 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-03 02:19
Hi, I'm interested in buying an inexpensive A clarinet to play in a community orchestra. The Berkeley Pro A clarinet is available for under $300, see http://www.berkeleywind.com/pro-a-clarinet-w-dark-focused-tone-563-b563.html
I've never heard of this brand before and wonder if anyone knows anything about it. Obviously I can't expect superior quality at a price like that, but I'd like to know whether it's passable or an outright embarrassment. They don't say what it's made of but it looks like wood.
Thank you!
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Author: michael13162
Date: 2012-12-03 04:25
They are very bad horns, you get what you pay for. And it's plastic, not wood. If you want something affordable, check out ridenour's A clarinets.
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-12-03 05:05
Berkeley clarinets are your typical Chinese clarinet-shaped-objects. The build quality and fit/finish tends to be very poor. The playing characteristics will generally be quite poor as well.
Realistically you are going to need to spend at least $1000 to get a halfway decent NEW A clarinet. You can occasionally find them used starting in the $400 range but these are usually rather old models. Newer used A clarinets typically sell for $1000+ at which point most amateur players are better off just buying a new one.
A couple of years ago I was in the same position as you looking for an inexpensive A clarinet. You may want to try the same strategy I did. Look for a Boosey & Hawkes A clarinet made from hard rubber. B&H made a lot of professional clarinets out of hard rubber that were supposedly meant for use by military bands stationed in tropical climates. These were made to the same specifications as the wooden versions but tend to sell for a very small fraction of the price. I picked up one of these for ~$200 including shipping from the UK and it is a quite serviceable instrument, certainly better than a Berkeley or any of the other cheap Chinese brands. If you check the UK version of the famous internet auction site these hard rubber B&H A clarinets tend to show up fairly regularly.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-12-03 07:13
Keep an eye on eBay for used A clarinets from the big names - there are some bargains to be had.
Check out French, German and UK eBay as well, not just the US and Canadian sites.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2012-12-03 07:14)
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2012-12-03 07:23
+1 Chris' advice. Just keep searching.
I found a Marigaux in A for $70 not too long ago.
--
Ben
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2012-12-03 10:57
A couple of years ago when I needed a C clarinet and didn't want to spend a bunch of money, I bought a Berkeley instrument online. Search the BB for a review of it.
In a nutshell, I had to make some modifications to the keywork immediately to get it to play; and the quality of the metal used in the keywork is awful, but......it plays, and plays pretty well. I've done the Clarinet III book of Mahler's 1st with two different orchestras using the Berkeley and it did its job, reasonably in tune. Also, a fellow clarinetist in another orchestra borrowed it for a few months (to play Beethoven, I think) and he had no complaints.
Since I use this instrument maybe once a decade, it didn't make sense for me to pay a lot more for a quality instrument. I can't recommend a Berkeley for any sort of serious usage, however.
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-03 15:20
Thank you, this is exactly the kind of information that I need
I am looking at a Ferrard & Jerome (France) clarinet for $350 that says it's professional quality and a Hunter clarinet that's all wrapped up in plastic so you can't get a good look at it.
I never heard of either of these brands, but I'm guessing that the Ferrard & Jerome is the better of the two. It says it's from the 1900's so it might be very old (early 20th century). I've emailed the seller for more info. The Hunter brand is a mystery, maybe another Chinese clarinet?
I'm also looking at a Tuyama clarinet. I never heard of that one either, but it says that it's made in China and tested in Germany. Sounds questionable.
There are also a couple of Greek(?) clarinets (brand unknown) that use the Albert system. Probably not suitable for me. They'd cost about $500.
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-03 17:01
The maker's mark in in a picture I posted at http://home.comcast.net/~ch_zonie/temp/makersmark.jpg
The correct spelling of the name appears to be Ferard Jerome. The updated spelling helped me find more information, and apparently this brand is primarily associated with Albert system clarinets.
I posted a picture of the whole clarinet at http://home.comcast.net/~ch_zonie/temp/clarinet.jpg On closer inspection I can see that there are considerable differences from my B flat clarinet (Buffet Evette), particularly on the lower barrel. I don't really know what an Albert system clarinet looks like, but apparently this is one of them.
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-12-03 20:30
ch_zonie wrote:
> I posted a picture of the whole clarinet at
> http://home.comcast.net/~ch_zonie/temp/clarinet.jpg On closer
> inspection I can see that there are considerable differences
> from my B flat clarinet (Buffet Evette), particularly on the
> lower barrel. I don't really know what an Albert system
> clarinet looks like, but apparently this is one of them.
