 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: reprise
Date: 2012-10-11 16:33
My Buffet clarinets are about 35 years old and I'm thinking about having them be "voiced" to get them better in tune through the registers and on some particular notes.
My question: Will a technician need me to be able to say exactly what I want done (i.e., exactly which notes need to be fixed and what tendencies they have) or can you typically bring the instrument in and ask that work be done so that it can play in tune with itself as well as possible?
I've been putting it off assuming the former (and not having had time to systematically figure it all out).
Thanks!
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Author: kdk
Date: 2012-10-11 18:12
This is an interesting question concerning 35-year-old instruments. Of course your saying that you want each instrument to "play in tune with itself as well as possible" is key - no clarinet will play truly in tune with itself on every note in every register. There are too many compromises involved in designing an instrument with as wide a compass as a clarinet has available.
When you buy an instrument from a shop that does high level repair work, it usually has already been "set up" by the shop. That should mean that, among many other things, the repairer has adjusted the tuning and response on any notes that are clearly stuffy or noticeably out of tune, although often fine-tuning and adjustment are put off until after the instrument's "break-in" period. When I bought my Buffet clarinets from Hans Moennig 40+ years ago, he had completely rebuilt them, including what you refer to as "voicing" them. He didn't need anyone to tell him what needed to be fixed. The same is true for the repair techs I've worked with since then - when they sell an instrument, it is in optimal condition. They do that with no input from a player - it's done before anyone buys the instrument.
If, when I buy one of these clarinets, there's something I'd personally prefer to be different - a spring that feels too heavy or a note that doesn't feel right with my mouthpiece and reeds, the repairer will try to accommodate my preference (or talk me out of it if he thinks there will be unintended consequences).
So, you can probably get the basic work done without specifying what you want done in detail. An expert tech should be able to optimize the clarinet up to a point, at least with reference to his or her own preferences. But you need to have the work done by an expert repair tech. Let the person know at the start any issues you've definitely noticed. There should still be a chance after the work is finished to revisit any details that remain.
Karl
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2012-10-11 18:34
In my opinion I would want the player to identify the main "problem" areas before working on their instrument.
The response and intonation can be affected by the way that individual plays.
The acoustic system of any clarinet starts inside the player and also their preference for actual tuning characteristics e.g. favouring which register they would prefer to be most accurate etc.
My choices would not always be same as theirs.
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Author: JHowell
Date: 2012-10-11 19:22
I wouldn't do it, unless you are dealing with someone like Mark Jacobi or Tim Clark. There are probably quite a few woodwind repairmen who would be willing to ream this and sand that for you, but unless both of you have a really clear idea what you're doing and why you're apt to wind up worse off than you started.
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Author: kimber
Date: 2012-10-12 00:28
Contact Scott Winkler in Wisconsin. Excellent total clarinet repair/restoration. Reasonable for the level of expertise and somewhat close-by to Toronto. Only does clarinets. I don't have an email, but a web search should find one for you.
Scott Winkler
Woodwind Specialties
N6662 Meadowbrook Lane
Sheboygan, WI 53083
920/467-0829
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2012-10-12 03:41
I'd start by taking the clarinets to a small machine shop and having their bores checked for roundness. Have them run a bore gauge into both ends of the barrels and the upper and lower joints.
The cross grain and along grain wood expansion rates are different; and I believe that all sorts of problems result from a "mature" wooden instrument's bore shape settling into an oval configuration; and the the effects are particularly bad when the long axis of mating joints run in different directions.
If the horns are round, proceed with a good tech. If not?...
Bob Phillips
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2012-10-12 04:01
What mouthpiece are you using? What barrel are you using? IMHO these 2 parts of your instruments are often the start of a very nice even voicing.
It is also my opinion that you need to be there and be playing, often with a good tuner. Since the horns are in 10ths, not octaves, this is why it is smart for you to be there in person.
Feel free in emailing me for more details. It's not as simple as voicing the horn.
