 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Nascosto
Date: 2012-04-29 00:11
Hello,
I have had an interest in the instrument for quite some time, and when I recently discovered one for a reasonable price, that interest was amplified.
The reason why I am posting today is in hope of getting thoughts, information, and advice on a V. Kohlert's & Sons Bb (that dates between 1919 - 1939, and is from Czechoslovakia.)
I would like to know if it is worth my time-- my knowledge on clarinets is obviously limited.
Thank you; I appreciate your time.
- Nascosto
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-04-29 02:15
Nascosto wrote:
> The reason why I am posting today is in hope of getting
> thoughts, information, and advice on a V. Kohlert's & Sons Bb
> (that dates between 1919 - 1939, and is from Czechoslovakia.)
>
> I would like to know if it is worth my time-- my knowledge on
> clarinets is obviously limited.
Kohlert made some very good clarinets when they were still in Kraslice/Graslitz. One thing to be aware of is that to my knowledge Kohlert did not use model names/numbers so you kind of need to know what you are looking at to determine if a particular instrument was a student or pro model.
Whether it is worth pursuing one depends on what you intend to do with it. If you want to learn how to play you would be much better off investing in a newer student instrument than a vintage one. You can often find used Bundy/Vito/Yamaha student models that are freshly repadded for ~$200.
Vintage clarinets are great if you already know how to play and are interested in trying something different but they aren't ideal for a beginner.
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Author: BartHx
Date: 2012-04-29 03:21
If the logo says "Graslitz" it is immediately pre-WWII to somewhat earlier. If it says "Bohemia" it is an earlier model. During WWII, the Germans decided to move Kohlert to Germany for a source of income. At that time, all records were lost and many of their tools were left behind. Up to that point, Kohlert had been making fine instruments of a variety of sorts. After being moved, the quality dropped significantly. At the end of WWII, Kohlert technicians moved to various parts of Euope and the United States, taking the Kohlert name with them. At that point, Kohlerts were being produced by different people in a variety of locations and quality was quite unpredictable.
I used a Graslitz Kohlert through high school and college. It is a fine instrument and I still keep it as a backup even though I now have a collection of Selmers (some fifty years later). The problem I see with a pre-WWII Kohlert at this point is that you would need a collection in order to have repair parts you might need if something breaks. Mine has a pivot rod that a repair shop lost and tried to replace. They were not able to match the thread in the post, so just put in one that was a bit too small. For the time being, nail polish in the screwdriver slot does an adequate job of holding it in place. Eventually, I plan to get around to making a rod with a matching thread or rethreading the post and making a rod to match.
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Author: rennie
Date: 2012-04-29 03:33
Hi,
I'm new to both this Board and the clarinet. As an amateur I do play saxophone for quite a while now (starting in 1980) and played oboe before that. So far my credentials.
The only reason I allow myself to have an opinion on this particular matter is because a few months ago I bought a Kohlert's and Sons Bb clarinet myself. It didn't cost much. When it came it was almost unplayable so I sent it out to my sax repairman (who knows his way around on clarinets too btw ). The result: I overpaid (buying the clarinet, shipping and the repairs came to about 500 euro), but I have a beautiful sounding clarinet that I actually can play in tune - at least 'close enough for jazz' as they say. The wood is on excellent condition, nickel silver keys are in good shape. So I'm happy about it.
All in all I would second the advice above, though, and go for a good student model that is properly set up. I would assume that instruments like that will keep a good resale value.
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Author: Nascosto
Date: 2012-04-30 05:00
It is from Kraslice.
Thank you all very much for your answers-- you have given me definite food for thought, and some very good information.
I figured that there would be risks in purchasing an antique clarinet when I myself know nothing of the instrument, but the unbelievable price enables me to still consider... even if it turned out to be a terrible investment, it wouldn't cause too much concern, in the end.
A nice, contemporary student model would be ideal, of course; except I haven't been able to locate any within a reasonable distance with a reasonable price. We shall see what happens.
Once again, thank you, SteveG_CT, BartHx, and Rennie.
- Nascosto
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-04-30 13:09
Nascosto wrote:
> A nice, contemporary student model would be ideal, of course;
> except I haven't been able to locate any within a reasonable
> distance with a reasonable price. We shall see what happens.
Try contacting Clarinuts. They usually have freshly overhauled student instruments for <$200 and they offer a trial period and warranty. They currently have some Leblanc Vito's for $177 and those are usually pretty good players as far as student clarinets go.
http://www.clarinuts.com/clarinuts/pages/ClarinetItems.asp
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2012-04-30 13:26
The 1920s Kohlerts are good, I've restored three or four of them and have a half-dozen or so unrestored ones on the shelf (they are cheap to buy and readily available despite their age).
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Author: MichaelW
Date: 2012-05-02 15:15
Before WW2 Kohlert instruments were stamped „V.Kohlert’s Söhne, Graslitz, Czecho-Slovakia“. After Nazi Germany had, by the Munich treaty of 1938, taken over the German- Bohemian border region, it was “Graslitz, Sudetengau”, and, after 1945, “V.Kohlerta Synobe Kraslice” till the German (“Sudetendeutsche”) proprietors and craftsmen were expelled, and the former Kohlert workshops taken over by the state owned Amati company. At Winnenden near Stuttgart, Germany they started their business again. The instruments were then stamped “Kohlert & Co. Winnenden” They had to give up, as far as I know, about 1980. In 2010 I saw rests of their stock offered on eBay.
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2012-05-02 16:00
I recently restored a Graslitz Kohlert made, as far as I can ascertain, in the early to mid 30's. I paid only a few buck for it on EBay in unrestored condition. Under layers of crud it turned out to be a fine instrument. The pads and corks were shot, but after a clean-up, oil, repad and recork it scrubbed up very well. The wood is closegrained and dense, with no cracks. The keywork appears to be nickel-silver and buffed up beautifully, with no slop or play. I'd say it had very little use. The throat tones are in tune, the left hand clarion register is a touch sharp and the right hand chalameau register a tad flat. The mouthpiece was probably the original and wasn't very good, although curiously it plays well on a Selmer. I replaced it with a B45 which works well. The tuning is better with the B45 than with the original.
Tony F.
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