 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Micaela
Date: 2001-03-06 14:52
I play in a local college orchestra and the college has loaned me an A clarinet. It's a 1996 Buffet R-13. I don't think it has been played much, the keys are still stiff. It's sort of dead in a hard to describe way. It is very hard to get anything out of it, it isn't responsive, it doesn't have great tone and it's very resistant. I've played another R-13 A from around that time (late 80s) and it wasn't like this at all, so something weird is going on. Is there anything I can do to liven it up a little? Is it just newish and hasn't been really broken in? I could start practicing on it instead of my b flat, would that help? I only play it once a week for one piece. Does it need something else?
Weird fact: It has an amazingly clear throat tone b flat- it doesn't even need shading- but the middle of the staff b natural is horribly out of tune.
Micaela
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-03-06 15:14
Micaela -
There's a lot of variation in Buffet A clarinets. This one may be a dog. However, by 1996, Francois Kloc was giving "Platinum Service" on all R-13s imported into the US, in which he or someone working with him played and adjusted the instrument, so the quality has been more consistent.
Your description fairly cries out that there are leaking pads. Check that first. Also, if it's been sitting unused for several years, the wood has gotten dried out. You'll find great improvements if you play it daily for a couple of weeks.
Is the middle B sharp, flat or just dull? How's the low E? If they're both out in the same direction, it's easily fixable.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Micaela
Date: 2001-03-06 16:55
I'm oiling my B flat this afternoon (I'm snowed in and bored). Would the A benefit from this also?
The B is very flat. The E is also, I just use the B more so it's the one I think of.
I looked up the serial number. The clarinet's from 1993, not 1996. The college must have gotten it a little used.
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Author: Anji
Date: 2001-03-06 20:50
I'm unqualified to suggest repairs, but do buy lotsa older horns that mainly need cleaning.
Howzabout giving the accessible tone holes a swipe with a little nail polish remover on a Q-tip?
A lil attention to the register vent might be in order, as well.
We got 2+ feet of snow hear in UpState NY, my aching back!
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Author: ron b
Date: 2001-03-06 21:38
Micaela;
This post is repeating what Ken has already said. But, it's worth emphasizing.
A Buffet, any Buffet, shouldn't give you that much trouble. The clear throat tone and stuffy B/E is a clue that the pads aren't sealing well.
If you have access to a leak light you might find your problem right away. If not, try this 'home test' on the upper then lower sections yourself - close the holes, block the end and blow lightly. It should feel 'tight' - like blowing up a balloon. This will indicate *if*, not necessarily where, there's a leak. If the resistance feels 'weak' I would hope that only a pad or two are leaking, not something more serious. Pads don't have to leak much to cause a problem. I'd suspect a leak just because the horn's been unused for a long time. If the pads are in reasonably good shape, no 'moth-holes or tears, they might 'settle' just by being played for a while, as Ken suggests - if you can endure that : If it continues to play 'stuffy' after a day or two I'd take it to a repair shop to have it checked out. Most shops won't charge you to check it out and give you an estimate.
Hard to tell how much it was played before you got it. New horns often need some attention before they're ready to go and it's possible yours may never have gotten through a real break in period. Then, if it just sat around... :[ It might need routine servicing again; clean, adjust etc.. (Maybe the school would pay for that)? :]
ron b
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Author: Aaron
Date: 2001-03-06 22:20
I must also say that i have had a buffet A from 1996 for about 2 years now that has played not too well. It was too resistant and had a Dead tone...no life in the sound. I too thought that it was a pad, so i had it workedon by a very good tech person, and stil not much better. Well i endedup buying a Leblanc Concerto and foundd it to be of much better quality. I was amazed to only have to play 2 leblanc A's and find them to bothe be very consistent between the two of them. However when I played about 15 Buffet A's. Not one played like the other. They all had dead tone, and some should have been scrapped because of horribe chipping and gashes in the tone holes. Needless to say I was not pleased. But I've been very happy with my leblanc. I still have my R-13 Bb and it plays wonderfully.
There has to be something said about the dead tonw of those R-13 A clarinets, it is a feature of the newer ones, past 96 that I've noticed not only in my playing, but in other persons experiences.
Aaron
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Author: William
Date: 2001-03-07 03:42
Try rotating the bell by very small degrees at a time and testing the middle line B until you find the position that sounds the best. Ben Armato calls it "tuning the bell," and it works. You may find a postion for our bell that affects the over-all sound of the entire clarinet. Also, try the same proceedure with the barrel position and second-line G. Good luck.
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2001-03-07 05:00
This is what I learned from Dee's post.
Just remove register key and clean up the hole with toothpics etc.
The R-13 might become vivid again.
In my case, I did this to my Selmer after long non-playing period.
It really worked. Most provably you too would be surprised.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-03-07 10:10
A dirty register tone hole would not affect the low register.
