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Author: ClarinetistDad
Date: 2011-08-17 09:22
Thanks everyone for your help on my previous question. Now I have part deux.
My daughter received her Buffet Festival clarinet yesterday. We let it acclimate to the house temperature, which is about 76 degrees, with probably more humidity than we would like, but that's summer in the Washington, DC area.
Anyway, she played the horn for about 15 minutes and we have a few observations.
First, generally it sounds very sweet. She used a tuner app on her iPhone (iStrobosoft) and found that ( think "C") was sharp about 10 cents or more - whatever that means. Then she played her Signet Signature vintage wood clarinet and it was sharp about 15 - 20 cents. Finally, she played it on a Ridenour Lyrique and it was almost spot-on. (She was using the shorter barrel (65mm), and thought that is what made it sharp - but because we couldn't remove the barrel from the upper joint, she didn't get the chance to play it with the longer (66mm) barrel. )
As mentioned above, when she tried to take the barrel off the upper joint, she could not. It would not budge. We sat it atop an AC vent (wrapped in a fine cloth) and then cranked-up the AC. We were able to separate it after a short while.
So, here are my questions.
The place we purchased the horn suggested we bring it in for them to shave it...not the cork though. I have no idea what they mean about shaving, but I have some reservations on what will happen in the Fall and Winter if it is shaved now.
Also, I have some concerns about it being out of tune.
Rather than shaving it and to deal with the tune issue, I suggested to my daughter that we return to the store with the tuner and she can play a few more horns to find one a bit more in tune. Also, maybe another clarinet will not bind as much.
The music center we are working with is wonderful so I know there will be no problem to return and try a few more clarinets, that is not an issue. Therefore, my question is would it be a good idea to try to find a horn that's more in tune...is that possible. And second, how good an idea is it to shave the horn so it does not bind - and what does that mean anyway.
Any thoughts, suggestions or comments?
Thanks so much.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-08-17 09:30
Adjustment of the tenon should be all that's needed.
Tuning will be different on different horns as well and is also a matter of "settling in" (not the horn...... the player). Of course THIS should be one of the critical criteria covered in the "trying-it-out-process," I think unless there are glaring errors in the internal pitch amongst notes, you should be fine.
................Paul Aviles
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2011-08-17 10:09
Re the in-tuneness - agree with Paul.
A player should aim to be in tune *with other players*, not slavishly try to please an electronic tuner. Every instrument has a sore note here and there, and none is perfectly in tune all the time. And even if it were, other players aren't, so ... use your ears.
And yes, the 65mm barrel is for A=442 while the longer one is for A=440 Hz.
--
Ben
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2011-08-17 13:02
The stuck joint is caused by wood-against-wood binding -- the tip of the tenon against the bottom of the socket. This frequently happens with new instruments.
This is an emergency. It can quickly cause the tenon to crack. If your daughter likes the clarinet, you need to take it back to the dealer for adjustment ASAP, without playing it or even putting that joint together.
There has been disagreement on the board on whether the barrel socket should be reamed out at the bottom or the end of the tenon filed down. Certainly filing down the tenon is easier. However, that makes it a non-standard size and can make any new barrel wobble.
Kalmen Opperman, who made a number of barrels for my R13s, said he always used a reamer to adjust the socket at the bottom of the barrel.
Kal used a single-purpose reamer, with a guide that fitted up the barrel bore, to keep things aligned. The work can be done with a sharp curved chisel, but it's fiddly. Almost all repair shops file down the end of the tenon instead.
You might ask for an exchange Buffet barrel, but your daughter should try it, since barrels vary greatly in response and intonation.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-08-17 13:27
Ken,
I have watched many of these posts about tenon/barrels but it has occured to me that without another barrel for comparison, one doesn't know whether the offender is indeed the barrel or rather the top of the tenon. It seems to me that given this simple scenario, the tenon could very well be the object that is not at the correct dimension and bringing down its diameter could be the absolutely correct solution.
Much like your original argument, it would not make sense to be compelled to ream out every barrel you purchase.
................Paul Aviles
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Author: ClarinetistDad
Date: 2011-08-17 19:00
Well, we are back from the music center. They were very accommodating and willing to have my daughter try other Festival's while they sent her's to the on-site repair shop.
(For many of you who live here in the Washington DC area, I am certain you know the center I am talking about...they are the only one that would have so many high end instruments to try and an on-site repair shop. They are fantastic! The customer service is beyond outstanding. When you try out the clarinets, they take you into a private room upstairs rather than standing at a counter. We could not be more pleased with the individuals that assisted us in the purchase. There was no pressure and no sense at all that they were trying to either up-sell or just make a sale. But, I do imagine that the salesperson are commissioned in some form.)
The sound of her Festival was much sweeter than the one she was given to try- no comparison for us. She decided to keep hers without trying others. When her instrument was returned, the barrel fit perfect on the joint. As far as the tenon goes, we're not certain what they did, but everything works fine now.
(And it was probably the tenon rather than the barrel that needed "fixing" since the 65mm barrel was almost impossible to remove and the 66mm barrel would not sit all the way down on the tenon.)
Now if you want to debate amongst yourselves something superficial, why do some Festival cases have the Buffet logo and hardware in gold while some are silver? Go figure!
Thanks again all....wish I played the clarinet too rather than being just a spectator for my daughter.
As they say at the Buffet factory - c'est la vie
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Author: Joanna
Date: 2011-08-18 03:15
I had the same problem with my Selmer. The barrel would stick in the summer. I've solved that by having the tenon shaved down and the cork adjusted so that there is more cork on it to prevent sticking. It's a common problem, so don't worry about it!
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2011-08-19 01:11
Was this Washington Music Center in Silver Springs Maryland; or perhaps Dales Music? If so Washington Music Center should work with you and they carry about 20 to 25 R13 clarinets in the basement. You could try out a few more and experiment with assorted barrals. 10 cents is alot, although high "C" is usually a tad sharp; 10 cents is a lot. If you bought the clarinet from Washington Music one of the repairmen can adjust this.
If Eddie Palanker pops in from the Baltimore Symphony, he could lead you to a few good repair men and have the horn tuned.
As I said above if you keep this horn take the time to break it in. Also check out the mouthpiece she is playing. Bores and lengths vary greatly amoung mouthpieces.
If it is Washington Music, you may wish to make an appointment so you can take your time picking out another clarinet or fixing the tuning problem.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2011-08-19 01:16)
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