 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: SonicManEXE
Date: 2012-04-28 22:43
Hi, everyone. I've been looking around these forums, and I can see that all of you are knowledgeable people when it comes to the clarinet. Now, let me recall the adventure I've had today.
So, today was Founders Day in my town. And, of course, you can't have a day like that without a parade, right? I'm in the Wind Ensemble (The highest band) of my middle school, and we had the opportunity to play with the high school's marching band. Now, until today, I thought my school-rented Selmer was a wood clarinet. And, of course (Again), what happens? In typical Florida fashion, it rains! But seriously, it was pouring. We had to stop and wait under the overhang of the middle school to finish the parade. While we were waiting, I went over to the clarinet captain and said, "So, is my clarinet done for?". She said the pads would be the only problem, but I cut her off and said that it was wood. She looked at me, and basically said that, yes, it was done. Surprisingly, it still worked when we went back out. After the whole thing, my mom and I had lunch and then went out to a local music store. The (very nice) man there said that it is not wood, that it's a (Composite?) resin-plastic, just with a very nice finish. He recommended me to get an ebony or wood/plastic mix so I can take it outside when I join marching band in a few months. We wanted to get a second opinion, so we went to another music store (Which coincidentally happens to be one of the stores the first store stems from), where the manager there told me not to get ANY sort of wood for outside play. He said to rent a plastic during march season and purchase a wooden one for indoor/concert use. I mean, I'm not sure about college and beyond, but for high school, I'm definitely going to be continuing band and the Bb clarinet.
I would be asking which to buy, but after looking around, I have come to the conclusion that: yes, wood clarinets seem to be status symbols have an overall warmer sound, but that doesn't mean that plastic can't sound great with the right mouthpiece/reed combination.
So, my real question is what should I do for marching? I'm definitely going to continue all 4 years of high school and keep it as a hobby or whatnot after, so I'd like to buy one now that can last that long and hopefully longer. Buying one and renting a plastic is not a problem.
If you need to know, I play a Bb clarinet with a Vandoren 3 reed, and my mouthpiece is most likely the Selmer one, considering everything from the bell to the ligature says Selmer.
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-04-28 22:56
The best thing to do is to get a cheap plastic clarinet for marching and have a better clarinet for use during rehearsals and any indoor events. You don't want to use your good clarinet (or your good mouthpiece) for marching as there is a good chance it could get rained on, dropped and trampled, etc. My advice would be to buy a cheap used Bundy or Vito (should be available in ready to play condition for <<$200) for use in marching band and as a backup instrument.
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Author: SonicManEXE
Date: 2012-04-28 23:03
Thank you Steve, but I also forgot to mention that I can spend up to about $850, although the max is probably $900.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2012-04-28 23:14
I've been marching with my wooden clarinet in sunshine, drizzle, rain, sleet and snow, and it's far from being "done for", not even the pads. The only thing I do before some outdoor gig is to oil the keywork so that water won't find a way inside the pivot and rod holes.
Clarinets get wet from the inside all the time, and no one cares (until a hole gets waterlogged). If you get into bad weather, just disassemble the instrument when home and let it rest on a shadowy dry place. Then go and inspect the damage.
I agree that it is a wise choice to have a "war" instrument for outside and a "performance" instrument for inside. It's not so much a question of quality but of maximum damage - the risk of slipping (and consequently dropping the instrument) on horse droppings is magnitudes higher when marching than when performing some Mahler in a concert hall. Besides, it's always comforting to have a familiar backup instrument if your "good 'un" is in the shop.
In my experience, the wood vs plastic debate is a bit overrated. An instrument of proven quality will deliver regardless of the material it was built from, and no one would notice. And if wood were as fragile as some of us would have it, why are there wood houses that are older than the United States?
--
Ben
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2012-04-28 23:25
I'm confused. You already have a non-wood clarinet. Why would you need another one for marching band?
My advice would be to save up some more and put it into buying a decent mid-grade (or better, depending on how much cash you can put away) wood clarinet for indoor concert and rehearsal use.
The advantage of wood isn't, according to the physicists, an acoustical one. But it isn't just a status symbol, either. The fact is that, because wood is assumed (by pretty much everyone except the physicists) to be a better material for music instruments, the better ones are made of wood. So, by buying a wood clarinet, you are - in general - likely to be buying better workmanship and better design, since the assumption of most manufacturers is that serious players would not buy a plastic/composite clarinet even if the workmanship and design were identical to their best wood instruments. The closest a major manufacturer comes to it, as far as I know, is the Buffet Greenline series (made from a wood and resin composite), and players argue, sometimes passionately, over whether they are as good as the instruments made from natural wood.
BTW, relative to your clarinet captain's reaction when she thought you had a wood clarinet, in the short run it wouldn't be rain on the wood that might cause a problem. The really vulnerable part of the instrument in a downpour would still be the pads, which doesn't change with the material the clarinet is made of. The main threat to wood is quick temperature changes, like blowing warm breath through an ice-cold clarinet on a football field in mid-November or at a Christmas parade. The trees they make clarinets from somehow manage to survive lots of rain without damage, and the clarinet is constantly getting wet from the inside every time it's played.
Maybe I misunderstood something in your original post. If so, tell me.
Karl
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Author: SonicManEXE
Date: 2012-04-28 23:52
Well, kdk, I can't keep my instrument now because I rent it from my school. It's not like a store rental, I can't keep it. It belongs to the school, and in less than 2 months' time, I won't be part of that school anymore. And no, I don't think you misread anything, your information was helpful.