In my case I'm using a Bb bell for the A clarinet. It was one of the only ways to feel the horn.
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Author: rmk54
Date: 2012-10-12 12:33
If your horns overblow 10ths, you are in big trouble...
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-10-12 13:33
I know some people tend to play very flat in the upper register, so maybe their clarinets only overblow a 10th!
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2012-10-12 18:15
I had my buffet clarinet voiced many years ago and although it's techincally a E13 (Evette and Schaeffer K-series clarinet), it has played better than almost every professional horn I've tried with the exception of a few.
I still maintain that buying a used R13, having it overhauled and voiced by a pro, will save you money, and play better than MOST of the brand new professional horns.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2012-10-13 04:30
Every player will "voice" certian notes differently as well as the differences in the mouthpiece and even the barrel you use. A common mistake is that some players play the throat tones low while others play them sharp. The same thing with the altissimo B and C. If you want to tune your clarinet you have to have the bore checked first to make sure it hasn't changed too much and then be there with the tech as they tune one note at a time to your playing, not theirs. I don't care who it is doing the work, it's you that voice your playing not them.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Merlin_Williams
Date: 2012-10-13 13:01
To the posters who are trying to help the OP with techs in the states: the OP has Steve Fox and John Weir within an hour drive. There should be no need to go any further.
Personally, I wouldn't invest that much time and effort in 35 year old instruments.
If the OP really insists on doing that, then the first thing is to establish that the instruments are in an absolutely top notch state of repair.
The second thing would be to spend some time with an excellent clarinet teacher who can assess any potential player based issues.
Only then would I proceed with fine tuning the instruments.
Jupiter Canada Artist/Clinician
Stratford Shakespeare Festival musician
Woodwind Doubling Channel Creator on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/c/WoodwindDoubling
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Author: Tom Puwalski
Date: 2012-10-13 15:34
Morrie Backun has been doing my clarinets for years, he knows how to bring back old horns.
Tom Puwalski
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2012-10-14 12:39
Student of mine had a Buffet R-13 from the mid 60's, the "Golden years"........
Had the Clarinet completely overhauled ($700 job) from a well respected technician.
The horn had an issue of the Long B key acting up, due to soft metal - went out of adjustment very, very easily.
That said horn let her down in her District Band Audition, the B failed to play at one point.
She now plays a Selmer Signature Clarinet (yeah, "horn" was used on purpose)
I'm not a fan of old horns. Much rather use something newer, that won't constantly go out of adjustment.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2012-10-14 12:42
Btw - that was last year. Fortunately, she was only in 10th grade, and still made States, but got a lower chair than would have if the instrument hadn't failed her.
And I saw it coming the whole time. It sounded beautiful, played beautifully ***when it worked right***
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: William
Date: 2012-10-15 14:10
I've been playing 1960's R13's for nearly 50 yrs and they have NEVER failed me by going out of adjustment for reasons of "age". Of course, I am careful when I use them and have them tweeked every year, not because they do not play but rather just to keep them to tip-top condition.
With school children--and a 10th grader is still immature enough to qualify as a child--my experiance has been it is the instrument or the reed that "broke" and not a result of any mishandling by the player. I once had a flute player (7th grade) bring her instrument that had "broken". It was pinched completely together in the middle and bent so badly it would not fit into the case. During my 'investigation' it was determined that "somehow" the flute had inserted itself into the door of the car which had "somehow" slammed shut on it. As a result, it "broke" itself--or at least in the mind of my 7th grader.
Back on task, I don't think you should be afraid of playing vintage pro level clarinets if you are careful to handel them with a reasonable degree of TLC. I don't agree with David's fear of the older metal's weakness. It's more how you take care during assembly and use that is the issue.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2012-10-15 14:44
William - no, she is extremely responsible, and a quite advanced player.
The keywork is crap - extremely soft. I can EASILY bend it back, trouble is, that it keeps bending the other way.
If I didn't know the student, I'd assume the same thing though.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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