 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ukebert
Date: 2006-01-23 20:38
Hi all,
I've seen some clarinet keywork modifications around recently; Stephen Fox does some, and Runyon do one.
What is out there, is any of it beneficial, and do any of you have an ideal setup?
Regards,
ukebert
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2006-01-23 21:53
It depends entirely on the size and shape of your palms and fingers. If you're having pain, or you're having trouble reaching certain keys, by all means have a modification done. First, though, go to a physical therapist who specializes in musicians for an evaluation and advice on what to try.
Perry Ritter in NYC makes key modifications, and I've been told that he's good, though I've never seen his work. Mark Jacoby in Philadelphia should be able to do them, too.
Ken Shaw
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Author: crnichols
Date: 2006-01-24 09:57
The first modification that I would recommend is the thumb rest for the right hand. They are almost always too low, even the adjustable ones in their highest position are often too low. I would recommend going to someone that you trust with a drill and your clarinet (ie probably not your dad), and show them how your hand looks in it's relaxed form. If you apply that position to the clarinet, you will discover where the thumbrest should be placed for you. I remember reading an article a few years ago where Gigliotti commented on how painful it was for him to play a clarinet that didn't have the thumbrest moved into the proper position. After I had mine moved, I couldn't believe the difference.
Christopher Nichols
1st Infantry Division Band
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2006-01-24 11:58
It turned out after several years of pain in my right hand that the root cause was the thumbrest being too close to the side keys (too close to the upper joint).
When we stop, and look at the clarinet in our hands it is no longer dangling in front of us with the full weight of gravity upon the thumb. This might give one the wrong sense of where everthing should be positioned. In the playing position, the thumb is stretched fairly well down beyond a natural resting position (look at your hand in front of your face, fingers pointing to the left, palm toward you. The thumb sits perfectly in line with the index finger. Now press on the thumb with the approximate force of a clarinet and the thumb will now be across from the ring finger....roughly.).
If the thumb rest is positioned too close to the upper joint, the index finger will fall WAY above the Bb/Eb side key........but we manage to play it all the time, right? What you wind up doing is not lowering your index finger laterally (the damn middle finger is in the way even if you could) but we lift the clarinet up and out of the way with the thumb. This increases the stress on that joint exponentially.
That having been said, the original question I believe refers to modifications to the keys that make the instrument play easier. The only thing I would change at all to keys of a standard French system clarinet (which is pretty ergonomic all things considered) would be to add the rollers between the Right Hand C/F and Eb/Ab that you see on the Wurlitzer reform Boehm (oh, the extra vents he adds do wonders for the intonation issues!).
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2006-01-24 16:58
The Buffet key design is old enough to have been created when people were smaller, and had smaller hands than today. My palms are wide and my fingers are fairly long, and, regardless of the thumb rest position, I find the lowest side key, for Eb/Bb, touches below the middle knuckle of my right index finger. That means I have to press it by straightening out my finger, or cocking it around in an uncomfortable position.
The solution would be to mount the trill keys more toward the front of the instrument. Looking down the instrument from the mouthpiece, for me the proper location of the keys would be at around 2:00 o'clock, rather than 2:30.
Leblanc's "jump key" instruments have the trill keys in just the right place for me. My fingers fit them as if they were custom-fitted to my hands. If the design could be applied to my R-13, I'd get it in a minute.
On one clarinet, I had a repairman extend the key about 3/16", but it was still at the wrong angle. I've asked people about making extensions that curve slightly over the top of the instrument, but no one has been interested.
For a major-league modification, see Rosario Mazzeo's clarinet at http://www.usd.edu/smm/Mazzeocollection.html and http://www.usd.edu/smm/Mazzeoclarinets.html.
Ken Shaw
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Author: ukebert
Date: 2006-01-25 17:12
The Mazzeo is the kind of thing. Two of the mods, the bis key and the RH C# are produced by Stephen Fox, but i dont know how they'd sound. However, I may buy one to see, if I can face the shipping to england.
ukebert
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-01-25 17:43
Yamaha are still not doing themselves any favours by keeping the C#/G# key touch as short as they're doing - I've even extended one of these (on an old YCL-62) by about 10mm by cutting and adding a 10mm section, but specifically for a player who had the tip of his LH little finger chopped off, also bent the LH levers outwards to ease playability.