It looks like your earlier posting about this clarinet was deleted as was my reply to it so I'll try to repeat it here:
DO NOT BUY THIS CLARINET!!!
You mentioned before that it was described as being marked "H.P." which means that it is a high pitch instrument designed to tune at A=456Hz rather than the modern A=440Hz. As a result it will not be playable in a modern ensemble.
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-03 21:11
Thank you, I would never have guessed that "H.P." had any significance. I thought it was part of the brand name information. This is definitely a clarinet to avoid, for me or just about anyone else.
I was just notified that the board doesn't allow any mention whatsoever of a current auction and that's why the posts were deleted. I read the previous info too quickly and thought it was just direct links that were banned. If I have any future questions about internet clarinets I'll be a lot more vague about where I got my information, and hopefully that will be enough to stay within the rules.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-12-03 21:30
I bought what was ment to be a Tuyama sopranino sax from Germany as it had modern style LH pinky keywork built to high F# with a front F key (most Chinese sopraninos are based on Yanagisawas and are built to high E) and when it arrived, it was exactly the same instrument as pictured, but it was engraved 'Eastman' instead of Tuyama.
If the Tuyama instruments were Taiwanese (which I doubt) then they would probably be more expensive and better quality. I suspect a Tuyama clarinet is most likely Chinese and overpriced - you will most likely find the same instrument being sold by Gear4Music for less.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-03 22:13
I've changed my profile to allow emails, and also replied to you by email. Thank you!
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2012-12-03 22:35
I bought one of the Berkeley Pro A Clarinets about a year or so ago and can share with you the following observations:
1. The body of the instrument was hard rubber. The exterior of the body exhibited an attractive and flawless matte finish. Looking down the bore, however, numerous gouges and henpecks were evident.
2. Keywork was sturdy enough, and the pads sealed well. I was able to give the instrument a fair trial right out of the box.
3. The Berkeley had wide twelfths on the long notes, and that's what ultimately prompted me to return the instrument. The instrument was set up so the clarion C and B were reasonably in tune, at the expense of a unusably flat low F and somewhat flat low E.
4. The hard case was poorly made, with loose foam panels and some staples showing inside.
5. Tone quality was unexpectedly rich and sonorous, and the instrument had nice even response up and down the scale. I rather enjoyed giving the Berkeley its trial.
At the end of the day, the wide twelfths on the long end of the horn, the immediate need for a better case, and concerns about the marred bore convinced me to send the horn back. All I bought it for was playing standards in guitar-friendly keys out on the porch accompanied by guitarist friends, and the instrument wasn't 100% up to that task. Still, the instrument came frustratingly close to being a keeper. With a little re-engineering and better quality control, the Berkeley could be a fantastic bargain for a casual-use A clarinet.
Post Edited (2012-12-03 22:43)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-12-03 22:42
Clarinets will generally have a flat low E and F in comparison to the in tune 12th (B and C) - that's just the nature of the beast. That's why you see the low E and F correction keys fitted on full Oehlers and now the Buffet Tosca and Yamaha CSGIII.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2012-12-03 22:51
Agreed, Chris. Still, using a wide-open mouthpiece and humoring up the low F as much as humanly possible still resulted in horrible flatness on the Berkeley. I've no problem at all managing low E and F on any of my other clarinets.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2012-12-04 02:15
A vent hole drilled into the bell can help with the flat low E and F. I frequently do this to Boosey & Hawkes clarinets in particular, as they tend to be very flat down at the bottom of their range. The vent hole raises the low E about 5 cents on average, at the expense of raising its corresponding upper twelfth (the 'long' clarion B) maybe 1-2 cents.
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2012-12-04 08:33
Before sending the Berkeley A back, I did consider sending it to David Spiegelthal here to see what he could do with it. There really was a lot to like about the Berkeley A. I forgot to mention above that it was delightfully free-blowing and had cannon-like projection--totally unexpected in a bargain-basement A. But, adding the cost of tweaking, shipping, and a good double case to the purchase price of the Berkeley, I would probably have invested more than I would have in a decent off-brand French A in wood. So, back it went to the seller.
BTW, my Boosey & Hawkes 8-10 from Dave has his signature bell vent modification and it does indeed help with the tuning on low E and F. If only I could get a matching 8-10 in A...
