive, all of a sudden the clarinet was easy to play. I forget now which type Selmer it was, but not the top quality one. It was one of the "upgrade" or intermediate models. This was a few years ago, sorry I don't remember. My friend I borrowed the clarinet from said Selmers usually do best with a Selmer mouthpiece.
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Author: larryb
Date: 2001-03-20 15:41
I bought my Signature about a year ago and am very pleased with it. I used to play Buffet R13 - nothing against it, I just felt like making a change.
A couple of things to be mindful of, though: the tone hole "chimneys" are inserts, which means they can leak if not properly glued in. This was the case with my Signature, and it was easily repaired. (Leblanc clarinet "chimneys" are apparently chisled out of the wood of the instrument, which means they are not inserts and won't leak; it is also one reason that the Opus is significantly more expensive than the Signature).
Also, the pad cups and pads on early Signatures were small relative to the large tone holes on the bottom joint. I understand that new Signatures have larger cups and pads and consequently seat (sit) better. Older Signatures may need some adjustment of the pads and/or refacing of the tone holes in order to seat perfectly, but a good technician can do this.
I think some of these design/adjustment issues may partly cause the stuffiness that some people experience with the Signature. Also, the resistance is different than a Buffet. I use a Selmer C85/105 mouthpiece (the one that came with the instrument) with great satisfaction. I tried numerous Vandorens before settling on the Selmer MP.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-03-20 17:08
My 10G doesn't have inserts; I can't believe that causes a great price differential.
Re: Selmer mouthpieces on Selmer clarinets - the C85 115 that came with my 10G has (IMO) a horrid tone when coupled with that clarinet. Way piercing! B45, Hawkins, and Pyne all work much better for me.
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Author: larryb
Date: 2001-03-20 18:09
The 10G has neither inserts nor raised tone holes on the lower joint (like the Recital I assume). Those raised tone holes on the Signature are what I was referring to.
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2001-03-21 12:38
I just took a Selmer Prologue II home for trial from my dealer and combined it with my Kaspar Cicero 13 mouthpiece! Talk about a WOW tone! I was shocked! The key action was nice and smooth and I had a great time on this entry-level pro clarinet. It had that big, dark wonderful tone that I've been hunting for jazz and big band stuff. Of course, one of my other clarinets will end up on eBay, but this is WAY better than the Signatures I tried. No, it doesn't have raised tone holes--but I found the Signature's raised tone hole a waste of time and money for them. Your finger is used to the clarinets without the raised hole--and I went back and forth from the Signature to my Opus and didn't notice that the raised hole made anything better. I'll guarantee you my Opus will play circles around the Signature in orchestra settings and probably everywhere else. No offense Signature fans--remember--I love my new Prologue II.
I do recommend trying various mouthpieces. The mouthpieces that come with most instruments are not necessarily the best ones for them. Pyne, Bay, Fobes and others are great.
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Author: Ed
Date: 2001-03-21 17:15
I am curious, Ken says Tom Ridenour's embouchure is odd. In what way? I am not familiar with his playing, but have read some of his articles. I did not know that he actually paid by Selmer. Last I read he said he endorsed the horns, but that this was as an independant repairman. Other thoughts- don't fear tone hole inserts, many clarinets have used them including the Wurlitzers and many top line Yamaha clarinets. Also pertaining to mouthpieces and equipment, sometimes I find that changing one element can cause you to change another to balance out. For example, a slightly more stuffier mouthpiece may cause you to find a reed or barrel or ligature that gives a bit more freedom.
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Author: larryb
Date: 2001-03-21 18:00
The only "unusual" thing about Tom's embouchure is that he plays double-lip - but that's not so odd any more.
I wonder if he every reads all these postings that impune his reputation. Whether he's paid or not as a Selmer spokesman, he still makes a credible caset. You can agree or disagree. He also writes that Buffet, Leblanc and Yamaha make high quality instruments.
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Author: Ed
Date: 2001-03-21 18:42
If "double lip" were to be considered unusual, there are many in this great players and teachers in this camp. To name a few- Harold Wright, Richard Stoltzman, Ralph McLane, David Weber, Jon Manasse, Kal Opperman, not bad company!
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2001-03-22 00:59
I've talked with Tim at length a few times. He has played in my presence, a casual setting at TMEA booths, the last two years. The only aspect about his embouchre I noticed is that he has to compensate a little for the formation of his teeth. I really didn't notice that he played double lip or not...we were discussing acoutical differences of clarinets, pads, and other technical details. He is quite accomodating and very comfortable to be around.
John
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2001-03-23 04:43
would be my favorite one. It comes with Chadash barrel and Greg Smith mouthpiece. I suggest to request information to International Musical Supplier owner(herself clarinetist - Marcellus student). This would be a nearly perfect machine at first touch/blow. You know Brannen? Top class customizer.
Customized or un-customized is more important than the clarinet itself. IMHO.
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