 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-11-02 21:57
We are doing arrangements of Leonore Overture and Beethoven 3rd Symphony, doing that one in Carnegie Hall in two weeks, arranged by Mahler to commemorate his 100th Birth Year. Today we rehearsed the overture, all his arrangement does in the wind parts is double a few loud parts, it that really an arrangement? It's the same thing for the 3rd symphony, we just double the loud stuff but he adds an Eb clarinet, making 5 clarinets. I hope it doesn't double the horn solos in the scherzo. I can't understand how an arrangement is just doubling the wind parts, we used to do that all the time years ago but no one took credit for "arranging" it. When we used to work with Stokowski many years ago he would "arrange" the doubling parts too but he would write in some of the string parts in our parts to double them in certain passages, made our doubling parts a bit more interesting instead of just playing the loud parts. He would even have us double some of the softer passages for tone color. Can't wait to rehearse the 3rd and hear what Mahler does with the Eb clarinet. We do that on Saturday for the first time. Beethoven and Eb clarinet, I don't know about that. Even Stoky didn't do that. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2010-11-03 02:17
Very interesting, Ed. I've never heard either of these Mahler arrangements, but several years ago, the Detroit Symphony performed his version of Beethoven's ninth. PBS recorded it, and I saw it a few times on TV, but I don't think it's been shown recently.
Mahler felt that the ninth, because of Beethoven's deafness and limitations of orchestras in his day, really needed additional instruments and a little rescoring for it to reach its full potential. I remember four clarinets (I'm not sure about a bass), eight horns, and a tuba. I think he also doubled the other woodwinds.
After you rehearse it, please let us know how it went.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-11-03 23:56
David, Tony might have been right but what a sound he got out of the orchestra, he was a real master of orchestration. He's Bach arrangements for full orchestra are still amongst my favorite transcriptions, especially the Passacaglia and Fugue. This Beethoven dOverture does not sound any different then the original except for maybe a few octaves jumps here and there. He doesn't even ask us to double all the loud parts. There are some FFF that we are just sitting there doing nothing. It makes no sense. I'll let you know what the 3rd sounds once we run it on Saturday. Can't wait to hear the Eb in Beethoven 3rd. ESP
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: AJN
Date: 2010-11-04 05:10
" ... in today's (80's) standards, Stoki would be have been considered to be a charlatan."
This may come as news, but there were those who considered him a charlatan in the 50's!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: DAVE
Date: 2010-11-05 03:42
I used to have some recordings of these works. I really enjoyed hearing what Mahler did with these. He did much more than just double the clarinets. All the winds are augmented and the music, IMO, is more clear and definitely has Mahler's touch.
After you get to play it, I'm curious to hear your impressions if you wouldn't mind sharing.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: diz
Date: 2010-11-05 04:08
Mahler was obviously unaware of the change in instruments in the prevailing 100 years, eh?
Without music, the world would be grey, very grey.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-11-06 19:54
Well we rehearsed Beethoven's 3rd today, the Mahler arrangement, very strange. It is copyrighted 2010 so we may be the first, and hopefully the last, to perform it. We were told that Mahler admired Beethoven a great deal, more than any other past composer but he felt his orchestra music needed to be "updated" for the modern orchestra, so hence woodwind doubling and Eb clarinet, very strange. The music is basically the same with a good many "comas" to put short breaks in some phrases, an additional tutti passage near the end and we do "bells up" in Beethoven. That way we can not only play loud but unfocused and maybe even out of tune too but that's a topic that's already been argued over on this board. The strange thing about how he doubles is that we often do not play a great many f, ff or even fff passages. The whole orchestra is blasting away, including the Eb clarinet in my right ear, and the doubler's are just sitting there doing nothing. He's very selective with where and what we double and there's not a heck of a lot that we do double. The Eb is often playing with the high strings or flute in the loud passages, no solos, while we just sit there counting our parts. Some times he even has only the first or only the second double a few measures. The whole thing is very strange. If he admired Beethoven so much he should have just left his music alone, it works pretty well I think. Anyway, we play it next week twice in Baltimore and then go the NY and play it at Carnagie Hall on the 13th. At least we are also doing the Barber 2nd Essay so I have a nice Bass clarinet solo in the beginning of it. Anyone coming to the concert in NY, stop by outside after the concert and say hello. ESP
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
Post Edited (2010-11-06 19:55)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: graham
Date: 2010-11-08 14:59
http://www.classicalsource.com/db_control/db_concert_review.php?id=8651
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
