 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: janlynn
Date: 2011-06-23 18:47
In April I got a new R13. Unfortunately, it wasnt until I got home that I noticed a problem.
The problem was whenever I went from like left hand D to open G, or E to G, or any note to open G there was like a "glitch".
My teacher thought it was a sticky pad but when I brought it back to where I bought it he said it was - and showed me these 2 levers on the side of the clarinet - CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT THATS CALLED? those mechanisms werent functioning properly.
so, he fixed it and last night I noticed it has the same problem again.
I'm worried that this is going to be an ongoing problem on my new clarinet. Can someone tell me if this is something that is easy or hard to solve? Is this an area on the clarinet that once out of whack cant function properly again? hoping someone who knows will say this is no big deal.
If it keeps happening what are my options? Do you replace keys? or the whole joint or what??? is it likely to even come down to that?
I have a call into the tech but havent heard back yet.
I got my clarinet from a respected tech and buffet dealer, Michael Leonard.
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Author: William
Date: 2011-06-23 20:54
All new clarinets need to be "set up" before they are sold. Usually, this simply involves oiling of the keys and some minor linkage adjustments. In my opinion, these should not be your responsiblility--the dealers tech should perform these adjustments for free. But David is right, there is nothing that cannot be fixed.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2011-06-23 21:01
What you are talking about is the connection linkage for the F to G.
I'll bet it never acts up from F# to G, but does when playing F to G, or lower to G.
The cork in that linkage can wear, and get stuck causing a clicking. There are better materials that can be used to eliminate that problem.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2011-06-23 21:40
The linkage from LH1 could also be catching on the sides of the slot or arch in the trill keys which is made narrow due to all the keys being silver plated, so check LH1 ring operates on its own without any resistance which could mean it's catching somewhere. This is easily cured by filing the slot in the trill keys wider to make good clearance.
I've found the slot sometimes isn't deep enough so closing LH1 or the left thumb can open the trill keys if the trill key pads are too thin and there's a lot of opening on the G vent pad (connected to LH1 ring). This is easily cured by filing the slot in the offending trill key a little deeper or at an angle to allow the overlever to travel fully without making contact.
Most commonly the lever from the thumb is chewing through the cork on the underside of the overlever (connected to LH1) causing it to stick. This can be cured easily by replacing the cork with a much harder wearing material such as tech cork (high density rubberised cork) and coating the surface wih graphite or teflon powder to make it slippery. Buffet had loads of trouble with this when they started using synthetic cork as it wasn't very hard wearing and the glue was very sticky, so the thumb ring would stick down. It also helps to round off the end of the thumb ring lever so there's no sharp edge which can dig into the material stuck to the underside of the overlever.
On thumb rings, never coat both sides of the lever with cork as that's no good. You only need felt (or similar soft material) on the underside of the thumb lever to stop it clattering against the body of the clarinet and the LH1 overlever needs a hard wearing material (such as tech cork) stuck to the underside of it to prevent the thumb lever chewing through it.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2011-06-24 15:35
On my new Lyrique, the thumb ring's pivot had a burr that would stick the key. I honed it by poking some automotive rubbing compound into the bore and spinning the pivot rod in the slurry.
Easy to do. Car parts store has the rubbing compound, and the disassembly and replacement are simple.
Be sure to clean out the abrasive before putting things back together.
Of course, neither of us should have had our horns come to us in that condition.
Bob Phillips
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2011-06-24 20:52
I thought Tom Ridenour meticulously inspects and adjusts each of his clarinets before shipping them to customers. How could something that obvious escape detection?
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Buster
Date: 2011-06-24 21:23
janlynn,
Unfortunately you may need to throw that top joint into the fire and get a new one.................................
Not. No need to freak out. I don't know the "tech" name for that mechanism other than the F-F#-G mechanism. You don't need to replace keys or anything of the sort.
I see you got your clarinet in April, and it just happened again. When a clarinet is relatively young the wood will swell/fluctuate a bit more than when it's a bit more "broken-in".
