 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: valsneff
Date: 2010-12-15 18:08
Ok, so I know that this topic has been addressed time and time again, but my situation has somewhat of a little twist to it. My tounge is more likely to bleed when I am working on tounging passages, but not after super long practice sessions. It often only takes around 10-15 minutes of articulation practice to make my tounge bleed lightly, and it only gets heavier and more sore from there. None of my teachers have really been able to adress why this happens. It doesn't happen consistently either, but frequently enough that I don't want to take a couple days break after only practicing like 10 minutes.
Also, I'm pretty sure that I'm tounging correctly. I've had loads of tounging problems in the past (I used to be one of those awful "throat toungers." Lol.), but I tounge slightly below the tip of my tounge, to slightly below the tip of my reed. Has anyone heard of or experienced this before, and give me a clue? Thanks!
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Author: grifffinity
Date: 2010-12-15 19:16
This sounds odd...unless the tip rail of your mouthpiece is incredibly sharp...or if you are tonguing at the opening between the reed tip and tip rail instead of hitting the reed side.
Have you seen a dentist? There may be something wrong with your tongue that is obviously making the area you use to articulate extremely sensitive to friction.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2010-12-15 19:40
The first thing that comes to my mind is that you're pressing your tongue hard against the tip edge of the reed, which implies that you'd be tonguing in the opening. But you say you are tonguing "slightly below the tip of my reed." You still may be pressing your tongue too hard against the reed and the natural upward curve of your tongue as you press it against the reed's surface is driving your tongue up against the tip edge. Can you tell where exactly your tongue is cut when it starts bleeding? Is it (a) at the tip or (b) on the top surface past where you contact the reed? If it's (a), I don't know what to think except that you've found a way to use sandpaper in place of the reed. If it's (b), think about how hard you're pushing your tongue against the reed. It should normally be light contact, just enough to interrupt the reed's vibration. Remember that you aren't starting the reed with your tongue ("attacking"). The air starts the reed when you withdraw your tongue at the beginning of a tone. The tongue then stops the reed to end the note.
Karl
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2010-12-15 21:02
Second Kdk,
You must practice merely placing the tongue on the reed, air going, no sound. To initiate sound you withdraw togue and voila, there is sound. This MUST be practiced VERY slowly to start to get it right.
"Attack" is merely descriptive of the SOUND, NOT the physiology.
................Paul Aviles
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Author: TianL
Date: 2010-12-15 21:46
are you tonguing too hard? my tongue used to touch the reed just a bit too hard, but that was enough to cut it. it never happens anymore to me.
also my guess would be if your tongue got hurt but you didn't rest long enough for it to completely heal, then it will likely to get cut again.
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Author: ddavani
Date: 2010-12-16 04:01
I've had this exact problem before. I found that using the asymmetrical mouthpiece wasn't beneficial to my tonguing, but only produced a darker tone (which was a little spready). I was putting too much effort into tonguing and I ended up breaking the skin on my tongue. My remedy was switching to a MoBa mouthpiece which had a symmetrical facing, and allows for quick, light, and gentle tonguing. My tongue hasn't bled since I switched.
What kind of mouthpiece do you use? My diagnosis may not be the case for you and it could be something completely different and possibly a medical problem. I'll be able to tell if you're tonguing too hard if you let me know what your mouthpiece is and recommend a remedy (doesn't have to be Backun).
-Dave Davani
http://allclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: valsneff
Date: 2010-12-16 04:24
Hey guys. Thanks for all your responses!
Grifffinity: I'm actually seeing my dentist tomorrow, so I'm going to ask about it then. I always kind of just assumed it was a technique problem, but better safe than sorry right?
kdk: Sometimes when my tounge is bleeding, I'll look at it in the mirror, and the little blood spot always seem to be slightly below the tip of my tounge, around where I'm bleeding. It could be that I'm possibly tounging too low on my tounge, but I wouldn't be surprised if you are right and I am just simply tounging too hard. I tend to work on legato tounging, which is easier for me, and then get more staccato, so my tounge probably isn't as swift and deft as it needs to be.
TianL: There wasn't really a specific moment when I injured my tounge. This is just something that happens every so often, but it does seem to happen more often when the reed is new and not as broken in. To me, new reeds almost seem to feel a little like sand paper. They definitely aren't as soft as the broken in ones. That could be a reason.
ddavani: I used a Vandoren M13. I think it's a pretty common model.
Thank you all for your suggestions!
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Author: kdk
Date: 2010-12-16 12:42
valsneff wrote:
>
> kdk: Sometimes when my tounge is bleeding, I'll look at it in
> the mirror, and the little blood spot always seem to be
> slightly below the tip of my tounge, around where I'm bleeding.
>
What does "below the tip" mean? The underside of your tongue or back from the tip on the top surface?
>
> I used a Vandoren M13. I think it's a pretty common
> model.
>
Not an asymmetrical facing. But any facing with too hard a reed can be a prescription for articulation problems.
Karl
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Author: ddavani
Date: 2010-12-17 01:00
I wouldn't say that there is anything wrong with that mouthpiece and many people do use it.
My next idea would be that the tongue is a sensitive muscle in the body and the outside is a thin layer of "skin" which can be broken easily. You should try to make sure the part of the reed you come in contact with is perfectly smooth. it's possible that some sort of splintering is happening or just a cut to a particularly sensitive area.
Take precautions but I would get that looked at as silly as that sounds. The constant blood also can coagulate on the bore of the instrument and cause other issues.
-Dave Davani
http://allclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: valsneff
Date: 2010-12-17 04:41
Sorry, I realize now how confusing my wording was. I mean that on the top of the tounge, it is slightly back from the tip. It's not on the underside. And I would bet it probably has something to do with my technique, or just needing to do a little more work on new reeds so they aren't so rough. I had a dentist appointment today, and my dentist told me that I didn't have a proble, so it must stem from that. Thanks for your help!
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