Even though I do have fairly large hands I find the G# touch on Yamahas a bit on the short side, and the same with Buffets.
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-03-19 06:53
I know that this is an old thread but I think it needs a little reviving. For all you DIYers out there I have
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-03-19 07:02
Attachment: IMG_20120319_015049.jpg (1136k)
I know that this is an old thread but I think it needs a little reviving. For all you DIYers out there I found a pretty decent way to get a modded C#/G# aux and a bis (or half hole) key. Using an old A key, a half round file, and brazing equipment one can easily make both of these. Remover the tube and the pad cup (save the cup), then shape the end where the pad cup was to fit w/ your C#/G# key. Then braze. For the Bis just take the old pad cup and shape it so it fits snugly with your tone hole between L1 and L2. Then braze (though for this one I used super glue as I may replace it with something closer to an oboe half hole key as I grew quite fond of the half hole during the sort period of time that me and the oboe got along.
Any interesting mods that y'all have seen lately?
Post Edited (2012-03-19 07:05)
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Author: bethmhil
Date: 2012-03-20 00:48
Thank you for digging this up... I've been considering having some work done to the keys on my clarinet for a while now. Stephen Fox makes a "bis" key for clarinet... I believe Weiner Music sells them on their website.
Does anyone know of anything that could elongate the Eb/Bb side trill key? Saxophonists have palm key risers and all sorts of crazy things that help them "fit into" their instruments better... I have short fingers and I have to straighten my index finger painfully at times to reach the darn side key. If I move my thumb rest up anymore, I won't be able to reach the right hand keys on the lower joint!
BMH
Illinois State University, BME and BM Performance
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-03-20 07:49
That one is really easy, get some key bending pliers (ie. pliers with plastic/rubber jaws or jaw covers) and bend the key. I did not bend mine all the way and it goes to the tone hole above R1 (though the picture doesn't show that). I would be careful not to get over zealous in key bending as bending to much, or too quickly (use a series of small bends) can break the key. I moved it not due to small hands but to keep an economy of motion (instead of moving my pointer finger up the clarinet, I just bend the knuckle part of my joint.
Also, if you are having right hand issues most of that is due to the thumb rest. I have a Ton Kooiman thumb rest (it is quite good and getting your right hand into more natural positions) and I use a brace strap (but, I am weird and hate having to deal with mechanical inefficiencies and neck pain). You could probably free up the movement in your pointer finger with either of those as well.
Also also, Steven Fox makes both the "bis" and the aux G#/C#. I like my "bis" better because it has two fuctionalities: the bis functionality, and it is a good platform to roll onto to perform a half-hole. I use half-hole fingerings for altissimo notes (though I spent a lot of time training my finger to do that on oboe and the bass clarinet).
Post Edited (2012-03-20 08:47)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2012-03-21 02:11
I have exactly the same problem, except that I have wide hands and long fingers and have to straighten out my right index finger and move my wrist to reach the bottom Eb/Bb side key.
The problem, I've discovered, is that the keys are too far around the side of the instrument for my anatomy. If you look down from the top, the keys (on my R13) are at about 2:30 on a clock face. By contrast, the Leblanc "jump" key design puts the keys at about 2:00, which fits me perfectly and lets me hit the Eb/Bb key with the upper end of my finger without contortions. I had the fingertip end of the key on my R13 lengthened by about 3/16". It would be even better if the extension were curved around over the body.
The bent out solution, it seems to me, puts the contact point almost down to the knuckle and would require movement of the hand itself rather than the finger. At any rate, it wouldn't work with my large hands. Anatomy is destiny.
Ken Shaw
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-03-21 03:02
It would put the contact point at the knuckle if I had a normal thumb rest. But, I have the monstrosity of a thumb rest by ton kooiman (I would recommend it, though it can be quite odd to get used too). It moves my hand away from the horn, which nice because I have massive hands (for the sake of proving that it could work for you my palm is 4 1/2 by 4 inches and my pointer is 4 in from the knuckle and 3 from the flap of skin). With all of that the Eb key rests quite comfortably right at the second joint from the tip of my finger (wikipedia states that it is called the second knuckle). So, instead of poking my finger down (which usually results in little to no movement in my second knuckle) I just make the second knuckle go down. It really is quite nice, no vertical movement of my pointer required, I just bend it at different angles.
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