As David said, try F# to G. If there is no hesitation then the problem is the thumb key. The wood may have swelled a bit. Or the lower lever could be digging into the cork as Chris mentioned. Perhaps a bit of light key oil will clear it up. Or the cork may need replaced. (I actually have a synthetic Teflon "cork" that a repairman put there.) What ever the cause, rest assured it is a simple fix.
The dealer/tech you purchased the instrument through should take care of it at no charge- in fact I would insist upon it.
-JH
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2011-06-24 22:10
Never apply oil or grease to any key corks as it only causes them to fall off or stick to the body.
The only place key oil is to be used is in the mechanism to reduce friction and wear between the key barrels and screws and nowhere else.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: janlynn
Date: 2011-06-24 22:47
thanks for the replies everyone!
so i talked to the tech and he told me the first time I brought it in he replaced the cork on it.
he said now that it has happened again so quickly he thinks its the angle of the 2 levers and he will adjust them. Does that sound right to you folks?
he told me first to try sanding it with a fine grit sand paper which I did. It seemed to help until I practiced tonight and I could still feel a bit of a "hitch" - it was slight, but it still makes a difference and i'm starting to slow down when I know i'm going to play that note in anticipation of this happening.
I sanded it a bit more tonight. will see how it goes in my lesson tomorrow.
If it continues do you think I should let him adjust the levers?
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2011-06-24 23:55
@Jack,
There were a surprising number of glitches in the mechanism of my Lyrique A.
The toward-the-body sides of the trill keys are convex. They strike the bridge mechanism and the C#/G# key as it passes under them. The latter made it impossible to play Clarion Ab-Bb-Ab switches because the keys would collide. I had to notch for the C#/G# key and grind and bend the 2nd trill key for throat F# to clear the bridge.
The LH pinky C uses a "rocker" like the Buffets, and that has a high leverage, so the touch piece moves much further than it needs to move. It nearly wraps onto the left side of the lower joint.
The LH B and C# keys "lift" the cross-over mechanism from below, which gets rid of the fragile pins used in Buffets --but the venting of those pads is really sensitive to the thickness of the stop corks under the left hand levers.
The RH sliver key rubs my thumb when played.
The burr in the thumb ring hinge bore had to be ground away.
It does sound good, plays pretty much (but not spectacularly so) in tune. Tuning flaws are probably exacerbated by my fiddling with the venting as I worked through the mechanism.
Bob Phillips
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Author: jbutler ★2017
Date: 2011-06-27 22:08
There maybe some offset in the keys side to side...that's what I'm thinking your tech meant by not lining up. I may be wrong. If this keeps happening then I would request that the tech drill a minute shallow hole in the top of the arm of the thumb ring (#60 drill) and insert a piece of teflon bead cut and finished to fit. No cork will be used at all or to wear out.
John B
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2011-06-29 07:28
It's not completely clear what is causing the problem but seems the repair wasn't relaible anyway. Any good repairer should be able to fix it reliably.
I have both done and reversed what John B suggests above. A few comments. Usually nylon is used instead of teflon. Teflon can be a problem to glue since it's non-gluable really (its purpose pretty much). I haven't actually had a teflon fall off, but I've tried to remove them on purpose as a test and considered they are too easy to remove...
With both nylon and teflon I don't personally like this linkage much. It can be noisy. I prefer a good material glued with excellent glue. For this linakge I usually use either synthetic felt, rubber cork or microfiber imitation leather, sometimes with teflon glued over it. Not too thick so it doesn't "dent".
Often modifying the linkage to better shape too.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2011-06-29 14:49
Quote:
Never apply oil or grease to any key corks as it only causes them to fall off or stick to the body. Whoops....although it was a quick fix before a concert, and it's to that E/F linkage that we're talking about, so it won't stick to the body. But yes, if that cork gets worn and compressed, it can stick. You can check by pressing VERY hard on the thumb F ring and letting go and seeing if it's a slow or delayed return.
I had a clarinet in the past that had a piece of nylon there that was GREAT. But I'm not a fan of cork in that place. I'd prefer felt, or nylon, leather, or something else.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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