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2012-04-29 00:26
I don't know how your school district operates. In the one I recently retired from, we often allowed a student who was borrowing an instrument from one of our schools to keep it through high school. It may be there's a line of people waiting to borrow it where you are now, and your current director doesn't want to let it leave his building, but it would be worth asking (if you haven't already).
Karl
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Author: SonicManEXE
Date: 2012-04-29 00:57
That's a very good suggestion, but I literally can't. I've asked him. It must be some district policy, because I know that we must have 40 or more clarinets in the two Beginning bands, along with the 10-12 in my band and however many there are in the indermediate band, and he's never once said anything about renting through an outside source.
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2012-04-29 01:25
Look for a serviceable, used plastic/rubber clarinet that you can pick up for a song. Despite their reputations, the old Resonite Bundy clarinets are almost indestructible. Use this for marching, and NEVER use whatever instrument you get for your "good" clarinet (the concert instrument) for marching. Too many ways to destroy the good instrument by exposing it to the elements and also the abuse of marching band.
A good performer for about $1000 is the Ridenour Lyrique clarinet, model 576 BC.
You can get one without a mouthpiece, but with case, two tuning barrels, swab and cork grease directly from Tom Ridenour for $960.00. That clarinet should keep you going through High School and beyond, unless you want to be a performance major in college. It would be fine for college, but most schools would want you to have one of the major manufacturers' pro-grade wooden instruments by that point. The Ridenour is made of hard rubber, and should never crack, unlike wood. I bought one a few years ago, and they are quite impressive. Plus, the personal service of buying direct from the maker is great!
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
Post Edited (2012-04-29 01:27)
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Author: SonicManEXE
Date: 2012-04-29 01:34
Yeah, I was looking in to the Ridenour clarinets. I thought it was interesting how he looked into the whole blackwood myth, which is why I'm seriously considering not getting wood in favor of something else, like the Lyrique.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2012-04-29 01:44
You can get a Bundy or Vito on the Goodwill site for under $20, but figure on it being in leaky condition. An overhaul with new pads and general refurbishment can cost up to $200. I know a good repair tech who buys these in bunches, fixes them up and sells them for $200.
Buy only Bundy (a/k/a Selmer USA), Vito, Buffet or Yamaha. Almost all others are junk, and dreadful quality even for junk.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2012-04-29 03:00
I've run into too many Bundys with really nasty, unserviceable intonation.......shorten that list to Vito and Yamaha for CHEAP and reliable.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-04-29 03:40
Get a Yamaha for marching. I never had any problems with mine, it was always reliable and I never had to worry about mishandling it. They are the most in tune student horn that you will find; however, they sound dead, but, its just marching band. Selmers, Jupiters, and Leblanc are good too.
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Author: BartHx
Date: 2012-04-29 03:49
When I was in high school and college, resin instruments were few and far between. I used my wooden one for everything. I used the same instrument from direct sun (100°+F) to football games below 32°F to rain (where at one point it got dropped INTO a muddy field). However, I was careful to follow the advice given in the third response (from tictactux) with no problems at all. I then continued into concert season with the same instrument. I still have it in my collection some fifty years later.
However, with a used resin instrument in good condition easily available now for less than (sometimes much less than) $200, I think I would get one and be a little more gentle on the wood one.
I would suggest that you hold off on investing in a quality, wooden instrument until you are more established as a player and less likely to undergo changes associated with growth.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2012-04-29 11:41
For what it's worth, I just discoverd that Hanson came out with a new student clarinet made of some Greenline-like material (they call it Reinforced Grenadilla) and silver-plated keys at roughly £300 (w/o VAT).
Apparently they're redocorating their web pages, here's Google's cached version of that page.
(No affiliation with the manufacturer)
--
Ben
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Author: William
Date: 2012-04-29 16:09
Clarinets are usually inaudible in an average high school marching band, so don't worry about "warmth" of sound and use the cheapest, most durable equipment you can find. I would recommend a Selmer Bundy resonite clarinet and Legere reeds. You are correct, however, that the mouthpiece and reed set-up can produce a decent sound on a plastic instrument.
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Author: bbrandha
Date: 2012-04-30 04:13
I played my wooden clarinet in a horseback band for 5 years with no damage whatsoever. We don't play in the winter and I don't know that it ever got rained on. It cracked about 2 months after I joined a nice, sitdown orchestra group.
Only once in 20+ years of playing a plastic clarinet in the band did I hurt my plastic clarinet. I broke it in two.
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Author: LJBraaten
Date: 2012-04-30 05:34
I'd extend the list if you are buying a second plastic clarinet just for outdoor use. I bought an Olds plastic student clarinet from Craigs list for $40, and it sounds great (with a good mouthpiece). The advantage of this type of purchase is that I took my mouthpiece with me so I could test it before buying.
Laurie
Laurie (he/him)
Post Edited (2012-04-30 05:35)
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Author: dgclarinet
Date: 2012-04-30 13:57
I'd like to put in another good word for Bundies. My mom rented a Bundy for me 45 years ago (somehow ended up owning it)...played that all the way through high school, sometimes outside when playing dixieland jobs and through my sons' high school and college years. It's still in my closet and I don't remember ever changing anything on the horn...maybe a pad fell out a few times, but the thing really is indestructable.
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