 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: col
Date: 2001-02-06 05:28
I am interested in what speed approx single tounging should be used on clarinet before switching to double tounging. I understand this will differ for every person but i am trying to figure out whether i should improve my single tounging or switch to double tounging specifically in the nielsen concerto where semiquavers have to be tounged at 4 semis to 144. At present i can single tounge at 4 semis to 130. Therefore would it be better to work on this and try building it up to 144 or just switching to double tounging ?
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Author: Eoin McAuley
Date: 2001-02-06 07:20
Some people feel that you should never switch to double tonguing, that any reasonable speed can be achieved just as easily with single tonguing. Having said that, I'm not in the stakes at all for the "fastest tongue".
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-02-06 12:03
All very well to say that. On flute (my main instrument) I spent months focussed on speeding up my single tongueing from semiquavers played at 100 crotchets beats per minute. It made not a scrap opf difference. Now decades later, and a lot of playing experience, I still have not sped up one scrap. I double tongue very successfully on flute. I struggle on clarinet.
I believe there can be limiting factors for individuals, perhaps a maximum speed at which the tongue nerves transmit movement messages, or a minimum response time for the tongue muscles before each movement. Is there a neurolo-muscular expert out there?
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Author: William
Date: 2001-02-06 14:31
I don't think that it is possible to markedly improve on the speed with which your tongue is able to perform (I speak from a lifetime of faliure to be like Robert Spring, single tongue style). So, unless you are born with an agile licker, and you need to play little works like the Nielson, you have to resort to alternative means (double-tonguing). John-Bruce Yeh told me personally that he used an "over-the-tip" style of double articulation to record his version of the N. Concerto. K. Opperman advocateds the use of ta-ta-ka in tonguing the Fetes. Charles Nedich uses double and triple tonguing techniques. The great Al Goladoro is also a master of multiple tonguing skills. SO, with all of this history in the ranks of the pros, why are we so reluctant to teach it in the colleges and make it as common a practice for clarinetists as it already is for many other instrumentalists? If it works for you, "just do it."
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Author: Brent
Date: 2001-02-06 15:05
I have found that as i work on double tonguing my single tonguing speed has increased measurably as well. I don't think i will ever single-tongue faster than 132-136, though, and the double-tonguing is coming along quite well now that i've got some guidance on it. It surely doesn't hurt to know how, even if you don't like it much.
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Author: ------
Date: 2001-02-06 22:04
I don't see why you should try to double tongue when, through expierence if you work hard you willl achieve a really fast single tongue. Last year the fastest I could do was 132, but after being told to play the Dances of Galanta, I had no option but to learn how to tongue quickly. After an hour a day of articulation exercises I can now easily articulate up to 152, something that helps me get through most major repertoire, although the Bartered Bride is still on edge!
Anyway, I think the main problem with articulation is that it is a stamina thing. Most people can play two or three notes at 180, why not 20 or 30? With the right practice you should be able to build up your stamina to be able to single tongue the Nielsen.
Happy Playing
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-02-07 02:15
But, ------, why not use double tonguing if you can do it? It's like circular breathing - just another technique in our bag of tricks. It's not something that you need to learn early on, and perhaps you'll never need to learn, but if you <b>can</b> learn without detriment to other required skills - well, you may as give it a try. There's contemporary pieces that can and do utilize this technique.
Let's not decide that something isn't worth learning just because it wasn't used a hundred years ago.
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2001-02-10 10:19
There is no hard and fast rule. I have talked to a particular brass player an American but principal trumpet in the Sydney Symphony Orchestra whose single tougeing is pathetic barely able to plat semiquavers at march tempo who double tounges most of the time. Work on whichever gives you the best results especially the Ka part of the double tounge which can sometimes be used effectively on its own. If you want to hear some double toungeing used to great effect on a single reed listen to some recordings of Frank Trumbaer in the 20's playing the C melody sax.
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