Almost certainly one or many leaks, as ron b says. His test is unreliable if you blow hard. Blowing hard will open keys on many instruments, even if pads are sealing well..
I suggest a more controlled method. Get a mouthful of air and block the back of the throat with the tongue. Very gently attempt to slowly 'squirt' the mouthful of air into the blocked half-clarinet. Ideally you meet resistance to the squirt, indicating no air is escaping. If there is no or little resistance until your mouthful of air is empty you have leaks. That is when you test as Ron describes, blowing harder and harder. The first pad to lift and leak, probably audibly, is PROBABLY the one where the worst leak is. The leak could be a pad that does not seat properly (often because it is too thick), a weak spring, a bent or binding pivot, a rusted pivot, a pivot tube binding between posts, overtightened pivot point screw, a damaged pad, an ill-adjusted linkage, a screwed-down-too-far regulating screw, friction at the end of a flat-spring, a split across a tone hole edge, a chip out of a tone hole edge, a wobbling post, a sloppy pivot, a ring key binding against the timber, a cky cup touching the surround of a tone hole, etc, etc.
Many of these conditions are common on brand new instruments, including Buffets and Selmer Paris. Many "repairers" do not have the skills to identify them. I have seen them remaining on instruments that are several years old. Another common problem with new instruments is insufficient venting of tone holes. Older instruments may have lint build up in tone holes, especially at the bottom of them.
I agree that A clarinets are more fickle than Bb ones. All the more reason to get them adjusted to their best.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-03-07 10:21
You asked, "Is it just newish and hasn't been really broken in? "
I consider ANY break in period an absolute fallacy. Don't you believe it - from anybody.
'Needs a break-in' period is just a euphemism for "this instrument has not been adjusted (set up) correctly", and "the state of this instrument represents unsatisfactory quality control".
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-03-07 13:24
Gordon (NZ) wrote:
>
> I consider ANY break in period an absolute fallacy. Don't you
> believe it - from anybody.
Remember that this is Gordon's opinion only. Your clarinet manufacturer may have a break-in policy. Whose advice you follow is up to you, but personally I side with the manufacturer for no other reason except to have someone tangible to blame when things go wrong and I <b>have</b> followed all the instructions.
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Author: eilidh
Date: 2001-03-07 21:38
i also experienced similar difficulties with my r13 a that i did not experience with other makes such as leblanc and selmer. I also felt it was very resistant - likewise it had a very clear throat bflat.
I would have to say however that i have tested it for leaks and there are none .My instrument was selected by my teacher who is a professional orchestral player and also by one of his colleagues who in fact was interested in buying it from me as he felt it was a very good instrument but as i say i had difficulties with the instrument that i have not experienced with other makes.
My teacher advised me to practice more on the a and also to experiment with different barrels which i have tried and i did feel this made some difference.
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Author: ron b
Date: 2001-03-07 22:38
Well, Micaela -
I guessed Buffet always meant good quality, fine, excellent very nice horn. Maybe not :(. . . . . . . .
From all the negative posts it looks like I missed my guess - at least about the A ones. I played an A in high school ages ago and, as I recall, I didn't especially care for it. Played kinda stuffy. Wish I could remember what make it was. It was a school instrument for orchestral use. I played it so seldom (nothing important, anyway) it wasn't worth looking into whether it wasn't up to par. I think I eventually just transposed those parts to Bb.
Would still be interesting to know the finding if you can get the one you have checked out at a repair shop. I'd almost bet a box of your favorite reeds they'll find something amiss, that can be corrected, that'll make it play good again. In fact, if they find nothing correctable, e-mail me for your box of reeds.
ron b
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-03-07 22:48
Yes, Mark, only an opinion, but based on a lot of experience with new 'unfinished' instruments.
"Break-in period", I suppose, can also mean the period whebn the clarinet gets the player used to adjusting for and accommodating its idiosyncrasies of design & manufacture. But it is the PLAYER that is broken in. (My opinion again)
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Author: Robert Small
Date: 2001-03-08 05:27
I believe it is a good idea to go easy on a new clarinet so the wood doesn't absorb alot of moisture in a short period of time. Many knowledgeable people say that refraining from playing a new clarinet for more than twenty or thirty minutes a day for the first three or four weeks will help to avoid cracking down the line. I try to follow this advice myself but it can be hard to stick to with a new horn that plays like a dream.
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Author: Robin
Date: 2001-03-08 11:53
Come on folks! A clarinets just are more resistant. Maybe Micaela does have a different problem, but don't expect your B flat to play like your A. It's never going to happen! If you wanted that to be the case, you may as well learn to transpose - horn players manage it.
Robin
(PS Merely my opinion, naturally).
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-03-08 12:09
Just blow with more air pressure then. Do crunches to strengthen those blowing abs.
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