Regards, GJG
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-12-04 09:22
If you're looking for a matching A for your B&H 8-10, then a B&H Emperor or Imperial 926 A will do the trick.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Bobby McClellan
Date: 2012-12-06 02:28
I agree with another poster to look at the Ridenour A clarinet. I actually have his A bassett and it is a well made solid horn with good tone and intonation is great. Ted was offering the A clarinets on discount through the end of the month.
There can be good used A clarients online just remember to figure in some money for any repairs or adjustment that one may need.
Bobby
Bobby M. McClellan
Flowood, MS
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2012-12-06 13:06
Although.....a friend of mine (who occasionally posts here) had a Ridenour A and when I tried it it seemed mediocre at best (in my opinion).
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-06 15:39
Mediocre is good enough for me - I'm a mediocre player in a mediocre community orchestra. I'm looking for an A clarinet that's inexpensive but doesn't sound like an outright disgrace.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2012-12-06 18:21
Never settle for the merely mediocre! Always strive for a superlative level of mediocrity such as I have achieved in my decades of futile tooting!
All jesting aside, a good instrument will help your sound and be a LOT more enjoyable to play, at whatever level you are playing. While a top player would certainly sound good anyway playing a crappy horn, he/she would be miserable doing so. Get a good horn.
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-06 19:17
I do want to get the best I can manage within my price range, and I'm aiming for a higher level of mediocrity (the A clarinet is part of that plan). When the next semester of the orchestra starts in January, I'm going to try my hand at playing first clarinet parts after years and years in the second clarinet section. It will be a lot easier if I can play 1 sharp instead of 6 on the tougher pieces. We're not the world's best musicians but we don't mess around with simplified versions of the great composers - we use the same score that professional symphonies use.
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2012-12-09 00:16
If you are looking for something more basic rent a clarinet! A Buffet E11 could be rented for less than 30 dollars a month I'm sure. I have a student renting an amati A and it is also a great horn.
Don't buy a "professional" horn that's 100 years old, or a new plastic chinese clarinet shaped thing. You won't have any fun.
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: ch_zonie
Date: 2012-12-09 01:14
That's how we got my son's old student clarinet (Buffet Evette) - we rented it first then bought it. But I don't think that renting is feasible for me and my future A clarinet. The music stores in town (Tucson) don't have A clarinets at all. They're willing to order one for purchase but probably less willing to buy one and rent it out to me, and I might not fare any better if I drove to Phoenix. There isn't any other city bigger than Tucson within 400 miles.
I found an E11 B-flat clarinet for rent online for $45/month - it amounts to an installment purchase plan with a total price of $1,700 which is WAY out of my price range. Renting an A clarinet probably costs more. So even if I rented an A clarinet and liked it, buying it would be a problem and renting it forever would be a problem too.
I appreciate the suggestion but I just don't think it's a workable solution.
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Author: 3dog
Date: 2018-05-18 04:33
I read this post before I bought my new inexpensive Hunter http://mmrmagazine.com/new-products/band-instruments/6332-hunter-6403eb-plateau-key-bb-clarinet.html#disqus_thread and so far I am thrilled with the quality and sound for only $240. I play tenor and need to double and had played clarinet a long time ago. I was convinced a vintage wood clarinet was the way to go but could not afford to buy anything close to the vintage clarinet I had. For the price of a good mouthpiece I got a nice horn. Believe me I have heard my share of out of tune instruments and this is not one of them. Yes it is Chinese and if you follow the links you can get more info. I used the TE Tuner app to check each note and they are very close. My embouchure will improve and i should get even better shortly. I am not saying that this will compete with those $1000+ horns but it is a great place to start you journey.
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2018-05-18 07:40
3dog,
Is this a plateau clarinet? I had no idea they were still being made. Where did you get it? I see no way to order them on the website.
One potential problem you should be aware of are the pads. With some Chinese instruments they use the cheapest pads possible which means the pads could rip and leak within a matter of months. Keep an eye on the pads to make sure this doesn't happen.
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: Dibbs
Date: 2018-05-18 16:26
It works eventually and then the site goes really fast from page to page. Maybe it preloads the entire site into the browser to start with.
I couldn't find a plateau clarinet there though.
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Author: 3dog
Date: 2018-10-29 00:24
You need to find a store that has a Hunter catalog to order as I have never found anything on line for purchase. I think I was really lucky as the store had one in the case so I could play it and check it out. I am on the west coast of Fl.
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